Training Camp 2018 discussion

[Danand]

The fanbase who supports Flacco mostly react to the people who somehow want to make Flacco worse than he is - and therefor jumps to the constant irrational arguments to why he is so bad.

If these arguments should have any warrant, the Ravens should have by far the strongest roster in the league over 10 years to counter Flaccos apparent ineptitude.

As Dreamkid mentioned, the Ravens organization is moving on because the arrow after 2014 doesn't point up but down - this is very much because of injuries, as one of Flaccos strengths was staying healthy. If he continues to get dinged up, concussed etc. we will see Lamar Jackson. Until then Flacco gets a chance to prove he can still do what he has done for 10 years, keeping the Ravens a contender no matter the injuries, the Dean Pees defense collapses.

 

[drd23]

Not sure there has been a more repetitive argument about the Ravens over the last 5 years as the one about Flacco and its one I have no interest in participating in.

Please keep the arguments civil

[paraven]

15 minutes ago, drd23 said:

Not sure there has been a more repetitive argument about the Ravens over the last 5 years as the one about Flacco and its one I have no interest in participating in.

Please keep the arguments civil

i dont  care what the other mods say about you, your a smart man

[DreamKid]

1 hour ago, drd23 said:

Not sure there has been a more repetitive argument about the Ravens over the last 5 years as the one about Flacco and its one I have no interest in participating in.

Agreed. The club is in such an exciting place and the Flacco discussion is about #17856 on the list of topics I care about.

Besides this a training camp thread....

[Danand]

6 hours ago, DreamKid said:

Agreed. The club is in such an exciting place and the Flacco discussion is about #17856 on the list of topics I care about.

Besides this a training camp thread....

Guess we are just warming up to discuss something relevant. In some way, the Flacco discussion is relevant as it shows peoples opinion about our overall roster status.

Going in to this season, I believe we have a high floor but not a single elite player outside of a healthy Yanda. There is plenty of potential, but we seriously need breakout players who can make that final sack, interception, catch to end the game.

Depending on injuries, we might already see some sort of roster shuffling towards a youth movement. In 2 years, we could basically say goodbye to Flacco, Yanda, Jimmy Smith, Weddle and have a young team who can develop with Lamar Jackson.

[DreamKid]

2 minutes ago, Danand said:

Going in to this season, I believe we have a high floor but not a single elite player outside of a healthy Yanda. There is plenty of potential, but we seriously need breakout players who can make that final sack, interception, catch to end the game.

I feel like Yanda is beyond elite, like if he's the the criteria everyone seems way worse in comparison lol.

Jimmy Smith really only got bested by Nuk last year and I have him down as the best WR in the game. So maybe slide him and obviously Tuck and maybe Koch into that elite category.

You're right though, we do have way more potential than we do consistently producing star players.

The big thing I'm looking for this training camp is for the FO to nut up. Veteran players have been given too much favor in the club these past couple of seasons. I'm sick of it. 

It's going to be a trial by fire for a guy like Orlando Brown Jr in camp. He has to go up against Sizzle, Judon, Bowser, T-Will and ZDS. It'll be good for him in the end though, he'll be forced to grow quickly.

[Danand]

47 minutes ago, DreamKid said:

I feel like Yanda is beyond elite, like if he's the the criteria everyone seems way worse in comparison lol.

Jimmy Smith really only got bested by Nuk last year and I have him down as the best WR in the game. So maybe slide him and obviously Tuck and maybe Koch into that elite category.

You're right though, we do have way more potential than we do consistently producing star players.

The big thing I'm looking for this training camp is for the FO to nut up. Veteran players have been given too much favor in the club these past couple of seasons. I'm sick of it. 

It's going to be a trial by fire for a guy like Orlando Brown Jr in camp. He has to go up against Sizzle, Judon, Bowser, T-Will and ZDS. It'll be good for him in the end though, he'll be forced to grow quickly.

As one of the fiercest Brown supporters, I really hope he pulls through and I think he will be given every chance to do so with Hurst being the emergency backup.

With no injuries at all, our roster looks stacked and ready to go with the second inside linebacker spot as the only real weakness and a lot of question marks regarding the oline and wide receiver group. I do hope they will be able to keep some of the explosive young talent like Tim White or a Janarion Grant who both have a little bit of X-factor. 

Also we have to be able to put Tim Williams and Bowser to work this year, which will most likely be the end of a McClellan which would figure in well with your point about us having to move forward from versatile but mostly serviceable veterans.

[Danand]

Apparently Yanda will start the season on the pup list. This  will open at training camp spot for one of the players on the bubble - maybe eluemanor will get a bigger chance to prove himself.

[DreamKid]

 

[DreamKid]

Tony Jefferson, Hayden Hurst, and Willie Snead have presser interviews up on the team site.

Summing up-

Tony Jefferson: "Wink is someone I can actually communicate with, and he actually understands how I'm best utilized". Tony really didn't make it subtle. He even mentioned that last year was the first time he had ever been asked to take on certain roles, and he has learned from his mistakes in those new roles. Tony said he's been watching tape of himself to see what he needs to correct and watching tape of Harrison Smith to try and become better. What it all sounds like is he's happy to be free of a certain retard, and he's looking forward to getting back to what he's good at, but on the limited occasions he's asked to do something or perform a role outside his skill wheelhouse he understands he has to be better than he was and will be.

Hayden Hurst: Hayden has a ton of confidence, and I like how he's focused on becoming a target for Flacco specifically rather than trying to become the template rookie TE. He's mature  enough to understand the former is more important. I also like that he appreciates and understands the investment the club has made in him. You can tell he's anxious to prove how good he can be and wants the expectations to be high. A big contrast from Perriman.

Willie Snead: The Willie Snead presser was the most entertaining. He unknowingly kept giving Flacco all these backhanded compliments, it was hilarious. Snead did confirm that Flacco hosted two separate throwing sessions with the WRs and TEs. Something that was a point of contention and conspiracy for some reason on many other Raven boards. Also he reiterated what every player has been referencing which is the air of confidence and momentum surrounding the club and it's players. Everyone feels a special season is on the horizon. 

 

I should also mention that nearly every defensive player, including Jefferson today, has referenced the return of Tavon Young being huge and the implication it has for a special group of corners. An interesting story line to follow into camp will be that of Brandon Carr who will be battling against Canady for the 4th spot on the depth chart. A first for him in his career, and a unique position for a team tortured by the CB position for years to find themselves in.

[DreamKid]

 

[Danand]

Dean Pees was criticized most of his time in Baltimore. Every year however, I heard/read how much the players liked him. Now all of a sudden several players throw him and his scheme under the bus, which to me either seems like a way to excuse them for the unclutch performances the last couple of years, a support for their new DC and his changes or simply that they weren't happy with how Pees ran things.

The criticism is just very convenient when the coach is no longer here.

What we can say however is, that Dean Pees and his defense put up respectable numbers over his years albeit he had every reason to do so with the huge amount of cap and draft capital we invested in the defense while providing the offense with a patchwork of veteran players and low draft picks. The Dean Pees defense was just at its best playing "downhill", putting up stats when we where ahead on the scoreboard. The 2017 games against the Lions is a good example. The struggle to close games has unfortunately also been a trademark. It is this trademark Wink has to erase, otherwise the change will have little impact.

It will be nice to see if he is one of those coaches who simplifies things and try to allow his players to play fast. From my own playing experience, that will sometimes lead to situations, where the defense shows its hand but 11 players know exactly what to do and execute better (aka Free Tim Williams)

[AFlaccoSeagulls]

8 hours ago, Danand said:

Dean Pees was criticized most of his time in Baltimore. Every year however, I heard/read how much the players liked him. Now all of a sudden several players throw him and his scheme under the bus, which to me either seems like a way to excuse them for the unclutch performances the last couple of years, a support for their new DC and his changes or simply that they weren't happy with how Pees ran things.

The criticism is just very convenient when the coach is no longer here.

What we can say however is, that Dean Pees and his defense put up respectable numbers over his years albeit he had every reason to do so with the huge amount of cap and draft capital we invested in the defense while providing the offense with a patchwork of veteran players and low draft picks. The Dean Pees defense was just at its best playing "downhill", putting up stats when we where ahead on the scoreboard. The 2017 games against the Lions is a good example. The struggle to close games has unfortunately also been a trademark. It is this trademark Wink has to erase, otherwise the change will have little impact.

It will be nice to see if he is one of those coaches who simplifies things and try to allow his players to play fast. From my own playing experience, that will sometimes lead to situations, where the defense shows its hand but 11 players know exactly what to do and execute better (aka Free Tim Williams)

We also had a tendency to beat up on bad teams and get our *** whooped by any sort of competent offense, though, when Dean Pees was around. Any DC worth their salt should be able to put up respectable numbers in this organization with how much we invest in defense. Even Greg Mattison put up respectable numbers.

[AFlaccoSeagulls]

Starting offense:

Nick Boyle as a starting TE is not something that makes me excited about that group. Hurst at RT is a freaking nightmare waiting to happen. I hope Brown can win that spot.

Starting defense:

Only real surprise here is Willie Henry starting over Michael Pierce at DT. I don't get the appeal with Henry. He's an okay pass rusher, but what else does he even do? Michael Pierce is an elite run stopper.

[DreamKid]

To no one's surprise.