vikingsrule Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 11 minutes ago, swede700 said: I'm not burning the kid at the stake today. I'm not even sure I would cut him. At worst, I'd cut him and put him on the practice squad. What he did yesterday was certainly inexcusable, but I'm giving him another chance, because it's still early in his career and the season to see if he can make the necessary corrections. If this were mid-season or nearer to the playoffs, maybe I'd think differently. But there's absolutely no reason to be on all pins and needles at this point. Quickly reacting and cutting him could potentially create a negative environment where everyone's on edge. I hate to use Nordo's example (which he did provide this morning), but what if Adam Vinatieri had been cut by Bill Parcells in his 2nd game of his career when he missed 3 FGs in a loss to Buffalo? Where would he be today? Now I'm not suggesting that he's the 2nd coming of Vinatieri, but he's not necessarily the 2nd coming of Roberto Aguayo either. How many games are you okay losing because of missed kicks? Is it worth the risk hanging onto him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swede700 Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 3 minutes ago, vikingsrule said: How many games are you okay losing because of missed kicks? Is it worth the risk hanging onto him? When they've lost any because of missed kicks, I'll let you know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vikes_Bolts1228 Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 19 minutes ago, swede700 said: When they've lost any because of missed kicks, I'll let you know. He still cost us a win. Don't care if that means it results in a tie or loss. He simply cost us a win. Wins, especially against division rivals named the Green Bay Packer, are hard to come by and needed. A tie may not seem like a big deal NOW but it damn well could when it boils down to win % to determine playoff seeding. The NFC is already going to be a dog fight Do we really want to lose out on home field, the division, or the playoffs because he have a tie rather than a win because our kicker missed 3 FGs that could have won the game? If this happens again, it's a very real chance that it could hurt the team not only on the field, but in the locker room. But if you're fine playing the Blair Walsh "wait & see if he figures it out" game like we did 5 years ago, I guess we sit & hope he becomes an Adam Vinateri and he doesn't cost us any more wins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
byuvike88 Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 When he came out yesterday saying he lost his confidence, I would have 0 confidence in him kicking a game tying/winning field goal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SemperFeist Posted September 17, 2018 Author Share Posted September 17, 2018 1 minute ago, byuvike88 said: When he came out yesterday saying he lost his confidence, I would have 0 confidence in him kicking a game tying/winning field goal This is what would have me on the phone for a new kicker. Mechanical issues can be hammered on and worked through, but mental issues are just unpredictable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VIKINGS101011 Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 cannot have this guy as your kicker for a team that has championship aspirations Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swede700 Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 53 minutes ago, Vikes_Bolts1228 said: He still cost us a win. Don't care if that means it results in a tie or loss. He simply cost us a win. Wins, especially against division rivals named the Green Bay Packer, are hard to come by and needed. A tie may not seem like a big deal NOW but it damn well could when it boils down to win % to determine playoff seeding. The NFC is already going to be a dog fight Do we really want to lose out on home field, the division, or the playoffs because he have a tie rather than a win because our kicker missed 3 FGs that could have won the game? If this happens again, it's a very real chance that it could hurt the team not only on the field, but in the locker room. But if you're fine playing the Blair Walsh "wait & see if he figures it out" game like we did 5 years ago, I guess we sit & hope he becomes an Adam Vinateri and he doesn't cost us any more wins. True...but I did say I'd give him one more chance. This isn't a Blair Walsh situation...who by the time he was having his issues had already proven that he could do it...and even then, it's only been 2 weeks...not 10 like happened with Walsh...who was only cut 2 years ago btw, not 5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SemperFeist Posted September 17, 2018 Author Share Posted September 17, 2018 The more time that passes, the more I’m in agreement with @swede700. Young players make mistakes. You knew going into the season that there were bound to be some ups and Downs with a young kicker, and this line of thinking even includes Treadwell. Bad games happen. Let’s see how they respond. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vikes_Bolts1228 Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 6 minutes ago, swede700 said: True...but I did say I'd give him one more chance. This isn't a Blair Walsh situation...who by the time he was having his issues had already proven that he could do it...and even then, it's only been 2 weeks...not 10 like happened with Walsh...who was only cut 2 years ago btw, not 5. What if you give him "one more chance", he kicks well against Buffalo (at home with a roof), then craps the bed against the Rams or Philly is games that will already be difficult to win? Then you're just a week and a loss behind where you should have been this week and going out for a new kicker. When a kicker says "I have no confidence" do you really want him on the roster? Even if he does turn it around and goes 4-4 on his next 4 tries, who's to say him missing again doesn't shoot his confidence again? It comes down to if you think he can overcome this. Do you let him try and work it out and risk him costing us another game? Or do you get a Kai Forbath or Dan Bailey who you know makes at least 2 of those kicks especially the OT GW? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swede700 Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 Yeah, that's all I'm saying. If he f's it up again next week or vs. the Rams/Eagles, then he's gone, no question. But, I'm not going to go knee-jerk and cut him at his first sign of adversity...even if this is a team with Super Bowl aspirations. The Super Bowl ain't this week. Hell, we're only 2 weeks in. There are teams that started 0-4 and still made the playoffs...this team is still in good shape regardless. You can't worry about it's impact on seeding 2 games in. Take care of business the rest of the way, it'll have no impact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SemperFeist Posted September 17, 2018 Author Share Posted September 17, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SemperFeist Posted September 17, 2018 Author Share Posted September 17, 2018 7 minutes ago, Vikes_Bolts1228 said: What if you give him "one more chance", he kicks well against Buffalo (at home with a roof), then craps the bed against the Rams or Philly is games that will already be difficult to win? Then you're just a week and a loss behind where you should have been this week and going out for a new kicker. When a kicker says "I have no confidence" do you really want him on the roster? Even if he does turn it around and goes 4-4 on his next 4 tries, who's to say him missing again doesn't shoot his confidence again? It comes down to if you think he can overcome this. Do you let him try and work it out and risk him costing us another game? Or do you get a Kai Forbath or Dan Bailey who you know makes at least 2 of those kicks especially the OT GW? What do you do if Forbath or Bailey crap the bed in one of those games? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klomp Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 4 minutes ago, SemperFeist said: What do you do if Forbath or Bailey crap the bed in one of those games? Have to cut them. Perfection is required. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swede700 Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 6 minutes ago, Vikes_Bolts1228 said: What if you give him "one more chance", he kicks well against Buffalo (at home with a roof), then craps the bed against the Rams or Philly is games that will already be difficult to win? Then you're just a week and a loss behind where you should have been this week and going out for a new kicker. When a kicker says "I have no confidence" do you really want him on the roster? Do you think your employer should fire you a handful of weeks into your job just because you made mistakes and you spitballed that maybe it had to do with a lack of confidence? I'm not as concerned with his words in an emotional moment after the game or take them all that seriously considering his age and experience. What I'm more concerned is where he goes from here. If he can't make the adjustments beginning this week and get over it, then he's done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vikes_Bolts1228 Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 Say he does kick well during the Buffalo & LA games and craps the bed against at Philly in 3 weeks.... What if you go to cut ties and the likes of Dan Bailey & Forbath have been signed and you're looking at a bare cabinet in the kicker FA market? Remember when Robbie Gould was sitting right in front of us and we decided to hold on to Blair? Blair is out of the league and Gould has hit 55 of his last 57 attempts (97%) between NYG and SF. He's also 92% on PATs after being cut by Chicago. All while kicking outdoors at least 8 games a season. Just another thing to consider. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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