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  1. Incels?

    Body fat or weight?
  2. Incels?

    We have all gotten past understanding that no matter who you are, Auschwitz will make you skinny. I am talking about the diet in practical terms. I am not denying the most basic science of it. I am saying a simple CICO diet, practically applied by every american, is not going to always see success. Because "less in, more out" isnt enough. Remember, the original argument was that "fat is all calories in, calories out" that I argued against, saying it was more complicated than that. Not so much weight, but FAT. And it has morphed into some quasi hostile argument involving "fatties" and Auschwitz inmates and people dying on hills.
  3. Incels?

    Yeahhhhh..... but kinda not really.
  4. Incels?

    I posted numerous articles.
  5. Incels?

    Are all calories the same?
  6. Incels?

    Then CICO isnt simply "less in, more out." Correct? It is "less in, more out, right foods, correct number of calories, weighing portions, calculating TDEE, etc etc etc." The fact that you have to qualify your claim with the bolded is kinda making my point. But thanks for keeping me company on this hill. Oh... you dont say? You mean... "less in, more out" isnt enough??? That wont work for everyone??? You need more than that??? If only someone out there supported your stance. If only there was at least one other guy in the world "less in, more out" isnt going to work for everyone. And I havent mentioned genetics once. I am not making excuses for anyone. I am not defending anyone. I am simply pointing out the ridiculously reductive argument that "less in, more out" is the cure for obesity. When, as you have readily agreed, a lot more goes into it than that. I have a feeling you are projecting other arguments you have had into this one. Let go of those other arguments and hear what I am saying. It isnt complicated unless you make it complicated. I have already told you what I am talking about. A simple CICO diet. Emphasis on simple. As in "less in, more out." Without having a PT guide you. Or a half semester of night classes to learn the science of it all. Or running around with a food scale, an iPhone app, and a fitbit to track the calories you burned. SIMPLE! I have said that MULTIPLE times before you even entered the conversation. I think I even said it AFTER you entered the conversation. So what, exactly, is holding you back from understanding what I am saying? English seems to be your first language. I have done everything short of a powerpoint presentation with eye popping colors and big letters to make my point. But you still seem to be struggling. And if they have never heard of LBMs and BMRs? Too lazy to know things? You have to know what you are looking for in order to find it. This magical place we call the internet isnt a personal manager. It isnt going to look at you and say, "Hey, youre kinda fat. Ever hear of BMR and LBM and TDEE?" Ignorance and laziness are not interchangeable. You're overcompensating. Dial it back. And "the principles" are what I am talking about. "Less in, more out." When you start talking about BMRs, LBMs, when you start using scales, and macronutrient calculators, you have gone beyond the principles. Oh, well I had no idea it worked "literally every time" you have seen it applied "correctly." I had no idea it was simply a matter of reducing the argument to the people you have seen do it correctly. Were your Auschwitz buddies applying it correctly? Because that was just as super sound an argument. Skal right back at ya, friend!
  7. Incels?

    What is THE definition of CICO? Since it clearly has one meaning and one application, what is it?
  8. Incels?

    I have been discussing simple CICO this entire time. I am not discussing a program where you go about making sure you are eating the right foods, taking in the correct number of calories, and burning the correct number of calories. I am talking about the notion that "if you simply take in less than you put out, you will eventually be skinny." And outside of your extreme example, that simply isnt true. What is a simple CICO diet? It's what people have done for the last 100 years to lose weight. They cut down on how much they are eating. Boom... CICO. And some people see success. Others dont. Why? Because it isnt that simple. As you are pointing out, it requires a lot more than saying, "Hey, if I just cut what I am eating by half, I will lose weight." Once you start talking about weighing food, or body calculators, macronutrient calculators, TDEEs, etc etc, you aren't talking about what I am talking about. Because the discussion is about "being fat is about being lazy and undisciplined because all you need to do is take in less than you put out." When you start talking about LBMs and BMRs you arent talking about laziness. You are talking about ignorance. A lot of fat people simply dont know about any of this. They think "CICO is all it takes. Take in less than you put out and VOILA! Success!!!" And when it doesn't happen...
  9. Incels?

    I'm not arguing that CICO doesn't work. I am arguing it doesnt work for everyone. That it is a gross oversimplification to say, "People who are fat want to be fat because being skinny is simply a matter of CICO." But sure, I suppose you could always go on the Auschwitz diet. You will definitely lose fat. And muscle. And the ability to fight off infection. And your ability to control bodily functions. But I heard Marasmus is the new black. Very vogue.
  10. Incels?

    Human biology is far more complex than simple CICO. And to suggest that simple CICO would/should/will work for everyone is ludicris. I won't even get into the complex psychology of the issue. That some people simply have better willpower than others. What depression can do to the body and the metabolism. Or anxiety. Then there is the question of physical limitations. Chronic pain? Chronic injuries? Add in the possible side effects of the medications necessary to manage any of the issues I just mentioned. On and on.
  11. Incels?

    http://www.caloriegate.com/calories-in-calories-out/11-experts-demolish-the-calories-in-calories-out-cico-model-of-obesity
  12. Incels?

    https://rebootedbody.com/calories/
  13. Incels?

    Dude... the article is based on decades of research. It is telling you that you are grossly oversimplifying the equation. CICO is not science. It is simple math for a complex algebraic equation.
  14. Incels?

    https://www.healthline.com/nutrition/debunking-the-calorie-myth Have you ever been grossly overweight?
  15. Incels?

    I'm certainly not suggesting that everyone who grew up playing video games and fapping to internet porn turned into an incel. I am saying the ones who only played video games and fapped to internet porn turned into incels. Most kids balance that video games and internet porn with a healthy dose of real life. They still get out and do things. They still chase girls in an effort to have a real relationship. It's the ones who don't venture out that end up the incels. It's just too easy for kids to turtle up nowadays. And if they do, and they arent out there getting the interaction AFTER SCHOOL, like hanging out with friends, looking for girls to talk to, going to parties, then they aren't emotionally equipped to deal with normal human interaction. Which gets them a negative reaction from women. Which they can't handle because they didn't experience that type of rejection, how to deal with it, and how to learn from it, at 14 years old like the rest of us normal people. That family member I am talking about got the suggestion to hit the gym from a number of women. And he didn't like that suggestion. Didn't listen to it. Won't do it. And this is women his age giving him suggestions as to how to fix his problem. These are the ones he is supposed to be listening to. The ones telling him why he is so lonely. And he is like, "Effort???" It's like he expects the women of the world to change, not him. The women of the world should just suddenly find broke, overweight 27 year old men that still live at home and have absolutely no game attractive. The cognitive dissonance just astounds me. It's like, Dude! Do you not understand how any of this works???
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