buno67 Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 21 hours ago, CBrownsman said: I have a hard time saying that years 1 and 2 are a complete tear down. Yes we did get rid of bad contracts, and we opened up a ton of salary cap. That being said no one is complaining about having Ogbah, Schobert, Kindred, DeValve, Drango, Higgins, Garrett, Peppers, Njoku, Ogunjobi, Brantley, or Gonzalez on the team. That's possibly 9 starting caliber players in 2 years. Most teams would dream of that kind of output. Also I don't hear many complaints about locking up Kirksey and Bitonio, about trading for Jamie Collins and extending him. About signing Kevin Zeitler or JC Tretter instead of Cam Erving. Our roster was a mess, we weren't going to be competing long term with Tremon Williams, Donte Whitner, Carlos Dansby, Randy Starks, Desmond Bryant, Paul Kruger all starting on Defense. On offense we had Johnny Manziel, Brian Hartline? often injured Jordan Cameron, Cam Erving. We had years of bad decision making and constant turnover. We needed to get rid of the spare parts (which we virtually did in one year), the problem for fans was Sashi wasn't willing to bring in random people to compete here and take time and learning experience away from the young guys he wanted to build the team around. But its not like we weren't trying to bring in guys, if you remember we offered Tony Jefferson more than Baltimore did, he just didn't want to come to this organization. But just because he wasn't willing to bring a ton of guys in to bad contracts just to try and gain more wins right away didn't mean that we weren't building this team. But make no mistake about it, we have been building since the day Sashi took over. Now we are just throwing everything we can at trying to win some now because fans and more importantly ownership is getting restless. EJ Gaines, Michael Kendricks, Tyrod Taylor, Carlos Hyde, How many of these guys are going to be here next year? I give Dorsey a LOT of credit, he has done a great job seemingly making Cleveland look like a better destination, and signing guys to team friendly contracts so if we decide we don't have a need for Chris Hubbard, Chris Smith, Terrence Mitchell, TJ Carrie, etc, we can cut and run from them and look to build elsewhere. It was always going to take a long time to go from a dysfunctional franchise with what was one of the worst drafting GM's in our recent history (Farmer), that doesn't mean we started recovering just this year though... Can’t respond to it all because I’m in my phone. But looking at last year alone, showed it was a tear down and not a rebuild. Weeks before the season you release your best corner because of a contract, get rid of a solid starting QB and keep a QB room full of guys with zero wins under their belt. Yeah I know they added some talent but to me it was still a tear down. I’m not saying it’s a bad thing but that it was a tear down before it was a rebuild. Sashi did leave some good But he left some bad. Sashi should of been an assistant GM first before he was ever a full time GM i would say they are just trying to throw everything they can at the wall and seeing if it will stick. To me dorsy made a lot of great moves and gave out contracts that at are easy to get out of. Something past GM and dorsy himself didn’t do in years past. Hell years past he only moves we seemed to make were throwing money at overrated or over the hill players. This time it was younger guys with potential Sashi will always been know for this team If it turns around with Dorsey. Just like wth the 76ers. I’m trusting the process and trust it even more with Dorsey at the helm sash took the house and ripped it down to the foundation and re-poured the cement and started to put he frame. Now Dorsey got brought in and finished the framing and put up the dry wall. Let’s hope he paints this thing a beautiful color orange, but not too orange... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaWg_LB. Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 On 8/7/2018 at 2:28 PM, Humble_Beast said: Mack for Myles Garrett and a 2nd? Mack for browns 2019 1st 2019 2nd 2019 3rd (Pats) 2020 1st 2021 2nd So let me get this correct.....you want us to trade you a budding superstar (or two with Ogbah (vs the 3rd rounder) and a 2nd round pick...I had to audibly laugh when I typed that. You are aware that Garrett has looked more dominant than Mack when healthy as this point in their careers? Mack is 5 years older than Garrett..not to mention, smaller, weaker and less and explosive than Myles Garret.... http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/khalil-mack?id=2543463 http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/myles-garrett?id=2557965 WOW, Just WOW.......I think I just found the inspirational picture of how this trade suggestion came up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humble_Beast Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 11 minutes ago, DaWg_LB. said: So let me get this correct.....you want us to trade you a budding superstar (or two with Ogbah (vs the 3rd rounder) and a 2nd round pick...I had to audibly laugh when I typed that. You are aware that Garrett has looked more dominant than Mack when healthy as this point in their careers? Mack is 5 years older than Garrett..not to mention, smaller, weaker and less and explosive than Myles Garret.... http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/khalil-mack?id=2543463 http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/myles-garrett?id=2557965 WOW, Just WOW.......I think I just found the inspirational picture of how this trade suggestion came up. Mack is stronger faster and the better player.. you sounding like a bias homer.... I'll take Garrett but that is potential, so I WOULD want more in a 2nd rounder.... Mack is the only player in NFL history to be an all pro the same season at two positions. He lead a team to the playoffs on his back... name me the last time a Browns player has done ?????????........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaWg_LB. Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 On 8/7/2018 at 2:41 PM, Humble_Beast said: one pick and Garrett... Mack is a top ten player in the NFL, when if the last time the Browns had one of those? you guys have a good young core, Mack could take your defense to the next level. An all pro edge rusher entering in his prime, no injury concerns, no character issues??? excuse me, for think his value is high Joe Thomas....was a top 3 player at his position. (and has been for the past 10 years) Joel Bintono is a top 10 player at his position. Last Season Joe Schobert was a top 10 Performer at MLB last season. (I'd like to see him repeat it before calling him a top 10 player at the position period) Any other Question you need answering my friend? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NudeTayne Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 33 minutes ago, DaWg_LB. said: So let me get this correct.....you want us to trade you a budding superstar (or two with Ogbah (vs the 3rd rounder) and a 2nd round pick...I had to audibly laugh when I typed that. You are aware that Garrett has looked more dominant than Mack when healthy as this point in their careers? Mack is 5 years older than Garrett..not to mention, smaller, weaker and less and explosive than Myles Garret.... http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/khalil-mack?id=2543463 http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/myles-garrett?id=2557965 WOW, Just WOW.......I think I just found the inspirational picture of how this trade suggestion came up. Here is a heartwarming documentary about @Humble_Beast's forum takes: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buno67 Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 30 minutes ago, Humble_Beast said: Mack is stronger faster and the better player.. you sounding like a bias homer.... I'll take Garrett but that is potential, so I WOULD want more in a 2nd rounder.... Mack is the only player in NFL history to be an all pro the same season at two positions. He lead a team to the playoffs on his back... name me the last time a Browns player has done ?????????........ Tim couch in 02 lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaWg_LB. Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 9 minutes ago, Humble_Beast said: Mack is stronger faster and the better player.. you sounding like a bias homer.... I'll take Garrett but that is potential, so I WOULD want more in a 2nd rounder.... Mack is the only player in NFL history to be an all pro the same season at two positions. He lead a team to the playoffs on his back... name me the last time a Browns player has done ?????????........ That is simply not true.....I'm not arguing who has produced the better stats over the past 5 years at the NFL level.....I am saying that comparing the two at the same points in their careers, Garret has looked more dominant. Mack is the better NFL player at this point...(at one point Carson Palmer was a better NFL QB than Arron Rogers too.....) And its simple facts that Garrett was SIGNIFICANTLY Stronger than Mack coming out (not to mention he out weighs him by 20+ lbs and is a couple inches taller) and if we say play speed vs timed 40...I think Garret is a fast as mack while still being 20+ lbs heavier as far as playing speed is concerned. I watched Garrett starting his Jr. year at James Martin HS...and watched him the entire time at Texas AM. Now the first time I heard of Khali was his Jr year and started watching him then.....so I've watched both players for more than half their football lives...and next to Julius Peppers, Dieon Sanders, Vernon Davis and Bo Jackson......I have never seen Athletics like Garret Posses...and this is my opinon, maybe your eyes tell you something different, but from an agility, speed, size and strength standpoint...my opion favors Garrett, so that we can debate. The RECORDED numbers DEFINITELY show who is more athletic....unless you like arguing with facts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buno67 Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 22 minutes ago, DaWg_LB. said: Joe Thomas....was a top 3 player at his position. (and has been for the past 10 years) Joel Bintono is a top 10 player at his position. Last Season Joe Schobert was a top 10 Performer at MLB last season. (I'd like to see him repeat it before calling him a top 10 player at the position period) Any other Question you need answering my friend? To defend him he said Mack was a top10 player, not top10 in his position. I wouldn’t say he is top10. Maybe top20 or top15. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NudeTayne Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 4 minutes ago, buno67 said: To defend him he said Mack was a top10 player, not top10 in his position. I wouldn’t say he is top10. Maybe top20 or top15. Let's all just agree that Mack is top ten on the Oakland Raiders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaWg_LB. Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 26 minutes ago, buno67 said: To defend him he said Mack was a top10 player, not top10 in his position. I wouldn’t say he is top10. Maybe top20 or top15. you are correct....my apologies for not reading the question correctly. I would modify my answer to be: Joe Thomas IMO (best LT in Football is a top 10 player in the NFL IMO) and Josh Gordon in 2013....anyone who could lead the league in receiving yards in 14 games, with the Jason Campbell and Brandon Weeden.....IJS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FGK Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 3 hours ago, buno67 said: Can’t respond to it all because I’m in my phone. But looking at last year alone, showed it was a tear down and not a rebuild. Weeks before the season you release your best corner because of a contract, get rid of a solid starting QB and keep a QB room full of guys with zero wins under their belt. Yeah I know they added some talent but to me it was still a tear down. I’m not saying it’s a bad thing but that it was a tear down before it was a rebuild. Sashi did leave some good But he left some bad. Sashi should of been an assistant GM first before he was ever a full time GM i would say they are just trying to throw everything they can at the wall and seeing if it will stick. To me dorsey made a lot of great moves and gave out contracts that at are easy to get out of. Something past GM and dorsey himself didn’t do in years past. Hell years past he only moves we seemed to make were throwing money at overrated or over the hill players. This time it was younger guys with potential Sashi will always been know for this team If it turns around with Dorsey. Just like with the 76ers. I’m trusting the process and trust it even more with Dorsey at the helm sash took the house and ripped it down to the foundation and re-poured the cement and started to put he frame. Now Dorsey got brought in and finished the framing and put up the dry wall. Let’s hope he paints this thing a beautiful color orange, but not too orange... Bold - This is really where you are? You feel like calling Brock freaking Osweiler a "solid starting QB" is rational? Italics - Being an AGM would have had no effect whatsoever. We had a plan/vision and committed to it. Unless you're saying the dude would've learned to not actually commit to a vision, which in this league I guess is possible. You're either on board with the vision or not, saying he needed more job experience makes no sense. Underlined - I mean, I like the contract structure as much as the next guy, but this is only true on some of the signings. I mean, Terrence Mitchell, TJ Carrie, etc. I did like Dorsey's moves in general, but it makes no sense to dump on Sashi for the rebuild and praise Dorsey because those moves were only possible because of the cap space and picks Sashi built up. And the plan was ALWAYS to start competing again in year three, after BUILDING a foundation of young players by getting them experience at the cost of wins in years 1-2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buno67 Posted August 10, 2018 Share Posted August 10, 2018 3 hours ago, freakygeniuskid said: Bold - This is really where you are? You feel like calling Brock freaking Osweiler a "solid starting QB" is rational? Italics - Being an AGM would have had no effect whatsoever. We had a plan/vision and committed to it. Unless you're saying the dude would've learned to not actually commit to a vision, which in this league I guess is possible. You're either on board with the vision or not, saying he needed more job experience makes no sense. Underlined - I mean, I like the contract structure as much as the next guy, but this is only true on some of the signings. I mean, Terrence Mitchell, TJ Carrie, etc. I did like Dorsey's moves in general, but it makes no sense to dump on Sashi for the rebuild and praise Dorsey because those moves were only possible because of the cap space and picks Sashi built up. And the plan was ALWAYS to start competing again in year three, after BUILDING a foundation of young players by getting them experience at the cost of wins in years 1-2. im talking about Josh McCown lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mind Character Posted August 10, 2018 Share Posted August 10, 2018 During the game, early on just looking at Antonio Callaway's body composition I could tell he was too heavy... thighs.... arms look flabby and he has a little gut... I watched all his film at Florida where he was a much more fit and toned... after a year away from football he is still not in play shape and needs to put in extra work to be in better conditioning... Throughout the game he was dying of fatigue and exhaustion out there... barely making it back to the line... unable to run urgent routes... He's got to step up his conditioning if he's going to be a real playmaker... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OhioG Posted August 10, 2018 Share Posted August 10, 2018 1 hour ago, Mind Character said: During the game, early on just looking at Antonio Callaway's body composition I could tell he was too heavy... thighs.... arms look flabby and he has a little gut... I watched all his film at Florida where he was a much more fit and toned... after a year away from football he is still not in play shape and needs to put in extra work to be in better conditioning... Throughout the game he was dying of fatigue and exhaustion out there... barely making it back to the line... unable to run urgent routes... He's got to step up his conditioning if he's going to be a real playmaker... Hes not ready to Bless Em Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buno67 Posted August 13, 2018 Share Posted August 13, 2018 I’m hearing today that Ratley is looking really good and is having a great camp. Saying that he has looked good enough that the Browns can’t stash him on the practice squad cause someone else will sign in off of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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