2019 Draft Talk

[Boda]

On 12/6/2018 at 4:37 PM, Ozzy said:

Brumfield?  I used to really like him but he was completely dominated against Alabama this year so my opinion of him dropped a little on that.  I seriously doubt he is a 2nd round prospect, try in the later rounds for him I would say.  Risner is very possible for the Vikings to get 1st round, Williams is probably not.  Then we can get some DL depth and pretty quality in the 2nd round.  To me there is no way the Vikings do not go OL and DL with their first two selections, those are the two biggest area of needs no doubt.

 

Unless of course a linebacker falls for some reason, I think we need to address that 3rd thing, Kendricks has struggled and Barr might not be back of course next year.  

Is this another case where we grade Offensive Line prospects? I have a hard time believing Brumfield falls out of the 2nd let alone all the way to the later rounds(5th-7th) Im not saying that Brumfield is as good as Ragnow was/is but all offseason until shortly before the draft everyone had him pegged as a 2nd/3rd round guy.

As for the going OL/DL rounds 1 or 2 I could see that but their is so much defensive talent that a normal 2nd round prospect might be available in rounds 3 or 4.  For me I'd rather go BPA in round 1 unless one of the OL prospects are graded closely to whoever is available at the time but I don't want another Christian Ponder fiasco where we end up taking a garbage player 2 rounds too early simply because we need to fill a certain position.  I would love to add Mack Wilson even if we resign Barr or even Marquise Brown who IMO is the exact type of WR this team is missing. We need a WR that can take the top off a defense, let Rudolph handle the middle of the field and any possession/End zone plays.

[Countstuku]

I wouldn’t want to reach on the oline either. It may mean we need to trade up to grab a better player. The problem is if we just wait for whoever the best available is we may miss the oline yet again.

[gopherwrestler]

On 12/9/2018 at 6:53 AM, Countstuku said:

I wouldn’t want to reach on the oline either. It may mean we need to trade up to grab a better player. The problem is if we just wait for whoever the best available is we may miss the oline yet again.

We will have a hard time trading up, either you give away next years first + more picks or high end players to move up to draft a rookie offensive lineman. 

Even with giving away that, if we end up making the playoffs and are towards the back end of the 1st.... this years first + next years 1st won’t be enough to vault us to the top 8

[VikeManDan]

Again, BPA in the trenches.Hopefully Cody Ford or Dalton Risner are available when the Vikings select. I have a feeling there will be some quality DL available as well.

[SemperFeist]

This team has enough inked in starters on both the offense and defense that they can, and should be aggressive early in the draft. 

[PrplChilPill]

I'd like them to acquire a starting OG in draft or free agency. Or both. How's whitehair looking?

This defense is great, but you can't win without offense also. The defense can still be great, even if they pass on a good DL in round one. The offense can't without fixes. You need five starting OL.

[swede700]

6 minutes ago, SemperFeist said:

This team has enough inked in starters on both the offense and defense that they can, and should be aggressive early in the draft. 

I do agree that I think they can be aggressive and trade up to get an OL this next year if they are able to do so, as they will likely have the ammo to do so.  With the limited number of top tier OL available in the draft, it's probably going to be a high priority for them to do so.    

[SemperFeist]

There’s also a time to be aggressive when you’ve identified a short window, ie what the Saints did last year in the draft. 

[gopherwrestler]

4 minutes ago, SemperFeist said:

There’s also a time to be aggressive when you’ve identified a short window, ie what the Saints did last year in the draft. 

They also moved up a couple spots for a spot starter in Davenport who they are developing for the future. 

They moved up 13 spots. Now to be able to move up into the top 10 from any position to grab an offensive lineman you will be giving up more that 2 first and a 5th. 

 

You can be agressive but moving up that much to grab an offensive lineman it has to be worth it. Has to start as a rookie on this offensive line, and long term outlook better be worth 2 players that would be first round picks, at minimum. 

[VikeManDan]

I'm hoping for quite the run on DL early this year.

[SemperFeist]

25 minutes ago, gopherwrestler said:

They also moved up a couple spots for a spot starter in Davenport who they are developing for the future. 

They moved up 13 spots. Now to be able to move up into the top 10 from any position to grab an offensive lineman you will be giving up more that 2 first and a 5th. 

 

You can be agressive but moving up that much to grab an offensive lineman it has to be worth it. Has to start as a rookie on this offensive line, and long term outlook better be worth 2 players that would be first round picks, at minimum. 

Who says it has to be a move up into the top ten?

it can be a move up 2 spots. The point is to identify a player and go get that player. Last year they sat pat and hoped a linemen was going to fall, and it didnt happen. Now it’s time to make something happen instead of simply letting the chips fall where they may. 

Edited December 11, 2018 by SemperFeist

[VikeManDan]

Losing that comp 3rd for Bradford really sucks.

[gopherwrestler]

36 minutes ago, SemperFeist said:

Who says it has to be a move up into the top ten?

it can be a move up 2 spots. The point is to identify a player and go get that player. Last year they sat pat and hoped a linemen was going to fall, and it didnt happen. Now it’s time to make something happen instead of simply letting the chips fall where they may. 

The Saints needed a pass rusher, someone many people had ranked as a top 8 player in the draft slipped, they were able to go get their guy. It doesn’t always work out like that. If Nelson slipped like that, I woulda been jumping to move up and get him. 

 

The issue is, are we moving up to draft a tackle? Where will he play? Ahead of Reiff and Oniel? 

We most likely don’t need to move up for a guard. I personally would have pretty upset if we would have moved up for Ragnow or Price. 

 

Moving up to 14 to get Miller would have been a mistake, and it would have been hard to give up a draft captiol to draft Wynn who has battled injuries. 

 

At the end of the day, I’m always more than happy to move up to draft. But I’m never risking the future to move up to gamble when the risks aren’t right, just to say you drafted a position of need. 

This year we most likely won’t need to move up, but where do we go? Most of the top end tackles were fairly inconsistent and compared to last years class they are right in the same range as Oniel. Little and Taylor are probably my #1 and #2 but I’m not moving up for either. 

Now at guard you have Ford and Lindstrom, while I have to continue to look into Lindstrom they both are bottom end talent of the 1st round/early second. They aren’t Quenton Nelson of last year.

 

Say the rest of the year doesn’t pan out and we are drafting in that 18 range. Do we reach for one of these guards, and make them a starter immediately and hope they work out, or do we stand pat and take a shot at someone like Williams or Risner who may just be available with how much high end talent is available on the defensive side of the ball. 

 

or do you go after one of these high end skills players or defensive players while we are finally back in the higher end talent part of the draft. 

 

I realize a lot goes on from now and the draft, but I would stick to the plan, best available player at a position of need, you can’t just limit yourself to drafting oline only.

 

[PrplChilPill]

10 hours ago, gopherwrestler said:

The Saints needed a pass rusher, someone many people had ranked as a top 8 player in the draft slipped, they were able to go get their guy. It doesn’t always work out like that. If Nelson slipped like that, I woulda been jumping to move up and get him. 

 

The issue is, are we moving up to draft a tackle? Where will he play? Ahead of Reiff and Oniel? 

We most likely don’t need to move up for a guard. I personally would have pretty upset if we would have moved up for Ragnow or Price. 

 

Moving up to 14 to get Miller would have been a mistake, and it would have been hard to give up a draft captiol to draft Wynn who has battled injuries. 

 

At the end of the day, I’m always more than happy to move up to draft. But I’m never risking the future to move up to gamble when the risks aren’t right, just to say you drafted a position of need. 

This year we most likely won’t need to move up, but where do we go? Most of the top end tackles were fairly inconsistent and compared to last years class they are right in the same range as Oniel. Little and Taylor are probably my #1 and #2 but I’m not moving up for either. 

Now at guard you have Ford and Lindstrom, while I have to continue to look into Lindstrom they both are bottom end talent of the 1st round/early second. They aren’t Quenton Nelson of last year.

 

Say the rest of the year doesn’t pan out and we are drafting in that 18 range. Do we reach for one of these guards, and make them a starter immediately and hope they work out, or do we stand pat and take a shot at someone like Williams or Risner who may just be available with how much high end talent is available on the defensive side of the ball. 

 

or do you go after one of these high end skills players or defensive players while we are finally back in the higher end talent part of the draft. 

 

I realize a lot goes on from now and the draft, but I would stick to the plan, best available player at a position of need, you can’t just limit yourself to drafting oline only.

 

They need two new starters, maybe three. Apparently the FA class is bad. If they don't draft guards early, just roll with remmers I guess?

[Cearbhall]

38 minutes ago, PrplChilPill said:

Apparently the FA class is bad.

Not sure where you get that from. I had a look today at free agent guards and it looked pretty good. That doesn't mean too much since many of those guys will get signed before ever hitting the market but having a defeatist attitude isn't going to accomplish anything.

I am so sick of seeing people resigned year after year to the offensive line being bad. So many people putting down hope in fixing it in one year. How many years has it been that people have been saying that the offensive line is a multi-year rebuild? Sure, with that attitude it will be a multiple years before the team has a good offensive line and maybe they will never get there. This attitude needs to change. The offensive line can be a top offensive line next year. The team just needs to look at what they can do and commit to doing it.

Look at the guys set to be free agents. There are guys there that can help. I looked earlier today. Roger Saffold, Matt Slausen, Ramon Foster, Quinton Spain, Mike Iupati, and James Carpenter are all guys that may provide average guard play or better. The team should be evaluating these guys and doing what it takes to sign two of them.

If those guys don't get to the market there may be some good guards available in the trade market. Kelechi Osemele and Gabe Jackson are among the players the team should be doing homework on right now.

Bring back Compton to backup. Bring back Easton to start at center and let Elflein backup or prove that he should be starting in front of Easton. If Elflein lives up to that potential Easton will be a solid interior backup.

Then the team needs to properly value offensive linemen in the draft and not be caught off guard by players being drafted earlier than the Vikings thought they should be drafted. I don't know how they value the positions but it is clear as day they need to be placing more value on offensive linemen. For example, if the Vikings previously thought that the a guy they project to be a top five RB in the NFL is more valuable than a guard they project to be a top ten guard in the NFL they need to adjust their thinking to value a top ten guard higher.

Ideally, the team comes out of the draft with two solid prospects along with the two starters they signed before the draft. I am not in favor of forcing anything in the draft which is why I consider it a top priority to have a solution for at least 2019 before the draft but ideally they team would be able to work the draft to get a first round talent at OT with their first pick and another offensive linemen they could try to develop somewhere else in the draft.

If the team wants to think big, their line next year can be something like this:

Reiff, Saffold, Easton, Slausen, O'Neil

Backups can be something like this:

Hill, Compton, Elflein, rookie OT, rookie OL.

IMO, if Mike Remmers or Danny Isidora are on the team next year the team probably didn't do what they needed to do in the offseason. Sure, Isidora still might develop and I am open to the possibility of him beating out Compton in a camp competition. I don't expect him to win that battle but if he did it would be a nice surprise. The point is based on what they know they shouldn't be expecting it.

And, of course this is putting the cart before the horse. It is but an example. The first thing that needs to happen is they need to pick an offensive coordinator, offensive line coach, and think about blocking schemes they want to use. Sure, they should be looking at players they have access to when picking the scheme but that decision will inform which players they should actually target.

Another TE that excels at blocking would be nice too. The team really misses David Morgan.

Edited December 12, 2018 by Cearbhall