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Woz

2018 Positional Group Analysis: Interior Offensive Line

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Posted (edited)

Shawn Lauvao isn’t the greatest, but he’s a serviceable starter and certainly not a boat anchor around the offense. Our offense has not been in the tubes since he signed here.

My opinion of Nsekhe is that if the Redskins weren’t able to keep him as a RFA the last two seasons that he’d be a starting OT for some team in the NFL. So, he’s good value for the Redskins because they have an OL who’d probably be a starter in the league if not for his restricted status with the Redskins. 

Edited by turtle28

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1 hour ago, turtle28 said:

Shawn Lauvao isn’t the greatest, but he’s a serviceable starter and certainly not a boat anchor around the offense.

We'll agree to disagree on the bolded.

1 hour ago, turtle28 said:

My opinion of Nsekhe is that if the Redskins weren’t able to keep him as a RFA the last two seasons that he’d be a starting OT for some team in the NFL.

Again, at least three NFL teams got a look at him before the Redskins did (Rams, Saints, and Colts). All cut him.

1 hour ago, turtle28 said:

So, he’s good value for the Redskins because they have an OL who’d probably be a starter in the league if not for his restricted status with the Redskins. 

Except your perceived value of him as a starter derives from the fact the Redskins did not cut him and kept him around at a cheap price. He wouldn't have any value if not for the Redskins.

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, Woz said:

We'll agree to disagree on the bolded.

Again, at least three NFL teams got a look at him before the Redskins did (Rams, Saints, and Colts). All cut him.

Except your perceived value of him as a starter derives from the fact the Redskins did not cut him and kept him around at a cheap price. He wouldn't have any value if not for the Redskins.

When has Lauvao been a boat anchor that brought the team down? I can’t remember a game where he was that awful except possibly when he went up against Calais Campbell two years ago. What sticks out more in my mind about Lauvao is in 2015 when he and Kory L got hurt and our running game went from looking great the first few weeks to awful when Leribus and Long took over for them.

Bringing up how Nsekhe got cut before he came to the Redskins is irrelevant to me. Nsekhe has played well at LT when he’s had to play for TWill when he was injured or suspended. Recent history is what matters with him and with the way he’s played as a Redskin, it tells me that he’d be a starter on another team if we couldn’t keep him as a RFA. Heck, some fans were willing to trade TWill a few years ago after Trent’s last suspension - get a 1st round pick - and roll with Nsekhe as the Redskins starting LT.

Edited by turtle28

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On 6/6/2018 at 10:31 AM, Woz said:

All 31 other teams have just three or four linemen on their roster that one might consider suitable to be a starter in the NFL with little to no viable depth at all behind? The offensive lineman crisis is worse than I had heard.

It's somewhat subjective but it boils down to "if [team] had to start [player], how confident would/should [team] be that [player] won't be a boat anchor around [team's] offense?"

Trent Williams? No concerns with him starting.
Brandon Scherff? No concerns with him starting.
Morgan Moses? Mild concerns, but not going to fret too much about them.
Chase Roullier? Some concerns, but I'd roll with him.
Ty Nsekhe? Some concerns, but I'd roll with him.

Everyone else the Redskins have? Oh shiiiiiiiii ...

We'll agree to disagree.

Nsekhe graduated in 2009. He spent a month on the Rams' regular season roster in September 2012 (appeared in 2 games), and then did not appear in the NFL until 2015 with the Redskins. The rest of those six years were spent in the AF2 (the AFL's developmental league), the AFL, the CFL (practice squad only), and on offseason appearances in the NFL. For six years, Nsekhe toiled in obscurity. At age 29, he got his first real chance in the NFL. The Redskins have kept him under control via the ERFA (he could only sign with the Redskins) and RFA tenders (2nd round).

Next year, at age 33 (would be 34 in the middle of the 2019 season), he will become an unrestricted free agent in the NFL for the first time. The Redskins might re-sign him, or they might let him walk. If he walks, he's likely not going somewhere that he's the automatic starter. Yes, he'll have a decent chance at the gig, but it will only be on a year-to-year basis, in all likelihood.

That may be harsh, but it is the reality of Nsekhe's situation. He has massive value to the Redskins because he has plenty of experience (he was playing in the AFL) but is incredibly cheap relative to what his position would command. If/when his price goes up, his value will sink.

I think this is the value of drafting Geron Christian. To be that swing tackle. 

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On 6/9/2018 at 7:24 PM, mike23md said:

I think this is the value of drafting Geron Christian. To be that swing tackle. 

I agree, and if he were signed and in minicamp, I would be a lot happier. Louisville's graduation was May 12th, so he has no reason not have been signed by OTAs.

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16 hours ago, Woz said:

I agree, and if he were signed and in minicamp, I would be a lot happier. Louisville's graduation was May 12th, so he has no reason not have been signed by OTAs.

Yep, and there is no reason, absolutely none, he shoudl be away from the team during those times. He was not the most polished or technically sound OT in the draft and I think was drafted a bit high. If he had any drive or determination to play in the NFL and be somewhat of a success, these are the times that you need to earn your stripes. 

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Posted (edited)
17 hours ago, Woz said:

I agree, and if he were signed and in minicamp, I would be a lot happier. Louisville's graduation was May 12th, so he has no reason not have been signed by OTAs.

Wait, I've read that he's been working with the first team during OTAs...

EDIT for the source:

The offensive rookies got plenty of work, too. Second-round pick Derrius Guice was explosive and energetic and was receiving plenty of reps with the first team by the third week. Third-round pick Geron Christian got a ton of work with the first team at left tackle with Trent Williams still out with injury. That was an invaluable three weeks for a rookie, being immediately thrown into the fire. Receiver Trey Quinn, the last pick in the draft, took to learning from Crowder and seems to have a legitimate shot at making the roster.

 

Edited by HTTRG3Dynasty

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Good look at the position, Woz. I look forward to seeing the rest of them. 

LG is a trainwreck. I can’t pretend to really understand their plan there. But if you’re going to have a gaping hole on your roster, that’s really the “best” place to have one. Aside from maybe RB, it’s probably the easiest position to find a guy off the street to plug in and play adequately. As we’ve discussed before, there are as many as a half dozen FAs out there currently who could offer some value. And there will be more as camps start to wind down and teams decide they can afford to jettison higher priced veterans and go with youth. 

Plus, it’s just extremely difficult for a bad LG to really singlehandedly torpedo a season. Teams like NO, MIN, KC, JAX, and LAC all had poor play from their LG spots last season, but they still had very productive offenses and successful seasons. Hell, we ran a similar briskly crackling dumpster fire out there at LG last season — along with two hobbled OTs, a rookie C, an occasionally banged up RG, and a truly mindbending litany of other injuries at the offensive skill positions — and we still finished in the top half of the league in points and yards. There are just so many ways to cover up for a bad LG, and our OL coach is a really smart cat who did a pretty remarkable job last season. I think he can paper over a problem spot if we need him to. 

[NOTE: I’m not saying I think we’re fine just standing pat at LG. We should be pursuing any possible upgrade, I totally agree with you. Just saying that I don’t think we need to give in to too much doom and gloom about the season failing to launch because it appears we’ve currently installed a turnstile between Williams and Roullier.]

A couple other quick things...

- I feel good about Roullier. I think he’s smart and has solid technique. A full offseason in an NFL strength program will do wonders for his run blocking, I’d wager. 

- Scherff is a stud. I’d really like to see him locked up before the season. Maybe they have a plan to maximize the cap outcomes, but I don’t see the point in getting too cute with that one. 

- Nsekhe is a total mystery to me. I think he’d be my projected starter at LG at the moment, but I just don’t know what you can expect from him in full-time work. His miserable failure in switching over to the right side has me a little gunshy about just assuming he could hold up at a different position than LT for an extended period, plus he has his own significant injury history. 

- Wouldn't be too worried about Geron Christian’s status. 3rd round picks are usually the slowest to sign because of an idiosyncrasy in the CBA. Looks like he’s been out there getting a ton of reps in OTAs, so I don’t have much concern there. 

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, e16bball said:

Good look at the position, Woz. I look forward to seeing the rest of them. 

LG is a trainwreck. I can’t pretend to really understand their plan there. But if you’re going to have a gaping hole on your roster, that’s really the “best” place to have one. Aside from maybe RB, it’s probably the easiest position to find a guy off the street to plug in and play adequately. As we’ve discussed before, there are as many as a half dozen FAs out there currently who could offer some value. And there will be more as camps start to wind down and teams decide they can afford to jettison higher priced veterans and go with youth. 

Plus, it’s just extremely difficult for a bad LG to really singlehandedly torpedo a season. Teams like NO, MIN, KC, JAX, and LAC all had poor play from their LG spots last season, but they still had very productive offenses and successful seasons. Hell, we ran a similar briskly crackling dumpster fire out there at LG last season — along with two hobbled OTs, a rookie C, an occasionally banged up RG, and a truly mindbending litany of other injuries at the offensive skill positions — and we still finished in the top half of the league in points and yards. There are just so many ways to cover up for a bad LG, and our OL coach is a really smart cat who did a pretty remarkable job last season. I think he can paper over a problem spot if we need him to. 

[NOTE: I’m not saying I think we’re fine just standing pat at LG. We should be pursuing any possible upgrade, I totally agree with you. Just saying that I don’t think we need to give in to too much doom and gloom about the season failing to launch because it appears we’ve currently installed a turnstile between Williams and Roullier.]

A couple other quick things...

- I feel good about Roullier. I think he’s smart and has solid technique. A full offseason in an NFL strength program will do wonders for his run blocking, I’d wager. 

- Scherff is a stud. I’d really like to see him locked up before the season. Maybe they have a plan to maximize the cap outcomes, but I don’t see the point in getting too cute with that one. 

- Nsekhe is a total mystery to me. I think he’d be my projected starter at LG at the moment, but I just don’t know what you can expect from him in full-time work. His miserable failure in switching over to the right side has me a little gunshy about just assuming he could hold up at a different position than LT for an extended period, plus he has his own significant injury history. 

- Wouldn't be too worried about Geron Christian’s status. 3rd round picks are usually the slowest to sign because of an idiosyncrasy in the CBA. Looks like he’s been out there getting a ton of reps in OTAs, so I don’t have much concern there. 

Nsekhe had to play LG for a few games or so last year - I think it was the Saints game - and he wasn’t awful. He’s not going to be great at it, but I also think he’s a better option than Lauvao. I’ve thought since 2015 that he’s our 4th or 5th best OL and he should be starting at Lg.

Edited by turtle28

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This is an encouraging write-up regarding Chase:

 

Ranking all 32 offensive lines by pass-blocking efficiency

24. WASHINGTON REDSKINS

2017 pass-blocking efficiency: 76.6

Best individual PBEChase Roullier, 98.4

 

A few offensive lines were held back by injuries in 2017, but none were more injury-riddled than the Redskins, who had 12 different players play at least 50 pass-block snaps throughout the season. All told, the Redskins surrendered 181 pressures on 606 passing plays, including 35 QB hits, the fifth-most among offensive lines. There were bright spots, however, as left tackle Trent Williams, despite playing with an injury, proved once again that he’s one of the best offensive tackles in football by being the only left tackle in the league to register 350 pass-block snaps without allowing a sack. The Redskins also got a nice rookie season from center Chase Roullier, who ended the campaign with a pass-blocking efficiency of 98.4, the highest rating recorded by a rookie center since Nick Mangold (99.4) in 2006. If they can stay healthy, the Redskins have the making of one of the better offensive lines in football as we look ahead to 2018.

 

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56 minutes ago, HTTRG3Dynasty said:

This is an encouraging write-up regarding Chase:

 

Ranking all 32 offensive lines by pass-blocking efficiency

24. WASHINGTON REDSKINS

2017 pass-blocking efficiency: 76.6

Best individual PBEChase Roullier, 98.4

 

A few offensive lines were held back by injuries in 2017, but none were more injury-riddled than the Redskins, who had 12 different players play at least 50 pass-block snaps throughout the season. All told, the Redskins surrendered 181 pressures on 606 passing plays, including 35 QB hits, the fifth-most among offensive lines. There were bright spots, however, as left tackle Trent Williams, despite playing with an injury, proved once again that he’s one of the best offensive tackles in football by being the only left tackle in the league to register 350 pass-block snaps without allowing a sack. The Redskins also got a nice rookie season from center Chase Roullier, who ended the campaign with a pass-blocking efficiency of 98.4, the highest rating recorded by a rookie center since Nick Mangold (99.4) in 2006. If they can stay healthy, the Redskins have the making of one of the better offensive lines in football as we look ahead to 2018.

 

Holly shnikies!

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And this is why Lauvao was re-signed. If Callahan loves an OL, you’re damn sure they’ll be on our team.

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Just now, turtle28 said:

And this is why Lauvao was re-signed. If Callahan loves an OL, you’re damn sure they’ll be on our team.

Then he needs to get his eyes checked.

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8 minutes ago, Woz said:

Then he needs to get his eyes checked.

I’ve been saying that for 3 years. Our running game was better before Callahan got here. I think he’s a good teacher and motivator but it’s just not working. 

Maybe the talent of Guice will make up for the deficiencies in Callahan’s scheme/Lauvao but I’ve lost the love for Callahan I had when we first signed him.

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