sherm Posted October 14, 2018 Share Posted October 14, 2018 37 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said: Watched some of him and he looks like the real deal. Definitely looks to be a 1st rounder. Haven't watched Sweat, but Allen/Bosa/Polite/Ferrell are first rounders along with likely Sweat. Then you have Gray from Michigan who is getting solid hype but not sure if he is a pure edge or not. Yeah it's a good yr to need a pass rusher. Michigan fan and I've never gotten Gray hype. He shows just enough to keep the hype up but never dominate to me. Besides he's not an edge guy despite playing DE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sherm Posted October 14, 2018 Share Posted October 14, 2018 47 minutes ago, Forge said: Don't forget Winovich at Michigan either. Not sure that he's a first rounder, but I think he could be an early second. This pass rush class is so stacked it's sick. And this is before you even count the legit interior rushers in this draft class. Not sure what to make of Winovich. Can his gm translate to the NFL or is he just a Sr with a high motor out hustling inexperience college OL. My guess is 2nd-3rd rd guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John232 Posted October 14, 2018 Share Posted October 14, 2018 6 minutes ago, sherm said: Not sure what to make of Winovich. Can his gm translate to the NFL or is he just a Sr with a high motor out hustling inexperience college OL. My guess is 2nd-3rd rd guy. Combine is going to be big for him. Motor and Athleticism sometimes get confused. To me, it looks like he has legit burst up the field. My issue with him is I don't think he has a great frame or body (Not sure on his wingspan, doesn't looks great), he is smaller and he doesn't try to plan a course of attack. He does show some bend and he can get under peoples pads and muscle them. If he shows out with good numbers at the combine, he's going to be a first or second round guy. He might be suited more for a 3-4 OLB or a SAM exclusively, which isn't bad. Mostly because he looks very good against the run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geek Posted October 14, 2018 Share Posted October 14, 2018 4 hours ago, Forge said: Yeah, the age and transfer bug me a little. I don't like older prospects, and transfers just bug me sometimes. The thing I like about Sweat is that he does check the on the field boxes for me - he's got good bend and athleticism, good production to match, and he's a try hard guy. He plays the run as hard as he plays the pass, he's just not great at it. But he tries. He also has a promising frame to add more weight at the next level to hold up. That being said, I have concerns. I don't like how he seems to be neutralized in some games. I think he's too easy to take out of a play. A couple of other concerns. I think he's a solid first round pick, just not at the top of the first like someone like Bosa. FWIW Sweat looks pretty long too. There are some rumors he's going to come into the combine with 35.5-inch arms. From what I've seen so far I'd have no problem taking Sweat or Polite in the top 10. If Bosa is out of our range a trade back then grabbing one of those guys would be optimal if possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John232 Posted October 14, 2018 Share Posted October 14, 2018 As much as I'm not super high Ferrell..I'd feel more comfortable with him in the top 10. I haven't watched enough of Polite or Sweat yet, but Outside of Bosa, Ferrell seem's like the most developed pass rusher. He's pretty consistent in making an impact in that area, game to game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John232 Posted October 14, 2018 Share Posted October 14, 2018 (edited) Watching some Sweat film from 2017. really hope he's looked a lot better this year because so far I'm not super impressed by him. Edited October 14, 2018 by John232 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John232 Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 Going to try and watch some more film on Sweat, Burns and Allen today. Some peoples whose opinions I respect a lot on D-lineman have Burns really high. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 10 minutes ago, John232 said: Watching some Sweat film from 2017. really hope he's looked a lot better this year because so far I'm not super impressed by him. Not sure which games you are watching, so I can't say. LIS earlier, there are games where I feel like he is too easily neutralized, and that bugs me, but he was largely a really consistent producer last year, but he started way slow during the season (first four games were very blah, and that includes matchups against LSU and Georgia, which were high profile games, though he did have a nice play against the Bulldogs in run defense). But once he got going, he was just a machine living in the backfield (except maybe the alabama game), but that also kind of coincided with a weak part of his schedule, you know? He checks all the boxes with productions, size, athleticism. Even has a nice array of pass rushing moves and I actually like his mental acuity in play recognition and defensive responsibility (you don't see him break his job). I Just wish that he wouldn't disappear sometimes. Its weird because I feel like he's pretty good all across the board, but I wonder if he's not good enough at any thing to catch on big at the next level, if that makes sense? Like, does he rack up the production just because he's a high motor try hard guy that doesn't quit all that often and the play just kind of runs into him? He did pretty well against Dalton Risner this year (a legit day 2 tackle prospect from KSU). Risner pretty much controlled the run game, of course, but in the pass game, Sweat had some nice wins and kept risner off balance. Risner really did a nice job of landing some last chance chips when he was beat to keep Sweat from getting the sack (ironically, the sack that Sweat got in the game was play where he probably didn't win the battle with Risner). He does have this funny little inside out juke move that has worked for him in college that I really wonder whether or not it will work at the next level. It's funny to watch when you see him do it and beat a tackle to the inside though. It has been a successful move for him so far. The thing is, and I said this a few weeks back, I want to see him succeed against the big guys in the meat of the SEC schedule. Last year against Georgia, LSU and Alabama, he didn't do much. He starts this season well enough, and while he made some nice plays the last couple of weeks and been around the ball, he hasn't done a whole ton, and that bugs me (Florida, where he was matched up with Taylor, and Auburn). You have to play big with the big boys. I like that he got some wins against Risner (similar to how I dislike how Burns was largely stonewalled by Sharping) but it's not fully enough. That's why he's not a top of the first round guy for me. Definitely a first rounder...not seeing top 10 yet though and I'm staring to see mock drafts creep him into that area. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 23 minutes ago, John232 said: Going to try and watch some more film on Sweat, Burns and Allen today. Some peoples whose opinions I respect a lot on D-lineman have Burns really high. You'll like Allen. He's a beast and very well rounded in my opinion. Burns I've sort of largely been meh on, but he's putting together a really nice season and he just destroyed Miami. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 1 hour ago, John232 said: Combine is going to be big for him. Motor and Athleticism sometimes get confused. To me, it looks like he has legit burst up the field. My issue with him is I don't think he has a great frame or body (Not sure on his wingspan, doesn't looks great), he is smaller and he doesn't try to plan a course of attack. He does show some bend and he can get under peoples pads and muscle them. If he shows out with good numbers at the combine, he's going to be a first or second round guy. He might be suited more for a 3-4 OLB or a SAM exclusively, which isn't bad. Mostly because he looks very good against the run. I kind of like the idea of Winovich at SAM. Hadn't really considered that before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John232 Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 16 minutes ago, Forge said: You'll like Allen. He's a beast and very well rounded in my opinion. Burns I've sort of largely been meh on, but he's putting together a really nice season and he just destroyed Miami. First thing I've noticed with both Sweat and Burns, their 2018 tape vs 2017 tape shows marked improvements by both. Burns especially. I can see the hype on him. Watched some Allen tape, he's incredibly well rounded. He might be a sneaky pick for the second edge guy off the board. Just based on his ability to drop into coverage and attack the flats. He's not a refined pass-rusher from what i've seen, but like Winovich, he too shows the ability to get low and muscle guys. Whether it be with a bend or rip. If we're talking bendy guys though, that might be Polite and Walker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 Just now, John232 said: First thing I've noticed with both Sweat and Burns, their 2018 tape vs 2017 tape shows marked improvements by both. Burns especially. I can see the hype on him. Watched some Allen tape, he's incredibly well rounded. He might be a sneaky pick for the second edge guy off the board. Just based on his ability to drop into coverage and attack the flats. He's not a refined pass-rusher from what i've seen, but like Winovich, he too shows the ability to get low and muscle guys. Whether it be with a bend or rip. If we're talking bendy guys though, that might be Polite and Walker. My question about Allen is whether he ends up getting the Anthony Barr treatment and ends up as a 4-3 OLB rather than a true pass rusher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John232 Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 This is such an awesome draft for edge prospects. Ton of variety in prospects. Tier unto his own: Bosa Tall, long guys: Ferrell, Sweat, Burns. Short but powerful Benders: Polite, Walker Zuniga well rounded hybrids: Allen, Winovich. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John232 Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 4 minutes ago, Forge said: My question about Allen is whether he ends up getting the Anthony Barr treatment and ends up as a 4-3 OLB rather than a true pass rusher. He might. I think he would be a good 4-3 OLB in a scheme like our's. Again. another very good SAM prospect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John232 Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 27 minutes ago, Forge said: The thing is, and I said this a few weeks back, I want to see him succeed against the big guys in the meat of the SEC schedule. Last year against Georgia, LSU and Alabama, he didn't do much. He starts this season well enough, and while he made some nice plays the last couple of weeks and been around the ball, he hasn't done a whole ton, and that bugs me (Florida, where he was matched up with Taylor, and Auburn). You have to play big with the big boys. I like that he got some wins against Risner (similar to how I dislike how Burns was largely stonewalled by Sharping) but it's not fully enough. That's why he's not a top of the first round guy for me. Definitely a first rounder...not seeing top 10 yet though and I'm staring to see mock drafts creep him into that area. I watched Alabama last year and he got handled pretty well. Not embarrassing, but not encouraging. That said, that was last year. Every single edge guy that was getting pegged last year as a top prospect has seemingly improved. Polite being the biggest leaper. If teams feel like he can play every down, he may end up being top 15. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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