GW21 Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 Oliver never should have been talked about outside of the top-10. I’ve been speculating that he would be one of the steals of the draft all off-season and with all the QW->Donald comparisons, I thought Oliver compared more favorably with his athletic profile/style of play. I’m sure these numbers will help him ‘rise’ back to where he should have been all along, but as @oldman9er said, he was probably not ever going to be drafted as low as the ‘experts’ had him going in their mocks. I know I would much rather take Oliver over some of the guys we’ve been linked to, Gary especially. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
757-NINER Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 The thing with Oliver that always concerned me was his playing weight. He looked like a DE playing inside. He was definitely strong enough to be highly effective inside in college but I worry what his true pro position is...inside or out on the end? His pro-day agility numbers indicate he could definitely hold up athletically as a edge player. But then you get to a place where you're projecting him to a position as a top 10 talent, that he really has never played at exclusively. Or do you trust that a 270 lbs 3-Tech can hack it inside, down after down, year after year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N4L Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 1 hour ago, 757-NINER said: The thing with Oliver that always concerned me was his playing weight. He looked like a DE playing inside. He was definitely strong enough to be highly effective inside in college but I worry what his true pro position is...inside or out on the end? His pro-day agility numbers indicate he could definitely hold up athletically as a edge player. But then you get to a place where you're projecting him to a position as a top 10 talent, that he really has never played at exclusively. Or do you trust that a 270 lbs 3-Tech can hack it inside, down after down, year after year? Offensive linemen have gotten smaller. The entire game has gotten faster. You need linemen who can move. The guy understands leverage and has a thick frame. His legs hips chest and arms are all thick. I don't look at him and think he's 'small' when he's in pads. He may not be heavy, but who said you had to be heavy to be durable? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldman9er Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 6 hours ago, N4L said: Offensive linemen have gotten smaller. The entire game has gotten faster. You need linemen who can move. The guy understands leverage and has a thick frame. His legs hips chest and arms are all thick. I don't look at him and think he's 'small' when he's in pads. He may not be heavy, but who said you had to be heavy to be durable? .. and the thing (been harping on in recent months) about guys like Oliver, Bosa, and Ferrell... they can move well enough on the edge, but can also power through the blocker. I don't care much about 40 times for DL, if they have quick short area burst and can win in a variety of ways. Also would say that @757-NINER brings up a great point, and the question has to be thoroughly considered. All the athletic traits aside... it's a bit iffy in projecting Oliver as a future, excellent edge guy and selecting him inside the top 10.. much less top 5. Imagine what may happen when... instead of getting easily doubled up on at the 0 or 1 tech.. not only Ed Oliver attacks from the edge as LEO, but does so next to Buck. Teams already struggle to throw extra attention vs Buck in this scheme. Oliver will be 1 vs 1 for the majority. It's fun to think about. Still... # 2 overall? that's sure taking a big swing.. all the more if Bosa's sitting there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NcFinest9erFan Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 Pro Football Focus's Steve Palazzolo notes that Houston DT Ed Oliver's pass rush abilities were held back because of the scheme the Cougars ran. The biggest issue for Oliver (6'1/287) was that he was often asked to rush the passer as a nose tackle -- or zero-technique -- defender. "This alignment can result in one-on-one opportunities against overmatched centers, but given the nature of Houston’s three-man line and high percentage of three-man rushes, Oliver was constantly battling against a center and at least one guard," Palazzolo writes. When rushing as a nose, Oliver had a grade of 74.8 as a pass rusher. When playing a more traditional gap role, that grade improves to 82.8. Oliver won't be asked to play in the nose very often -- if at all -- in the NFL, so his "struggles" as a pass rusher may be overstated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrissooner49er Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 Oliver at DE or Leo?! Naw, I don't think it works. Sure, he has the quicks and probably the power, but what about the reach? I believe it's 31" arms? OTs will keep him at bay with their longer arms at times...dunno. I Bosa's only got 33" arms, but that is an improvement and he has the experience at the spot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JIllg Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 4 hours ago, NcFinest9erFan said: Pro Football Focus's Steve Palazzolo notes that Houston DT Ed Oliver's pass rush abilities were held back because of the scheme the Cougars ran. The biggest issue for Oliver (6'1/287) was that he was often asked to rush the passer as a nose tackle -- or zero-technique -- defender. "This alignment can result in one-on-one opportunities against overmatched centers, but given the nature of Houston’s three-man line and high percentage of three-man rushes, Oliver was constantly battling against a center and at least one guard," Palazzolo writes. When rushing as a nose, Oliver had a grade of 74.8 as a pass rusher. When playing a more traditional gap role, that grade improves to 82.8. Oliver won't be asked to play in the nose very often -- if at all -- in the NFL, so his "struggles" as a pass rusher may be overstated. And these things are true. That 82.8 is good, but still not elite and their lineman grades (especially when pared down by the situations the rushes occurred in) are about the best things they do because once you take out stunts and such you get right to who beats their people the most often. Other grades - receivers, cover guys, even qbs often require subjective educated guesses at who was wrong (see all of the adjustments to coverages where both players have to decide together on how to approach it subtly differently at the same time). PFF do leave N/A for stuff where they can't decipher who screwed up, but I think they are way too overaggressive at making decisions on this front. Their pass rush grades are also the most cleanly correlated to NFL success. I haven't seen the obscene hand use from Oliver to double swim multiple opponents like Quinnen can (and Q was lined up at 1 tech the majority of the time). Oliver is an absolutely spectacular athlete, though. And was a terrific run defender in college, even as a nose. I think he has a lot of potential, but this is a deep and talented 3 tech class and he's behind quite a few in demonstrable technique. Donald was waaaaaaay ahead of him in terms of hand use in college. He's not Aaron Donald. No one else (so far) is, either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GW21 Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 if I’m the GM/coach I’m drafting Oliver to be primarily an interior guy. He does have the versatility to move around which is nice, but I wouldn’t be planning on making him a full time edge. Shouldn’t really matter to us unless we trade down from #2 though. I still think it’s Bosa or Williams for us, and at least one of them will be there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
48 1/2ers Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 I’d take Ed Oliver over Quinnen Williams. But neither fit on this current roster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
757-NINER Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 Quote San Francisco had a one-on-one meeting with cornerback Tim Harris at Virginia's pro day on Thursday, according to Tony Pauline of Draft Analyst. "Cornerback Tim Harris, who performed well during Shrine Game practices, put up some incredible testing marks," wrote Pauline. "Harris measured 6016 and 197 pounds and hit 39 inches in the vertical and 11-foot-7 in the broad. His times in the 40 ranged from the high 4.3s to the low 4.4s." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrissooner49er Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 15 minutes ago, 48 1/2ers said: I’d take Ed Oliver over Quinnen Williams. But neither fit on this current roster. I agree with that in bold exponentially! Don't need them and I don't want them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
49erurtaza Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrissooner49er Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 25 minutes ago, 49erurtaza said: It seems like every year we have "one of those guys"... He is it for 2019. Good game film, but shows no athleticism in the testing or charisma for interviews. Who trained this kid?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 33 minutes ago, 49erurtaza said: Day three pick at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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