2018 Draft Eligible QB Thread

[jetskid007]

On 2/28/2018 at 12:24 PM, Iamcanadian said:

I do not agree, mental toughness is a top quality every solid franchise QB possesses and the failures simply are not mentally tough. Most QB's drafted #1 overall come to a team almost devoid of talent and often struggle in their rookie seasons, but it just does not bother them, they pick themselves up and go on to great things the following season, the weak ones fall by the wayside.

It is not enough to have skills or even a lot of intangibles, if the last play always lingers in your mind, you will struggle in the NFL. The tough minded QB, just goes to the next play like the last one never happened and that cannot be taught, a QB either has it, or he does not and Sanchez just never had it and therefore was doomed to failure. 

Peyton threw something like 26 interceptions as a rookie, did it even slow him down, not one bit, Eli stunk as a rookie and lately Goff stunk as a rookie, but they just pick themselves up and go on to the next play till they got it right. That is why they are/were franchise QB's!!! 

 

Yes, mental toughness is a prerequisite, but did you ever think it could be developed? Even the most mentally tough will likely struggle, if not fail, in the wrong situation. Just look at Alex Smith. It's a team game, and most cases than not coaching is more important so than the actual players around the QB unless you're Peyton Manning. 

As far as the examples you use: Peyton is a once-in-a-generation, maybe even millennia, type talent. Goff had one of the best offensive minds in the game walk in the door last year, and Eli was a sub-58% passer with a 1.29-to-1 TD:INT ratio until Kevin Gilbride walked through that door. That, and that improbable super bowl run, helped Eli become an "elite" QB... from that point on, he played with more confidence and more moxxy late in games. Prior to, he was on the verge of being a bust. 

There are thoroughbred QBs that are so talented and smart that they can work it out, regardless what situation they are in (Peyton) and there are others that need to be coddled, coached, and developed early on for them to fully reach their potential. All great QBs will have to be mentally tough, but it's not so cut-and-dry to say that all quarterbacks that bust are not mentally tough. That is such a fallacy, especially when you consider how Mark played late in games and in pressure games during his first two years. He actually epitomized mentally tough in those years, but it wasn't enough. 

[Mox]

Is this real life? Does Alex McGough actually have a shot at getting drafted late on day 3? His name has actually been popping up on twitter and mocks I've looked at lately.

[IronMike84]

Just an observation: there has been so little (zero?) discussion about Sam Darnold coming out as a sophomore when I feel like QBs coming out as juniors really have had that held against during them over the past few years. 

[Forge]

32 minutes ago, IronMike84 said:

Just an observation: there has been so little (zero?) discussion about Sam Darnold coming out as a sophomore when I feel like QBs coming out as juniors really have had that held against during them over the past few years. 

Depends on how much they played in that time. Nobody would have levied an experience argument against thorson had he come, for example. 

[jrry32]

1 hour ago, IronMike84 said:

Just an observation: there has been so little (zero?) discussion about Sam Darnold coming out as a sophomore when I feel like QBs coming out as juniors really have had that held against during them over the past few years. 

That stigma has basically gone away over the past decade.

[Rodjahs12]

7 minutes ago, jrry32 said:

That stigma has basically gone away over the past decade.

Exactly this. Frankly the younger the prospect the better and that goes for any position as far as I’m concerned. More time to groom them at the pro level before they hit 25 and where they should peak is more beneficial than getting them closer to say 23.

[goldfishwars]

Greg Cosell on the QB class:-

 

[JJ6]

My current QB rankings:

Darnold

Mayfield

Rosen 

Jackson 

Allen

 

Some notes: 

- Mayfield is going to be a baller. Love his on the field demeanour. Can make every throw. Should not make it pass Denver who I think is a great fit for him. 

- Rosen is the safest QB in the draft. The Matt Ryan comparisons are pretty bang on. He'll be a 10+ year starter. 

- I really want to put Lamar higher. If you can pair him with the right coach and system where alot of RPO is implemented I'd have no problem taking him #1. He really is Michael Vick although I think Jackson is even better with his feet. Crazy upside. 

- Allen should not be going in the top 10. Besides his accuracy issues which are well known the thing that concerns me the most is he makes so many wtf decisions. He just doesn't seem to be able to read the field well. I wouldn't touch him in the top 10. The Chargers would be a good spot for him. He should not see the field for atleast a year. 

 

Really strong crop this year. 

[goldfishwars]

Really nice deeep dive on Lamar Jackson by Greg Cosell here:-

https://sports.yahoo.com/greg-cosells-draft-analysis-lamar-jackson-can-execute-nfl-passing-game-145150269.html

 

Quote

 

In 2016, Jackson won a Heisman Trophy. But in 2017 you regularly saw a quarterback who can operate effectively within framework of a structured passing game. Jackson executed many NFL concepts in Louisville’s offense and can do the same in the NFL. And there’s no question what he can bring to a team’s run game.

There were also a few games over the past couple years in which Jackson was overly frenetic in the pocket due to pressure and broke down too quickly. That type of performance does not transition well to the NFL. Then the evaluation of Jackson as an NFL quarterback will be a function of one’s belief in the needed balance between consistent pocket play — and how and if that can be taught and refined — and the playmaking dimension Jackson brings.

 

 

 

[Rich7sena]

Lamar Jackson's accuracy concerns me much more than Allen's. Jackson's deficiencies throwing outside the numbers, as well as his inconsistencies throwing deep and overall passing decision making give me major pause. I'm not sure Jackson is draft-able purely based on his passing. That said, Jackson has to be evaluated differently than the other QB prospects because of his running ability. I also don't think Watson's success is a safe barometer of what Jackson could do at the next level as I'm not totally convinced Watson's success is repeatable.

I believe there is a significant part of the amateur media scout collective that deliberately exists to push back on some narratives espoused by football's old guard (i.e. Bill Polian). Because of this, Jackson gets propped up and Allen gets pushed down by draft Twitter. In a lot of ways, both players illustrate old and new ways of thinking, respectively.

[goldfishwars]

More Greg Cosell, on Josh Allen this time. 

https://sports.yahoo.com/greg-cosells-draft-analysis-josh-allen-young-wild-stallion-needs-channeled-163817268.html

 

 

Quote

 

What’s easy to see is the big-time throws Allen can make. It’s harder to see the throws that were there and he did not make. There were plenty of throws he didn’t make, because he needs to develop a better feel for seeing the field with clarity. He has to become quicker mentally to develop into a quality NFL quarterback.

What you’re getting with Allen is a player with undeniable physical skills, but a quarterback who is unrefined and inconsistent in his execution and production. There’s a lack of structured discipline to his game that resulted in a lack of timing and rhythm throws. He has to develop more touch and pace as a passer to reach the consistency that is demanded in the NFL.

It’s pretty obvious what Allen can do. The question becomes, can his NFL team coach him hard and develop him into a quarterback who can get the most out of those physical skills?

 

 

[MikeT14]

On 4/3/2018 at 5:24 PM, jarren said:

My current QB rankings:

Darnold

Mayfield

Rosen 

Jackson 

Allen

 

Some notes: 

- Mayfield is going to be a baller. Love his on the field demeanour. Can make every throw. Should not make it pass Denver who I think is a great fit for him. 

- Rosen is the safest QB in the draft. The Matt Ryan comparisons are pretty bang on. He'll be a 10+ year starter. 

- I really want to put Lamar higher. If you can pair him with the right coach and system where alot of RPO is implemented I'd have no problem taking him #1. He really is Michael Vick although I think Jackson is even better with his feet. Crazy upside. 

- Allen should not be going in the top 10. Besides his accuracy issues which are well known the thing that concerns me the most is he makes so many wtf decisions. He just doesn't seem to be able to read the field well. I wouldn't touch him in the top 10. The Chargers would be a good spot for him. He should not see the field for atleast a year. 

 

Really strong crop this year. 

That's close to mine. I'd flip flop Allen and Jackson.

[AlNFL19]

Why is Mason Rudolph getting first round buzz?

[One Punch Man]

I’ve really started to warm up on Josh Allen.. but I still have him rated as my #5 QB prospect.

[MistaBohmbastic]

You could make the case that Darnold is actually a safer pick than Rosen, perhaps Mayfield as well.

Yes, there's no doubt Rosen is the most NFL ready QB in this class. He's far and away the best passer right now, with intelligence through the roof. However, with his lack of mobility, and history of concussions, there's legitimate concern that his career could be cut short at any moment. 

Mayfield's size may not hold him up from being a baller in the league, but that combined with previous concussions in his collegiate career could also take a toll. Not to mention, I know for certain that, even though he's no Johnny Football, he does like to live it up. I don't think it'll be his downfall, but the combination of these things could be detrimental to his longevity in the NFL.

Meanwhile, Darnold, a former HS linebacker, does not have a history of concussions, and his durability is less worrisome than these two. He is more raw, but he has intelligence, intangibles, modesty and a learnability about him that shows me his mechanical mistakes with his footwork and turnovers will be corrected. I think in the grand scheme of things, he could easily end up being the most impactful QB of this class.