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Barr V Richardson?

Who Takes Priority   

22 members have voted

  1. 1. Barr or Richardson

    • Anthony Barr
    • Sheldon Richardson

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I’m sure we would get a pretty nice comp if we let Richardson walk, but we could get nothing if no team wants to trade for Waynes and we have to cut him.

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1 hour ago, CriminalMind said:

Considering that Waynes option was picked up previous (& possibly before Richardson was added as I can't remember), but it's essentially a team option if they want to keep Waynes for the 2019 season.

5th year options are only guaranteed for injury until the league year starts, so they're effectively a team option. But even if they don't plan to keep Waynes long term, they're not going to release him. There'd be no comp pick if they release him heading into 2019, before the option becomes guaranteed. If they want him gone after this year to save cap space, they should trade him instead (return would probably be less than Peters, who netted a 4th and a future 2nd, so maybe a 3rd?). Or they can keep him through 2019 on the 5th year option for ~$9M then let him walk, which probably nets a 3rd or 4th round comp pick, if he gets offered a CB1 contract elsewhere starting in 2020.

Waynes improved a lot last year, but I think he's still more like a good CB2 than a CB1. He's faced easier matchups than most corners because Rhodes shadows most WR1s. He does see a lot of targets but it's just easier to cover Ted Ginn, Martavis Bryant, Geronimo Allison, Mohamed Sanu and Nelson Agholor than Michael Thomas, Antonio Brown, Davante Adams, Julio Jones and Alshon Jeffrey. Waynes did well facing that CB2 level of competition last year, especially from about October through to the end of the regular season, but his year was bookended by a terrible start (in the Saints and Steelers games) and a weak finish in the playoffs, especially in the NFCCG. 

Waynes may be able to improve further. Reports from camp say he's playing even better than last year (which itself was an improvement from his first two years). I still want to see him recognize and react to breaking routes faster, and make more aggressive plays to disrupt the catch point. It's good that he's become less grabby than he was especially in his rookie season, but now that he's able to stay closer to WRs with his feet, he needs to get better with his hand techniques so he isn't allowing as many receptions despite being right there as the catch is being made. 

Unless Waynes continues to improve this year, I think Hughes will soon surpass him as the 2nd best corner on the team. I'm very high on his potential to be an outside CB2 who moves to the slot in nickel (like Chris Harris or from Zimmer's days in Cincinnati, Leon Hall). I think Hughes may even be better than Rhodes within a couple of years. 

I think the Vikings will want to keep Rhodes/Waynes/Hughes as a starting trio for at least the 2 years left on Waynes' contract. I don't think there's a realistic chance that Alexander will suddenly improve to the point that he's better than Waynes, and I think Hughes will beat him out as a starter even as a rookie this year. Holton Hill seems like a great find so far but it's not likely that he'll be better than Waynes by year two either. 

Looking ahead to 2020 and beyond, I think they'll keep Waynes as long as he continues to improve and is willing to stay for a CB2 contract (something like $9-10M, similar to Amukamara in Chicago and Alford in Atlanta). I'm not sure they'll be able to afford to pay him much more than that, unless some of the older vets on defense (Griffen, Joseph, even Rhodes who'll be 30 that year) take pay cuts. If they do let him go, that'll be Hill's 3rd year and he should be ready to be a full time starter. 

Rhodes/Waynes/Hughes or Rhodes/Hughes/Waynes has the potential to be one of the best CB1-3 groups in recent years, up there with the 2015 Broncos (Talib, Harris, Roby). With Alexander and Hill for depth, to say nothing of Newman if he plays one more year, this is one of the best position groups in the league. 

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Posted (edited)

if Barr is retained, most likely scenario is, we let Richardson walk (collect 3rd round comp), then maybe let Waynes walk the following year (collect 3rd round comp).

Yes, I know there is no comp pick if Waynes is cut before his 5th year option hours into affect. And exactly how much the Vikings could get for him on the trade market prior to the start of next season (but after this season), is uncertain as teams would likely be speculating that the Viking could be cutting him. 

But this current year we'll have the most talent on this roster (likely for next couple seasons). If they want to try & prolong "max talent level" (for these potential SB years) and they want to keep both Barr & Richardson & are comfortable with Hughes as CB2 (if he has a strong rookie campaign) then something might need to give.

Griffen\Joseph\Richardson\Hunter has the potential to be the best front 4 DL on the league. Lots of question marks behind them, let alone if the lose Richardson.

Edited by CriminalMind

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12 hours ago, CriminalMind said:

If Barr does get extended before the season.... Who'd you prioritize between Richardson (off good year with Vikings) or Waynes (similar to last year).

We would have alot more depth at CB in Hughes, Mac & Hill?, if Richardson was the higher priority

Depends on how the season goes. We first have to see how these young CB’s play, how Richardson and Johnson do in the defense this year.

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Posted (edited)

I think Richardson will be good this year but I’m not convinced he’ll get a big money long term contract extension, from the Vikings or elsewhere. He’ll be turning 29 in 2019 and even if he blows up the stat sheet with the Vikings in 2018 that’ll be his first big season since 2014. 

Richardson was better than his stats suggested last year in Seattle, but sack totals count when it comes to contract negotiations especially for a player who’s already been in his prime (unlike say Hunter negotiating a long term deal at the age of 23). 

So even if Richardson has a great year, I think he’s more likely to get a 2-3 year deal with guaranteed money only in the 1st year, and for closer to $10M per year than the Dareus/Short contracts at $15M+ — which were signed after several consecutive years of elite production. If he has a just respectable year in what should be ideal surroundings, his per year price might not rise at all from the current $8M, and may even drop.

He should be more productive in Minnesota with the surrounding cast and scheme, but it’s not like he was played out of position in Seattle, and their DL talent last year was pretty good (Clark, Bennett, Jarran Reed), so I don’t think we can count on a monster year from him.

And if not, it might well be cheaper to keep Richardson than Waynes, and he might be considered easier to replace, especially if Waynes continues to improve. 

Edited by Krauser

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