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  1. Vikings Sign Josh Kline

    Yeah they did see below Very true, and sure people do not have the time to watch a lot of football players but PFF is not the bible and grades are dependent on what a player is asked to do and what system they are in. Tennessee is turning into a power run team because of the QB limitations, they do not pass the ball as often thus the OL is not asked to protect as often. Oh and that QB is a fine athlete so that helps the OL look good as well. Kind of like Drew Brees who is amazing in the pocket, really knows how to get the ball out and on time and accurately, so yeah they do not give up a ton of sacks because of the system they are in thus a ton of the OL are highly 'graded' by PFF. Many rightly so but some yeah it is the system and what is asked of them that grades them out highly. Sometimes it is right on I am sure, other times it is not but clearly people are getting on me about Sweezy because of a grade that was given to him compared to Kline as proof Kline is a great 'high level' player. Yeah, and no I am not a JR Sweezy fan but looking at the list of players I originally brought up he was an example. But yeah give me DJ Fluker all day or Mike Iupati but clearly the Vikings are going in a different direction, not to mention my original point they are cheaper, oh and AJ Cann who is a quality player as well and Max Garcia who has some big time upside but injuries have hurt his progression as a player big time along with others I already listed. I agree others have options and that is the point to discuss. But at least the players I like there are reasons I like them that are not an outside source telling me to like them based on a numerical grade. Maybe that is not what is going down here but I feel it is exactly what is going down here. So if anyone can provide a real reason why Josh Kline is this fine high level player please do so, maybe I should go ask a Titans fan about him and see what they say.
  2. Vikings Sign Josh Kline

    YEah I watched Sweezy in college and have watched his development so far in the NFL. Kline not as much but do not get to follow much Kent State football but there is a reason he was a UDFA obviously. I question where this love of Josh Kline is coming from unless some here just blatantly accept anyone and everyone the Vikings sign as a great pickup. Sure rip on Sweezy I do not really care, but Kline deserves just as much critique as Sweezy does. But no lock him up for a future star guard and high level player, whatever. Sweezy has started more than Kline in the NFL and more consistently has, but no grade everything on PFF or whatever source people are gaining this from, a some what one sided number and run with it. Let me guess Kline has a better "grade' than Sweezy this past year or whatever so people consider him a superior player? Great if the NFL was ran like a fantasy football team that is awesome, great sign for the Vikings, wait you paid him $15 million over three years. Maybe it will work out, maybe it will not but would be nice if people commented on players based on watching them play instead of a grade they see on the internet someone else gave.
  3. Vikings Sign Josh Kline

    My confusion stems from where is your proof Kline is a "good" to "high level" player? What PFF? That is your proof? How often have you actually watched him play? You watch him in college? Who is to say Kline has ever been that good? Since he was a starter that makes him good? I say again make any All Pro or Pro bowl teams? Of course not... The difference between $5.2 million dollars a year to $1.5 to max $3.5 million a year is a lot in my mind. Thus cheaper and not all that much worse OG who is a better run blocker arguably which what I believe to be more upside. Maybe Kline will become this 'good' to 'high level' guard you call him, I just doubt it.
  4. Vikings Sign Josh Kline

    How many All Pro or Pro Bowl teams has Kline made? None. To me that is a high level, and Kline is not that and probably never will be that. Would be great if he is just some awesome player for the Vikings but there is a reason the Titans released him I assume and signed Saffold instead at OG. Sure that might be the case will see. Would be nice to have a OL that can protect because obviously our QB is not the best at throwing on the move or getting away from pressure so it makes having an above average OL more important than a team with a QB who can move around a little bit. As long as the Vikings can run the ball that will help but again the OL was a big reason why that did not happen much last season, that and the offensive system that they started the season out with as well.
  5. Vikings Sign Josh Kline

    Maybe but if that is the case Josh Kline is only 29 and is probably hit his peak already and might be on the way down at a position he has played his entire life. Unlike Sweezy who is at a position he has played for only seven years so far. Again was a DL in college and linebacker in high school. Once more it is a pathetic state of the Vikings OL when one is debating the difference is such average football players in terms of their potential on the OL.
  6. Vikings Sign Josh Kline

    Football is not all about fantasy football type grading on PFF, those are sometimes not always accurate or reflective of potential long term or upside. Sweezy was a former DL on NC State, transitioned to OL and again I feel is more athletic with more upside than Kline and is way cheaper.
  7. Vikings Sign Josh Kline

    Will see but honestly this is where the Vikings are in terms of their offensive line and it is sad. We are arguing and debating over the qualifications of a clearly below average NFL starter compared to other average to below average NFL starters on the OL. In terms of the list give me Sweezy over Kline all day long, he is a better athlete with more power and potential. The rest sure at debatable but many can and do play tackle something Kline could not do. That is only the players who get paid less, many others we missed out on who are on a higher pay grade.
  8. Vikings Sign Josh Kline

    Maybe, but that is just an example of a player and some said maybe those starts were not that meaningful in his regard. And of course coaches cannot always bring guys in they used to have, sometimes that happens but at the time the Vikings were making so little moves I tried to connect some dot to their lack of activity in terms of free agents on the OL. Now I showed the guys they missed on and could have apparently got for less money than Kline, who are arguably better more talented players long term than he is. But I find it more impressive what Mills has done in his career compared to Kline. Will see if Kline can actually produce or is he another waste of money as a free agent OL signing similar to Mike Remmers.
  9. Vikings Sign Josh Kline

    It was probably because he has 'starting' experience. But like I have brought up before Jordan Mills started 82 ot 87 games played in the NFL and would have more if he did not get hurt and has more upside and potential. Not to mention he has connections with Dennison at Buffalo. Kline has started 64 of 79 games played in the NFL and a lot recently. Still not totally sold on him and in terms of a scheme fit maybe but he does not come off to me as this great athlete at guard who can pull and really move, will see. Would be nice if the Vikings do not go full out all athletic finesse OL and do have some power, but not even sure Kline is that type of guy either.
  10. Vikings Sign Josh Kline

    Kline got a $4 million signing bonus and $7.25 of it is guaranteed. I mean he was released by the Titans because of poor play I am sure and the Vikings sign him and give him a raise compared to what he was getting paid? Still no clue why they went after him instead of some other guys out there that went for less money. Kline got $2.5 million last year and now gets what around $5 a year for three seasons potentially? Sucky thing apparently they offered on contract to freaking Brett Jones as well who made $2.9 million last year and barely played. That is not final though and still might not happen hopefully. Kline and Jones do not strike me as very athletic blockers in a zone system but they are also not really big time power guys either. Maybe they will be really solid but so far I do not feel either one has been in their career. Not sure they have this outstanding potential or upside either. Still to me OL is the biggest need for the Vikings come darft time even with this freaking signing. Get Risner, Jonah, Lindstrom or Bradbury in here so they can at least have a lineman who has potential and talent.... To Rudolph's credit he did play much better late in the season, I just think that offensive system was bad for him early on. That or Kirk cannot figure out how to throw to one of the better TEs in football. I am fine keeping Rudolph but do feel that getting Kline he was very over paid just like Remmers was a few years back but again at least Remmers could play a few positions and had ability at tackle and some upside. Sure that never materialized but to me as a prospect free agent Remmers out of Carolina was more talented and had more potential than getting Kline out of Tennessee and that is not a good thing.
  11. Vikings Sign Josh Kline

    Later in that video he looked pretty bad, so he is getting around $5 million a year and is possibly worse than Mike Remmers, at least Remmers could play tackle Kline cannot. Here are the OL who the Vikings could have signed that are cheaper than Josh Kline in terms of contracts in order from closest to his paid grade to farthest away. AJ Cann OG Spencer Long C Ty Nsekhe OT JR Sweezy OG Cameron Fleming OT DJ Fluker OG Daryl Williams OT Ereck Flowers OT Mike Iupati OG LaAdrian Waddle OT Max Garcia Ted Larsen Pretty freaking nuts we could have got Cann but more importantly Sweezy, Fluker or Iupati, sure some were one year deals but that makes it even worse, we got Kline for 3 years. Will see if he turns out but I feel the Vikings just waited too long and he was the best they could get after all the other good ones were gone. Sure these guys are not top of the line but many I would take over Kline. Fluker and Iupati both are one Seattle so playing style and blocking style had something to do with it. Sucks though, I think they could have done better, hope he is not another Brett Jones type who was a starter but not really in the grand scheme of things is not.
  12. Free ain't free in the NFL...

    If I was in a job that was performance based yeah I would do that. Give me less pay but make my job easier and more productive in terms of goal accomplishment by hiring other good quality help and coworkers which would potentially create greater productivity, results and longevity etc. Yeah give me that over getting paid max amount. Not to mention in pro sports which is in many ways the pinnacle of performance based jobs where the point is winning not getting your max pay amount possible. If that is the case and you just want to get paid, few will remember you being on bad teams but hey you got paid, please. If one cannot support yourself and your family off the millions of dollars you get paid especially for the top level guys, that is just sad. 5 or 10 Million dollars here or there should not break you as a professional athlete, oh and you do get paid by your jersey sales also, not many buy jerseys of losers. Minnesota was 20th in total offense in 2018, in 2017 they were 11th in total offense. Sure a lot of that has to do with the run game but obviously in terms of year one yeah getting Kirk did not exactly help the team win or produce more offensively. Will see if he can turn it around and that team can turn it around next year with more familiarity. Oh and they were 11th in passing in 2017 and 13th in passing in 2018 with Kirk so even that was not all that improved on even though many assumed it would be. They could have brought back Case and went after a rookie in last years draft or this years draft or did a variety of different things especially with how teams trade picks now a days and players. Took a shot at assumed winning with a big time QB, or what some thought was a big time QB and it kind of backfired on them and they clearly could not even make the playoffs. Ran the ball terribly and maybe it was all a OL problem, will see this season if that is the case or not if they can improve the OL somehow. But there were options out there. All I know is that the Defense did not play the same and the run game was not the same with Kirk as the QB, not sure if guys took it more easy on D and clearly the run game in that different offensive system was a problem as well so play calling was an issue. Maybe it was just that and Kirk with a consistent OC all year will be different, sure better hope that. Back again to the point, did Kirk Cousins signing affect the free agents they could get this year and the years beyond, yeah it did. And once more he is not the quality of QB that is worth that amount of money, or at least I do not think he is. Will see if he can prove it this year and the next .
  13. Free ain't free in the NFL...

    That is fine, think what you want but I feel Kirk is in no way worth that type of money he is getting since he is not even a top 5 QB in the NFL, could argue is not even a top 10 QB in the league potentially either. To say overpaying for Rodgers on the Packers or Ryan on the Falcons has not hurt those organizations, yeah it has and has shown on the field with their lack of success especially last season. Lucky for the Packers and Rams though, those two QBs are elite NFL QBs, Cousins is not on their level at all talent wise. Sure great for Kirk he got paid money and made pathetically that much guaranteed money, does not mean it was a good decision for the team or helps the organization that much.
  14. Free ain't free in the NFL...

    Kirk is about $60 million in 'Dead Cap' hit which is almost three times more than any other player on the team and a $29 million dollar 'cap hit' which is more than two times as much as any other player, 15.07% CAP total. Go ask Tom Brady about taking a pay cut to help the team spend more and become a better team, he did it and they win. Sure it is not all Kirk's fault but being the teams by far highest paid player, yeah it is a little bit his fault obviously. He gets paid well over 2.5 times more than anyone else on the roster.
  15. Sean Mannion I would have not much interest in. Not sure what Bortles signed for but he would have been a much better backup but my guess is Solter is the backup or we draft one and do not sign one because we have no money. If we did have money I would not mind AJ McCarron, Mike Glennon or Kevin Hogan but most likely we just draft a QB in the 6th - 7th rounds. Heck Boykin is interesting but probably not in this system, would be surprised if Boykin is not signed back with Seattle.