Denzel Ward

[Bernie's Curls]

I wont disagree that Denzel Ward has the potential to be  very solid, if not top tier, man-cornerback. However, I've always been a huge proponent of the NYG's old philosophy to draft pass rushers early and often and repeatedly. Most football fans can name those DE's and DT's off the top of their head, but don't remember their starting CBs...

#Bradley4ever #HitEmWithTheChubb #DEsOverDBs

[mistakey]

43 minutes ago, Bernie's Curls said:

I wont disagree that Denzel Ward has the potential to be  very solid, if not top tier, man-cornerback. However, I've always been a huge proponent of the NYG's old philosophy to draft pass rushers early and often and repeatedly. Most football fans can name those DE's and DT's off the top of their head, but don't remember their starting CBs...

#Bradley4ever #HitEmWithTheChubb #DEsOverDBs

prince amukamara was a 1st round corner
 

[Bernie's Curls]

7 minutes ago, mistakey said:

prince amukamara was a 1st round corner
 

Yes, he was, I am not trying to be ignorant of that fact. However, they kept selecting pass rushers high before they took Prince, stacking that DLine. I just feel we missed out on an opportunity to follow a model that I equate with success.

[buno67]

1 hour ago, Bernie's Curls said:

I wont disagree that Denzel Ward has the potential to be  very solid, if not top tier, man-cornerback. However, I've always been a huge proponent of the NYG's old philosophy to draft pass rushers early and often and repeatedly. Most football fans can name those DE's and DT's off the top of their head, but don't remember their starting CBs...

#Bradley4ever #HitEmWithTheChubb #DEsOverDBs

See your arguement is the old philosophy. In today’s game you have to be able to slow down WRs so the pressure can actually sack the QB. Last Garrett and Ogbah were one step away from a lot of sacks. Having corners who can make the QB hold onto the ball for a tad bit longer is going to allow the DL to cause a lot more disruption

[Kiwibrown]

2 minutes ago, buno67 said:

See your arguement is the old philosophy. In today’s game you have to be able to slow down WRs so the pressure can actually sack the QB. Last Garrett and Ogbah were one step away from a lot of sacks. Having corners who can make the QB hold onto the ball for a tad bit longer is going to allow the DL to cause a lot more disruption

I’d add that pressure up the middle is paramount also. Internal pressure disrupts the short passing game a lot as well.

Garrett over g and c on 3rd downs with other guys outside like ogbah or Collins. 

Colllins is a good blitzed also.

[Keylargobrownie]

Somebody mentioned haden, I loved haden when he was a brown, small a fiesty guy, that's where the comparison stops with ward. Joe ran a 4.6 at the combine (yes he did better at his pro day) ward ran 4.32!!!!!! And yes joe did some great work against aj green. But smaller quicker wrs toasted him deep repeatedly And it was just Antonio brown. Joe didn't have the deep speed, ward does. But only time will tell. 

[mtmmike]

him and peppers on brown then beat the crap out of him.

[Bonanza23]

7 hours ago, buckeyesNut0623 said:

That's def a bonus him being from tOSU especially with there track record recently but I'm def digging his game even if he wasn't. 

I'm assuming no word on his Jersey yet, bummer I was hoping I could order that today. 

Was more or less a joke, I really don’t care where they come from as long as they can play. Some in here think Buckeye fan can’t make sound judgments when it comes to our players. ?

[buckeyesNut0623]

28 minutes ago, Bonanza23 said:

Was more or less a joke, I really don’t care where they come from as long as they can play. Some in here think Buckeye fan can’t make sound judgments when it comes to our players. ?

Yeah I def have some Buckeye bias. I wanted Jamarco Jones bad but I am scarlett and grey through and through lol

[DawgX]

I liked the pick at the time, and I still like it now. Most would say Chubb was the better prospect, and even if he was, I think it was by a fairly narrow margin. And a #1 CB was a much bigger need than a DE. The jury is still out on how good Ogbah can become, but at the worst he's proven to be a DE who's great vs. the run and is capable of rushing the passer. He was starting to come on more as a pass rusher last season and then he got hurt. I knew we needed a third DE, but I didn't view it as a first round need, let alone a need to be addressed at #4. I would have been okay with Chubb, but I'm happier with Ward.

[Iamcanadian]

3 hours ago, buno67 said:

See your arguement is the old philosophy. In today’s game you have to be able to slow down WRs so the pressure can actually sack the QB. Last Garrett and Ogbah were one step away from a lot of sacks. Having corners who can make the QB hold onto the ball for a tad bit longer is going to allow the DL to cause a lot more disruption

Well, every GM in the NFL pretty well believes it too, so it is hardly old school. Pass rushers give the QB less time to find open receivers and allows weaker CB's to survive for a long time. Chubb would not have faced double teams as Garrett would have got that task and Chubb would have played against RT's, far less adapt at stopping pass rushers and I suspect between them, they might have been good for 25 sacks a season and believe m,e, when you get 25 sacks from your DE's, your CB's and S's do not have to be great to be effective. 

Now if Ward was head and shoulders rated above Chubb, I could see taking the CB, but I do not believe that was the case in this scenario, so I really question the wisdom of taking Ward over Chubb??? Watch Denver's defense next year with a Von Miller/Chubb attack a see which defense is more effective. Theirs or ours???

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

8 minutes ago, Iamcanadian said:

Well, every GM in the NFL pretty well believes it too, so it is hardly old school. Pass rushers give the QB less time to find open receivers and allows weaker CB's to survive for a long time. Chubb would not have faced double teams as Garrett would have got that task and Chubb would have played against RT's, far less adapt at stopping pass rushers and I suspect between them, they might have been good for 25 sacks a season and believe m,e, when you get 25 sacks from your DE's, your CB's and S's do not have to be great to be effective. 

Now if Ward was head and shoulders rated above Chubb, I could see taking the CB, but I do not believe that was the case in this scenario, so I really question the wisdom of taking Ward over Chubb??? Watch Denver's defense next year with a Von Miller/Chubb attack a see which defense is more effective. Theirs or ours???

How do you take Chris Harris and former first rounder Bradley Roby out of that equation in DEN?

[Keylargobrownie]

8 minutes ago, Iamcanadian said:

Well, every GM in the NFL pretty well believes it too, so it is hardly old school. Pass rushers give the QB less time to find open receivers and allows weaker CB's to survive for a long time. Chubb would not have faced double teams as Garrett would have got that task and Chubb would have played against RT's, far less adapt at stopping pass rushers and I suspect between them, they might have been good for 25 sacks a season and believe m,e, when you get 25 sacks from your DE's, your CB's and S's do not have to be great to be effective. 

Now if Ward was head and shoulders rated above Chubb, I could see taking the CB, but I do not believe that was the case in this scenario, so I really question the wisdom of taking Ward over Chubb??? Watch Denver's defense next year with a Von Miller/Chubb attack a see which defense is more effective. Theirs or ours???

Ah yes which comes first the chicken or the egg, or in this case pass rush vs secondary. The short answer is that u are both correct,  you  need both. In this particular argument I have to give the ✓+ to buno, although I do agree that the pass rush is more important, ward is a vast improvement to the secondary, where as Chubb is not as much of an upgrade over ogbah. 

[Iamcanadian]

1 minute ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

How do you take Chris Harris and former first rounder Bradley Roby out of that equation in DEN?

Just maybe they are the result of Von Miller's ability to rush the passer which often makes DB's look a lot better than they actually are. It is often amazing what happens when a QB loses a full second off finding an open receiver. the Von Miller/Ware combo won a SB with practically no offense on the team. 

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

1 minute ago, Iamcanadian said:

Just maybe they are the result of Von Miller's ability to rush the passer which often makes DB's look a lot better than they actually are. It is often amazing what happens when a QB loses a full second off finding an open receiver. the Von Miller/Ware combo won a SB with practically no offense on the team. 

Maybe. 

Of course Talib has been good elsewhere and Roby looks exactly the same as he did in college.

I guess my point, which you seemingly missed, is that it’s a symbiotic relationship and you need talent at both spots.