Earl Thomas

[warfelg]

Ok, I know this is usually Ororke territory, but Earl Thomas is really pushing for an extension or to be traded to somewhere that really wants him.  So I've been thinking, what if we can take care of two problems at once here?

Earl Thomas's contract is for $10,400,000 this year, and given how close to the cap we are, we need to come close to matching that in a move.

So:

Javon Hargrave - Not a fit here, best suited for a 4-3 front, and that rebuilding line would be a good fit for him.

Sean Davis - Replacement safety for them that fits the mold of a Seahawk secondary player in being big and long.

Ramon Foster - Now this is one that you would need them to 'waive' the physical on, but he boosts their long suffering line to improve.

Mike Hilton - I know this one will be slightly unpopular because people like him in the slot, but I think long term he won't beat out Sutton.

Josh Dobbs - A backup that will more fit the mode of Wilson than their current duo of backups.

2019 2nd round pick

2020 conditional 4th (can become a 3rd)

 

I know that all looks like a lot to give up with 3 starters, a slot corner, and a developmental backup with 2 picks.  But to me, that's worth it in that Davis isn't a great fit with us and same with Hargrave.  They won't be long term parts here, but the change of scenery could be great from them.  Foster is close to being replaced anyways, and gives Seattle a veteran on the line to help them this year.  The conditional pick would be on contract/playing time.

[Ward4HOF]

I personally, would make that deal, as I think Earl Thomas is  difference maker, and it seems almost 'wrong' to have a Steeler team with no dominant DB. Since our 70s' Dynasty on, we've almost always had at least one...Blount,  Shell,  Woodson,  Lake, Polamalu...we suffered for a few years with 'Burnt' Alexander and Flowers...Flowers was good, but not a game changer.

Anyway, that is one position we are severely lacking and all attempts to fix since Polamalu's retirement has ended in failure. Someone like Earl Thomas would easily mean more to use than the compilation of names/picks you provided.

I say, how about a S&T...if we can do that...we sign LeVeon (to a deal that Seattle will live with...hopefully one that Bell agrees with as well), and they send us Thomas and Penny. I know Thomas is special, but LeVeon is a 'legend in his own mind'...maybe we can sell that to Seattle!  Kills 2 birds with one stone. Gets LeVeon and his unreasonable demands out of here, and we get the playmaking safety we so sorely need!

See Warfelg, I out-O'rourke'd you!

[warfelg]

5 minutes ago, Ward4HOF said:

I personally, would make that deal, as I think Earl Thomas is  difference maker, and it seems almost 'wrong' to have a Steeler team with no dominant DB. Since our 70s' Dynasty on, we've almost always had at least one...Blount,  Shell,  Woodson,  Lake, Polamalu...we suffered for a few years with 'Burnt' Alexander and Flowers...Flowers was good, but not a game changer.

Anyway, that is one position we are severely lacking and all attempts to fix since Polamalu's retirement has ended in failure. Someone like Earl Thomas would easily mean more to use than the compilation of names/picks you provided.

I say, how about a S&T...if we can do that...we sign LeVeon (to a deal that Seattle will live with...hopefully one that Bell agrees with as well), and they send us Thomas and Penny. I know Thomas is special, but LeVeon is a 'legend in his own mind'...maybe we can sell that to Seattle!  Kills 2 birds with one stone. Gets LeVeon and his unreasonable demands out of here, and we get the playmaking safety we so sorely need!

See Warfelg, I out-O'rourke'd you!

Haha.  Well the hard part with Bell right now is his trade value is 0.  They would only be getting 1 guaranteed year of him.  They seem to want to rebuild on the fly, so I tried to put parts to that.  I almost considered Burns over Hilton TBH.

[3rivers]

3 hours ago, warfelg said:

Ok, I know this is usually Ororke territory, but Earl Thomas is really pushing for an extension or to be traded to somewhere that really wants him.  So I've been thinking, what if we can take care of two problems at once here?

Earl Thomas's contract is for $10,400,000 this year, and given how close to the cap we are, we need to come close to matching that in a move.

So:

Javon Hargrave - Not a fit here, best suited for a 4-3 front, and that rebuilding line would be a good fit for him.

Sean Davis - Replacement safety for them that fits the mold of a Seahawk secondary player in being big and long.

Ramon Foster - Now this is one that you would need them to 'waive' the physical on, but he boosts their long suffering line to improve.

Mike Hilton - I know this one will be slightly unpopular because people like him in the slot, but I think long term he won't beat out Sutton.

Josh Dobbs - A backup that will more fit the mode of Wilson than their current duo of backups.

2019 2nd round pick

2020 conditional 4th (can become a 3rd)

 

I know that all looks like a lot to give up with 3 starters, a slot corner, and a developmental backup with 2 picks.  But to me, that's worth it in that Davis isn't a great fit with us and same with Hargrave.  They won't be long term parts here, but the change of scenery could be great from them.  Foster is close to being replaced anyways, and gives Seattle a veteran on the line to help them this year.  The conditional pick would be on contract/playing time.

If Thomas is healthy, then it we have cap space (as well as space to sign another OL ) then it looks good to me.  The seahawks might be willing to let him go, they let other players go so why not try? Sadly our FO draftred players not suitable for our scheme, but if they would succeed on another team, then a trade might work for both teams. I would keep sutton, but send Dupree, Hargrave, Davis, Burns, Dobbs, Dupree and a draft pick. Of course it won't happen, but maybe try anyways.  You read that , try trading dupree twice I forgot about trading Bell, but let this not be a Hershel walker type deal for the seahawks, they can keep missing the playoffs 

[muncher]

this team doesnt need another me first malcontent.............especially one that wants 10+

[VigilantZombie]

Im not convinced that Thomas is a 'me first' guy. I think its more about every time one of Seattles guys is due to get paid (more often than not) they get rid of him. I think Earl isnt having it. If they want to keep him its going to be at a cost and more so, how is him wanting paid any different than any other elite player?

[warfelg]

40 minutes ago, wwhickok said:

Im not convinced that Thomas is a 'me first' guy. I think its more about every time one of Seattles guys is due to get paid (more often than not) they get rid of him. I think Earl isnt having it. If they want to keep him its going to be at a cost and more so, how is him wanting paid any different than any other elite player?

I think the trading is mostly he looks around him and sees everyone gone and just doesn't want to be a lame duck in the last year of this contract.

[Big Snack]

First off i doubt that is enough for seattle to move him since all the reports are they have a huge price for him. 2nd im not sure i want him at his current price let alone the pay raise that he is expecting to follow with any trade that is made. It is very apparent that the market for safeties is way down so i doubt anyone is giving him a pay raise when guys like vaccaro cant even find a vet minimum deal. I know he is on another level than anyone still not signed but the point still remains he is not getting a pay raise from seattle or any other team imo.

[warfelg]

6 hours ago, Big Snack said:

First off i doubt that is enough for seattle to move him since all the reports are they have a huge price for him. 2nd im not sure i want him at his current price let alone the pay raise that he is expecting to follow with any trade that is made. It is very apparent that the market for safeties is way down so i doubt anyone is giving him a pay raise when guys like vaccaro cant even find a vet minimum deal. I know he is on another level than anyone still not signed but the point still remains he is not getting a pay raise from seattle or any other team imo.

On the Vaccaro thing: that’s because he sucks, can’t defend the ball in the air, is injury prone, and is a liability with the new rule. 

 

Vaccaro is Mitchell. 

[43M]

Not really ororke territory because it actually makes sense, even if it is far-fetched and unrealistic. I would love for it to happen, but it won't... So I'm not going to go any deeper into it.

[Magnus-Viktor]

I wouldn't even consider making that trade.  That's akin to the Herschel Walker trade.  On a much lesser scale, but same basic premise.  It gutted a really good team to get that one star, and the star didn't fit or stay healthy.  

This is what it comes down to for me.

You trade Sean Davis and replace him with Earl Thomas.  No brainer.  Good deal.

Dobbs?  Who cares.  He sucks and we have 2 other backups anyway.

You trade Ramon Foster, and that promotes BJ Finney who is ok, and then where is your depth?  You have none.

You trade Mike Hilton, who is really good, and you're relying on Sutton or some other guy who has proven nothing?  No thanks.

Javon Hargrave?  I like him much more than most.  You replace him with a sloth like McCullers and no depth except a 7th rd rookie?  No thanks.

Throw in 2 building block picks?  For a guy that will be 30 next year, and is undersized and missed 7 games the last 2 years?  No thanks.  No way.

[Dcash4]

It’s giving up entirely too much for a guy who seems like he won’t be playing for his team (so they have no leverage and you should be lowballing) and seems to be upset about taking less before in his last contract as he comes into his next chance at a contract (most likely meaning he would only be here to finish his one year then hit the market a la Bell).

On top of that I’m not a fan of the guys we are trading. I’m not trading 4 starters. Even if you sell me on then not being stud starters you are demolishing the depth on a team that’s hopefully contending. You can’t bank on injuries, but Finney and Sutton being next man up makes us better.  

Hargrave is also a hard no for me. I understand he isn’t everyone’s cup of tea  here and while he may not be a true NT, this league isn’t going back to Casey Hampton types. Hargrave is a good player, a multi front usage guy in a sup package world, and Cheap and young. 

To me, it’s throwing away young guys. Davis, Hargrave, and Hilton all entering year 3, all flashing talent, all contributing, and all costing a fraction of Thomas. I understand trying to match the dollar for the trade, but this is using too many nickels and dimes to do it.  

Again, my opinion but if you wanted to go after Thomas a package of Gilbert, Davis, and a mid round pick makes more sense to me. Sell them on a young replacement for Thomas and more help for protecting their QB, with a year of team control, and match their comp pick for losing Thomas (which we recoup with Bell the following year).  We take a gamble on a one year for Thomas (but also get out of Gilbert’s contract for possible extension), with the worst case of Edmunds filling that spot the following year. Right tackle would be a big gamble, but we did just draft a potential successor (though I’d much rather wait a year) and in Munchak we trust. That to me is much safer than replacing 4 starters. 

[warfelg]

1 - Finding it funny how many people are suddenly so for Sean Davis after ripping him to end the year or calling him a bust. 

2 - Ditto for Hargreave and saying he’s not a real NT and that’s the issues with the run defense and to boot calling him an average pass defender. 

3 - All the talk about how Foster is the weak point and Finney is better, yet not willing to move him because of “depth”; yet pausing Munch at his ability to make anyone good. 

4 - The love for Hilton is absurd. Good against the run, good blitzer. Average pass defender. What you would lose in Blitzing with Hilton, you pick up in coverage with Sutton (who played really well in his role last year). 

 

I just find find it funny that I purposely picked 5 guys that people love to ***** about, but suddenly they are untouchable for the best damn FS in the game. 

[Dcash4]

1 hour ago, warfelg said:

Finding it funny how many people are suddenly so for Sean Davis after ripping him to end the year or calling him a bust.

Where? No one has said anything to defend Davis here. No one. I think everyone agrees that he makes the most sense since he is an immediate one for one change.

But you are making a trade that ships off 3 young, controllable starters and a quality NFL starter on a CONTENDING team that, most likely, isn’t ONE player away from a top 5 defense. It completely destroys depth, at already weak positions - but Earl Thomas would probably give us a good run down on what lack of depth does to contending teams. Thomas makes our deep half better, but you arguably make us worse across three different positions that  don’t have a wealth of talent.

It’s just such a short sighted trade. It eliminates depth and offers no assurances moving forward. Thomas is a guy turning 30, going into his last chance at a big contract, and had said he wishes that he wouldn’t have taken less essentially. Do you think that guy is passing on free agency? We could be left with no NT, no slot corner (who knows if Haden is here next year in that cap hit with Sutton in the wings), and then no Earl Thomas....

There is a way to get Thomas and maintain quality, young NFL capable guys. This trade isn’t it. It’s giving entirely too much future potential in three 3rd year players AND draft picks for a player that is on his last year and on a team he is showing no signs of playing for. 

[MOSteelers56]

3 hours ago, warfelg said:

1 - Finding it funny how many people are suddenly so for Sean Davis after ripping him to end the year or calling him a bust. 

2 - Ditto for Hargreave and saying he’s not a real NT and that’s the issues with the run defense and to boot calling him an average pass defender. 

3 - All the talk about how Foster is the weak point and Finney is better, yet not willing to move him because of “depth”; yet pausing Munch at his ability to make anyone good. 

4 - The love for Hilton is absurd. Good against the run, good blitzer. Average pass defender. What you would lose in Blitzing with Hilton, you pick up in coverage with Sutton (who played really well in his role last year). 

 

I just find find it funny that I purposely picked 5 guys that people love to ***** about, but suddenly they are untouchable for the best damn FS in the game. 

I almost always find you to be the voice of reason round these parts, @warfelg