Nick Bosa vs Ed Oliver

[AlNFL19]

2 hours ago, MSURacerDT55 said:

Some people only see things at face value and thats fine, no need to explain the circumstances if they don't already see

He'll be filed under "how did we miss on this one "

It's not that I don't think he's been a great player and will be a great player, it's just that my expectations were higher this season, not entirely on the field. Yelling at your coach isn't a good thing no matter what the circumstances are surrounding that.

[YogiBiz]

6 hours ago, MSURacerDT55 said:

Some people only see things at face value and thats fine, no need to explain the circumstances if they don't already see

He'll be filed under "how did we miss on this one "

I'm just hoping the Giants' take Ed Oliver. It would be nice to walk away with the two best players in the draft. In back to back years

[Texansfan713]

6 hours ago, AlNFL19 said:

It's not that I don't think he's been a great player and will be a great player, it's just that my expectations were higher this season, not entirely on the field. Yelling at your coach isn't a good thing no matter what the circumstances are surrounding that.

applewhite is known to be a jerk as a hc so i dont blame ed.

[ClutchDJ]

I think there’s a slight chance Oliver doesn’t go top 5, due to him even coming in smaller than Donald did. Also, with Quinnen overtaking him as the best IDL. GMs are going to be dumb with it, but it’ll happen.

[YogiBiz]

On 11/22/2018 at 8:57 AM, ClutchDJ said:

I think there’s a slight chance Oliver doesn’t go top 5, due to him even coming in smaller than Donald did. Also, with Quinnen overtaking him as the best IDL. GMs are going to be dumb with it, but it’ll happen.

How is this even a line of thinking? If anyone takes Quinnen before Oliver they are completely and utterly a useless fool and should be fired after Oliver starts taking home awards. It wont. And I will be the first person off the Gettlman-train if he does. 

And Donald still went top 15 with his measurements. I would also like to see what Oliver measures at before I say he's smaller than Donald because I think they are at least the same build. 

[ClutchDJ]

3 hours ago, YogiBiz said:

How is this even a line of thinking? If anyone takes Quinnen before Oliver they are completely and utterly a useless fool and should be fired after Oliver starts taking home awards. It wont. And I will be the first person off the Gettlman-train if he does. 

And Donald still went top 15 with his measurements. I would also like to see what Oliver measures at before I say he's smaller than Donald because I think they are at least the same build. 

Probably because everywhere & everyone but here is extremely underselling how great Quinnen has been this season. He already has better hand-usage over Oliver by far. Leverage is about even. Burst goes to Oliver though Quinnen has great burst, too. Oliver has range, which quite frankly, no IDL has ever had the range Oliver has coming out.  Now production, If this battle were fought purely on paper, Oliver would win in a landslide. The man already has 13.5 tackles for loss and three sacks this season, pushing his three-year career totals to 52 tackles for loss and 13.5 sacks in 31 games. And to be honest, those numbers don’t even do his performances justice.

But at the same time, neither do Williams’ numbers. He has an impressive 8.5 tackles for loss and 1.5 sacks this season, but there is so much context to consider in Williams’ stats. First, he’s currently playing in a rotation along Alabama’s ridiculously deep defensive line. Second, the SEC is still much more of a running than a passing conference, which limits a lot of the opportunities to get to the quarterback.

Third, Williams has had a significant number of plays where the quarterback is in his grasp and throws the ball away. Watch his tape, it is littered with these types of plays. The low sack numbers are not at all indicative of a lack of pass rush talent.

Competion goes to Quinnen.

 

What Da’Ron Payne did last season where he absolutely took off towards the end of the season is what Quinnen has been doing ALL season. Single block, double team block, he has been owning both. I love Raekwon, but 2017 Raekwon wishes he was as good as Quinnen was this year. Quinnen is honestly the best defensive prospect to come through Bama in the Saban era. With Reuben Foster, Minkah Fitzpatrick, & Marcel Dareus coming through, that’s saying a lot.

 

No defensive player this season has been more dominant on a snap-to-snap basis than Quinnen has this season. I ask everyone in here to watch Quinnen starting from week 1, play by play, to lie to me & say he isn’t a top 3 talent in the draft. Dude is very special.

[Activated10]

8 minutes ago, ClutchDJ said:

Probably because everywhere & everyone but here is extremely underselling how great Quinnen has been this season. He already has better hand-usage over Oliver by far. Leverage is about even. Burst goes to Oliver though Quinnen has great burst, too. Oliver has range, which quite frankly, no IDL has ever had the range Oliver has coming out.  Now production, If this battle were fought purely on paper, Oliver would win in a landslide. The man already has 13.5 tackles for loss and three sacks this season, pushing his three-year career totals to 52 tackles for loss and 13.5 sacks in 31 games. And to be honest, those numbers don’t even do his performances justice.

But at the same time, neither do Williams’ numbers. He has an impressive 8.5 tackles for loss and 1.5 sacks this season, but there is so much context to consider in Williams’ stats. First, he’s currently playing in a rotation along Alabama’s ridiculously deep defensive line. Second, the SEC is still much more of a running than a passing conference, which limits a lot of the opportunities to get to the quarterback.

Third, Williams has had a significant number of plays where the quarterback is in his grasp and throws the ball away. Watch his tape, it is littered with these types of plays. The low sack numbers are not at all indicative of a lack of pass rush talent.

Competion goes to Quinnen.

 

What Da’Ron Payne did last season where he absolutely took off towards the end of the season is what Quinnen has been doing ALL season. Single block, double team block, he has been owning both. I love Raekwon, but 2017 Raekwon wishes he was as good as Quinnen was this year. Quinnen is honestly the best defensive prospect to come through Bama in the Saban era. With Reuben Foster, Minkah Fitzpatrick, & Marcel Dareus coming through, that’s saying a lot.

 

No defensive player this season has been more dominant on a snap-to-snap basis than Quinnen has this season. I ask everyone in here to watch Quinnen starting from week 1, play by play, to lie to me & say he isn’t a top 3 talent in the draft. Dude is very special.

Jonathan Allen was a better prospect. Healthy Allen was going to get drafted 3rd overall and was much better prospect than Soloman Thomas

[MSURacerDT55]

29 minutes ago, ClutchDJ said:

Probably because everywhere & everyone but here is extremely underselling how great Quinnen has been this season. He already has better hand-usage over Oliver by far. Leverage is about even. Burst goes to Oliver though Quinnen has great burst, too. Oliver has range, which quite frankly, no IDL has ever had the range Oliver has coming out.  Now production, If this battle were fought purely on paper, Oliver would win in a landslide. The man already has 13.5 tackles for loss and three sacks this season, pushing his three-year career totals to 52 tackles for loss and 13.5 sacks in 31 games. And to be honest, those numbers don’t even do his performances justice.

But at the same time, neither do Williams’ numbers. He has an impressive 8.5 tackles for loss and 1.5 sacks this season, but there is so much context to consider in Williams’ stats. First, he’s currently playing in a rotation along Alabama’s ridiculously deep defensive line. Second, the SEC is still much more of a running than a passing conference, which limits a lot of the opportunities to get to the quarterback.

Third, Williams has had a significant number of plays where the quarterback is in his grasp and throws the ball away. Watch his tape, it is littered with these types of plays. The low sack numbers are not at all indicative of a lack of pass rush talent.

Competion goes to Quinnen.

 

What Da’Ron Payne did last season where he absolutely took off towards the end of the season is what Quinnen has been doing ALL season. Single block, double team block, he has been owning both. I love Raekwon, but 2017 Raekwon wishes he was as good as Quinnen was this year. Quinnen is honestly the best defensive prospect to come through Bama in the Saban era. With Reuben Foster, Minkah Fitzpatrick, & Marcel Dareus coming through, that’s saying a lot.

 

No defensive player this season has been more dominant on a snap-to-snap basis than Quinnen has this season. I ask everyone in here to watch Quinnen starting from week 1, play by play, to lie to me & say he isn’t a top 3 talent in the draft. Dude is very special.

No one isn't saying he isn't special but if Oliver had one on one opportunities like the many Williams has, he would have twice the production. His numbers are so underrated despite double and triple teamed. 

Some people just don't get it

 

 

[ClutchDJ]

1 hour ago, Activated10 said:

Jonathan Allen was a better prospect. Healthy Allen was going to get drafted 3rd overall and was much better prospect than Soloman Thomas

Allen wasn’t even a better prospect than Marcel Dareus, let alone Quinnen Williams.  

Allen was great, but I wouldn’t even put him in the top 5 as far as Bama prospects under Saban go.

[ClutchDJ]

1 hour ago, MSURacerDT55 said:

No one isn't saying he isn't special but if Oliver had one on one opportunities like the many Williams has, he would have twice the production. His numbers are so underrated despite double and triple teamed. 

Some people just don't get it

 

 

Lets also factor Quinnen is going against much better competition. I can also turn the table around & say if Quinnen was going against the same competition Oliver was going against, he would have twice the production. Hypotheticals <.

 

Maybe & you & others just don’t get it. It’s okay, everyone will see & learn.

 

I know how great Oliver is. I know how “underrated” his numbers even while being double teamed. I don’t see it as a reach at all if Oliver were to go higher in the draft than Quinnen, but it’s completely asinine to believe that Quinnen isn’t on his level or maybe a very few steps above it.

[YogiBiz]

2 hours ago, ClutchDJ said:

Single block, double team block, he has been owning both.

LOL at Williams being double teamed. He rarely ever sees one of those. Have you actually watched either of Oliver's or William's Tape? Because Williams hand usage isn't better than Williams, he just has to be more technical than Oliver, who just basically explodes into and then past O-line man. Oliver is straight SPECIAL. I have yet to see any of Oliver's competition force him to use a "counter" move. Oliver should put identical numbers up to Donald at the combine, and when people literally see he is double and triple teamed on a more consistent basis than I have ever seen, they will re think his stats and realize Oliver still makes plays Williams can only dream of. 

I am not saying Williams is bad by any means, but putting him in the same realm as Oliver is plain disrespectful to Oliver and probably Williams as well as a player. You're expecting him to be as good as Oliver, and there isn't player that plays at his level. I truly believe Oliver is a generational prospect, it's hard for me to even say after last year I was touting two of those guys (Nelson & Barkley). 

People will feel stupid choosing someone not named Bosa over Oliver (even then it would be hard for me to choose Bosa over Oliver. 

[MSURacerDT55]

23 minutes ago, ClutchDJ said:

Lets also factor Quinnen is going against much better competition. I can also turn the table around & say if Quinnen was going against the same competition Oliver was going against, he would have twice the production. Hypotheticals <.

 

Maybe & you & others just don’t get it. It’s okay, everyone will see & learn.

 

I know how great Oliver is. I know how “underrated” his numbers even while beingt double teamed. I don’t see it as a reach at all if Oliver were to go higher in the draft than Quinnen, but it’s completely asinine to believe that Quinnen isn’t on his level or maybe a very few steps above it.

Oliver was the #6 overall prospect coming out in his class it's almost guaranteed he would double his numbers if he were at Bama, what would Williams do if he were at Houston? Would you even hear from him like you would Oliver? how would he operate with double and triple teams?

Also competition has nothing to do with individual talent and how it projects to the next level, you are totally missing the point , ok he is dominating single blocks and making a few plays that doesn't project you as an stud on the next level, or better than Oliver for that matter. 

[YogiBiz]

Also @ClutchDJ Williams' pretty much only job is to beat his one man and get into the backfield. From what I have seen he's not asked to do much of anything else but beat ONE guy. If he couldn't beat one guy on a consistent basis, he wouldn't be draft-able. That being said, Williams does have likable traits, but I would be shocked if he succeeded in the same environment as Oliver has dominated. 

If Williams goes before Oliver, that is a fire-able offense for any GM. If Williams doesn't produce at or near the same level Oliver will (which he won't unless Oliver looses a leg or something), he will be viewed as a bust by pretty much any casual fan and probably even some hardcore fans, no matter how well he does. He'll always be the inferior talent picked before Oliver. 

[ClutchDJ]

17 minutes ago, YogiBiz said:

LOL at Williams being double teamed. He rarely ever sees one of those. Have you actually watched either of Oliver's or William's Tape? Because Williams hand usage isn't better than Oliver, he just has to be more technical than Oliver, who just basically explodes into and then past O-line man. Oliver is straight SPECIAL. I have yet to see any of Oliver's competition force him to use a "counter" move. Oliver should put identical numbers up to Donald at the combine, and when people literally see he is double and triple teamed on a more consistent basis than I have ever seen, they will re think his stats and realize Oliver still makes plays Williams can only dream of. 

I am not saying Williams is bad by any means, but putting him in the same realm as Oliver is plain disrespectful to Oliver and probably Williams as well as a player. You're expecting him to be as good as Oliver, and there isn't player that plays at his level. I truly believe Oliver is a generational prospect, it's hard for me to even say after last year I was touting two of those guys (Nelson & Barkley). 

People will feel stupid choosing someone not named Bosa over Oliver (even then it would be hard for me to choose Bosa over Oliver. 

Whew, I stopped right here. 

 

Agree to disagree.

[YogiBiz]

4 minutes ago, ClutchDJ said:

Whew, I stopped right here. 

 

Agree to disagree.

Yeah I figured you would, seeing how any further discussion about their hand usage would require you to actually look at both of their tape. And not make a conclusion from just watching Live Alabama games.  

 

Also if you finished reading my post you would clearly see why I said what I did.