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The Philadelphia Phillies Thread


mse326

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8 hours ago, ninjapirate said:

@utley4568 I am sure Cesar, Moniak and Sixto might get them at least interested for archer if they dont just accept that. 

I don't think Sixto even has to be involved. Cesar and Moniak or a lesser prospect might be enough. Especially when you consider their ages (Cesar is 2 years younger), and the fact that Cesar has been worth 2.3 more wins since the beginning of 2016.

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I don't know that going after Archer is right for us. We have a few years at least until we are competitive anyway. No need to make a big trade depleting some of the farm now. Especially when the farm is basically the lone bright spot.

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3 minutes ago, mse326 said:

I don't know that going after Archer is right for us. We have a few years at least until we are competitive anyway. No need to make a big trade depleting some of the farm now. Especially when the farm is basically the lone bright spot.

With Cesar as the centerpiece, I don't think a trade depletes the farm.

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2 minutes ago, utley4568 said:

With Cesar as the centerpiece, I don't think a trade depletes the farm.

I think we are overrating Cesar if you think he can centerpiece a deal for Archer

I know he's playing really well and did last year, but I think you'd be hardpressed to find any non Philly fan (even ones that are knowledgeable) to say he is good enough to warrant Archer.

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Just now, mse326 said:

I think we are overrating Cesar if you think he can centerpiece a deal for Archer

I know he's playing really well and did last year, but I think you'd be hardpressed to find any non Philly fan (even ones that are knowledgeable) to say he is good enough to warrant Archer.

If you remove the name and just look at his numbers, he's been really good. The Phillies sucking hasn't helped him, but he could definitely be the centerpiece of a deal for Archer.

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2 minutes ago, utley4568 said:

If you remove the name and just look at his numbers, he's been really good. The Phillies sucking hasn't helped him, but he could definitely be the centerpiece of a deal for Archer.

I'm not denying he's been really good. I intentionally used "we" when talking about him. I know it's weird to say that I am overrating him too as it seems counterintuitive to realize that, but I do think that's the truth.

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1 minute ago, mse326 said:

I'm not denying he's been really good. I intentionally used "we" when talking about him. I know it's weird to say that I am overrating him too as it seems counterintuitive to realize that, but I do think that's the truth.

I get what you're saying. I don't know if it's overrating him, as much as it is just being more aware of his value. I do think we value him more than most non-Phillies fans would, I just don't know if it's overrating him.

I actually posed this question in the gameday thread too. I've always had a tough time gauging his value, and really want some non-Phillie fan opinions on this one.

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8 hours ago, mse326 said:

I'm not denying he's been really good. I intentionally used "we" when talking about him. I know it's weird to say that I am overrating him too as it seems counterintuitive to realize that, but I do think that's the truth.

It does seem like he is collectively underrated. I think it stems from him never being a touted prospect and the community thinking that the other shoe will drop eventually. 

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1 hour ago, ninjapirate said:

It does seem like he is collectively underrated. I think it stems from him never being a touted prospect and the community thinking that the other shoe will drop eventually. 

Yeah, it's really odd. I think I'm even guilty of it. The fact that I'd rather start Kingery next year over a 3-4 WAR player is pretty crazy.

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1 hour ago, utley4568 said:

Yeah, it's really odd. I think I'm even guilty of it. The fact that I'd rather start Kingery next year over a 3-4 WAR player is pretty crazy.

I undervalue him as well. It will be interesting what happens with Cesar. Because realistically we should be able to get a lot for a 4 war 2b before the season starts. 

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12 minutes ago, ninjapirate said:

I undervalue him as well. It will be interesting what happens with Cesar. Because realistically we should be able to get a lot for a 4 war 2b before the season starts. 

Especially with that much control. I think he'd be a useful part of a Stanton trade, especially since Miami seemingly wants to unload Gordon. I still think the Rays are the perfect fit though.

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Just now, utley4568 said:

Especially with that much control. I think he'd be a useful part of a Stanton trade, especially since Miami seemingly wants to unload Gordon. I still think the Rays are the perfect fit though.

Stanton doesnt want to be here and he can say no. So I would give up on those thoughts. 

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