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Training Camp 2018


big_palooka

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57 minutes ago, dante9876 said:

Lol. Go look at the posts and threads from when penn held out. The whole narrative have change on penn in basically 3 weeks of offseason. He is the greatest team first guy ever now. ?????. 

I didn't want to bring this up lol. 

At 35, he's going to do say whatever he can to keep cashing game checks 

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44 minutes ago, RaidersAreOne said:

Miller is beating whoever we have on either side. Every pass rusher moves around lots too. This who LT being the end all is outdated compared to what it once was. We have Lee Smith who is essentially another Oline, Keith Smith is one of a blocker and Marshawn is one of the better blocking RBs. Gruden isn't going to leave Miller on an island guys.

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It's not outdated. Fundamentally you don't understand that. The reason people put their best pass protector on the left side is that pressure from the left side is devastating because it can't be seen by the qb, meaning they're more likely to get hurt or strip sacked. The best pass rushers go on the right side because left tackles are better and teams would rather give up pressure on the left side than the right. The reason pass rushers move around is to get the best matchup. Von Miller won't "move around" if Kolton Miller is on the left side. He'll rush only against him because it's a vulnerable matchup.

If you're gonna do all that, we can do it on the right side.

 

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^^^ Some good points about Miller. I suppose much of this will come down to what the coaches feel would be best for his development. And I don’t know which is best:

a) let him sit behind Penn until he’s both physically and technically ready to take over at LT, having had a year to develop 

b) put him in at LT and let him ‘learn on the job’ whilst upgrading the RT position with Penn. This would enable you to offer more support on the pitch to Miller as Penn would need less than whichever RT we would have playing there if Penn is at LT

Hard to know which would be better for the team now a solid well. Option a) reduces the risk of Miller contributing to sacks if he’s not ready but it means we have to put up with whichever turnstile gets trundled out at RT each week. Option b) will almost certainly lead to more pressure on Carr’s blindside and Miller will inevitably get beat by some of the elite pass rushers we face. But it does give us our strongest 5 olineman on the pitch and our right side becomes a strength with Penn there.

It’s gonna be interesting to see how it plays out.

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Just have been thinking about our DL. Imagine the pass rushing group of: Mack, Hall, Hurst, Irvin. With Key rotating in. Even our backup DTs are decent rotation guys. Cowser is an alright backup and Calhoun looks much better from reports as well. We could very well see some INTs this year.

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40 minutes ago, Silver&Black88 said:

Just have been thinking about our DL. Imagine the pass rushing group of: Mack, Hall, Hurst, Irvin. With Key rotating in. Even our backup DTs are decent rotation guys. Cowser is an alright backup and Calhoun looks much better from reports as well. We could very well see some INTs this year.

You are right. The group looks better and we might have some pass rush, which could/should lead to INTs...

Cowser and especially Calhoun might not be on that roster tho...

Cowser was already tried out at ILB in the offseason, now he went back to DE and looked solid VS 3rd stringers, but I think he doesn't have a real "home" and could be cut easily. Calhoun showed some promise, but overall still a missed draft pick IMO.

At DE Mack, Irvin, Key and Carradine are locks IMO. Fadol Brown looks solid too and we still have Frostee, so even if we carry 5 DE's Cowser and or Calhoun will have a hard time getting on the roster IMO.

At DT we will have a similarly heated battle IMO.

Edwards, Jelly, Hurst and Hall seems to be locks. Rubin, Hester and Soto will battle for 1 spot if we carry 5. Eddie will arrive also midseason...

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8 hours ago, reddevil said:

^^^ Some good points about Miller. I suppose much of this will come down to what the coaches feel would be best for his development. And I don’t know which is best:

a) let him sit behind Penn until he’s both physically and technically ready to take over at LT, having had a year to develop 

b) put him in at LT and let him ‘learn on the job’ whilst upgrading the RT position with Penn. This would enable you to offer more support on the pitch to Miller as Penn would need less than whichever RT we would have playing there if Penn is at LT

Hard to know which would be better for the team now a solid well. Option a) reduces the risk of Miller contributing to sacks if he’s not ready but it means we have to put up with whichever turnstile gets trundled out at RT each week. Option b) will almost certainly lead to more pressure on Carr’s blindside and Miller will inevitably get beat by some of the elite pass rushers we face. But it does give us our strongest 5 olineman on the pitch and our right side becomes a strength with Penn there.

It’s gonna be interesting to see how it plays out.

Good points and it's a legitimate concern about who plays OT against some very, very good edge rushers. 

My initial thoughts would be to keep Miller on the left, and if he can show he's at a reasonable level (and only then) let him start there with Penn on the right. As he'd be more vulnerable, I would assist him against the likes of Von Miller with TE help and RB/FB help too. This is of course if he shows in real game situations that he can handle it. I would think Penn would be ok on an island on the right.

If KM is struggling at LT against decent competition in pre-season then I'm certainly not taking the chance of trotting him out there against the NFL's elite pass rushers. I'd start Penn at LT and the winner of the RT battle and maybe help the RT with a TE or chip blocks etc. I'd know Carr has a quick release but we don't want to confine him into being the QB he was last year where he just seemed to panic and get rid of the ball so swiftly against a very quick internal clock. I'm sure Gruden will want to keep some longer developing plays in to keep the D on their toes and to utilise Bryant and we can only do that with adequate protection.

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12 minutes ago, Darbsk said:

Good points and it's a legitimate concern about who plays OT against some very, very good edge rushers. 

My initial thoughts would be to keep Miller on the left, and if he can show he's at a reasonable level (and only then) let him start there with Penn on the right. As he'd be more vulnerable, I would assist him against the likes of Von Miller with TE help and RB/FB help too. This is of course if he shows in real game situations that he can handle it. I would think Penn would be ok on an island on the right.

If KM is struggling at LT against decent competition in pre-season then I'm certainly not taking the chance of trotting him out there against the NFL's elite pass rushers. I'd start Penn at LT and the winner of the RT battle and maybe help the RT with a TE or chip blocks etc. I'd know Carr has a quick release but we don't want to confine him into being the QB he was last year where he just seemed to panic and get rid of the ball so swiftly against a very quick internal clock. I'm sure Gruden will want to keep some longer developing plays in to keep the D on their toes and to utilise Bryant and we can only do that with adequate protection.

 

There are every few LTs that can handle an elite pass rusher one on one.

Just look at how many times Mack gets doubled.

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1 hour ago, Bitty 2.0 said:
2 hours ago, Darbsk said:

Good points and it's a legitimate concern about who plays OT against some very, very good edge rushers. 

My initial thoughts would be to keep Miller on the left, and if he can show he's at a reasonable level (and only then) let him start there with Penn on the right. As he'd be more vulnerable, I would assist him against the likes of Von Miller with TE help and RB/FB help too. This is of course if he shows in real game situations that he can handle it. I would think Penn would be ok on an island on the right.

If KM is struggling at LT against decent competition in pre-season then I'm certainly not taking the chance of trotting him out there against the NFL's elite pass rushers. I'd start Penn at LT and the winner of the RT battle and maybe help the RT with a TE or chip blocks etc. I'd know Carr has a quick release but we don't want to confine him into being the QB he was last year where he just seemed to panic and get rid of the ball so swiftly against a very quick internal clock. I'm sure Gruden will want to keep some longer developing plays in to keep the D on their toes and to utilise Bryant and we can only do that with adequate protection.

 

There are every few LTs that can handle an elite pass rusher one on one.

Just look at how many times Mack gets doubled.

True, but you're not going to worry about helping your guy out if the play is a quick dump off or a 2 second slant or something. Also, I can imagine Gruden, if he sees Von opposite KM would want to run Lynch and Smith right down his throat so you'd only be actually adding help on the medium and longer range passing plays. And of course, even your very best tackle or guard will still be beaten at times by a Mack or a Von.

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6 minutes ago, Humble_Beast said:

could Cowser and Calhoun play their way on the team? I had written those guys off, but they looked good in game 1. Sounds like Calhoun having a good camp

Cowser anytime I've seen him even in games last year seemed to make plays.

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11 hours ago, Darbsk said:

Good points and it's a legitimate concern about who plays OT against some very, very good edge rushers. 

My initial thoughts would be to keep Miller on the left, and if he can show he's at a reasonable level (and only then) let him start there with Penn on the right. As he'd be more vulnerable, I would assist him against the likes of Von Miller with TE help and RB/FB help too. This is of course if he shows in real game situations that he can handle it. I would think Penn would be ok on an island on the right.

If KM is struggling at LT against decent competition in pre-season then I'm certainly not taking the chance of trotting him out there against the NFL's elite pass rushers. I'd start Penn at LT and the winner of the RT battle and maybe help the RT with a TE or chip blocks etc. I'd know Carr has a quick release but we don't want to confine him into being the QB he was last year where he just seemed to panic and get rid of the ball so swiftly against a very quick internal clock. I'm sure Gruden will want to keep some longer developing plays in to keep the D on their toes and to utilise Bryant and we can only do that with adequate protection.

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He will struggle if not in preseason, in the regular season when he faces the death row we go up against. I say this with certainty because if he doesn't struggle, he'd be in a handful of left tackles in the last 10 years who came in and were very good players from day 1. It's one of the hardest positions to play in the modern NFL. Would much rather have Penn in from day 1 on the left side with Kolton learning. Honestly, I know he's more raw, but he needs to be able to play RT if he wants to contribute this year. I'd honestly redshirt him a year or use him as a swing guy unless our RT situation is so bad we need to play him at left to shift Penn over.

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8 hours ago, RaidersAreOne said:

Griff Whalen has been impressing coaches a lot and could make the 53. Apparently the competition between him and and Switz is close.

I believe he was on the first team in the first preseason game. Whalen is a veteran's veteran. Not only has he been in the league for 6 seasons, he played in a pro-style offense at Stanford. The competition at receiver is looking pretty stiff. It'll be interesting to see if Switzer's athleticism beats out Whalen's experience. Who knows, maybe both make the team.

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