OhioG Posted August 13, 2018 Share Posted August 13, 2018 Are people mad that Hue made an out of shape Calloway play past the point of his comfort level I mean the guy literally asked to come off to get rest and he was forced to keep running. Maybe you all are super athletes but having to keep going full sprint when i feel like I need to stop is the worst thing ever Plus has any news come out that Calloway failed a drug test? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETSGOBROWNIES Posted August 13, 2018 Share Posted August 13, 2018 15 minutes ago, ohiogenius said: Are people mad that Hue made an out of shape Calloway play past the point of his comfort level I mean the guy literally asked to come off to get rest and he was forced to keep running. Maybe you all are super athletes but having to keep going full sprint when i feel like I need to stop is the worst thing ever Plus has any news come out that Calloway failed a drug test? Yeah I actually dig it. Every player wants a break this time of year, no one wants to play almost an entire game. This is the perfect “punishment” for a guy who was out late not doing what he should have been iyam. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CBrownsman Posted August 13, 2018 Share Posted August 13, 2018 27 minutes ago, ohiogenius said: Are people mad that Hue made an out of shape Calloway play past the point of his comfort level I mean the guy literally asked to come off to get rest and he was forced to keep running. Maybe you all are super athletes but having to keep going full sprint when i feel like I need to stop is the worst thing ever Plus has any news come out that Calloway failed a drug test? No but the inevitable problem with admitting that is you are forcing a player to play when tired and lethargic when injuries are more an issue. I hear that Callaway sustained a minor rib injury during that game and wasn't able to come out of the game afterwards. I am just glad its noting more serious, because if he had fallen on something or broken something it would be a MUCH worse story line. Also sitting him would have been much more of a punishment. Callaway wants to play and wants to get time to prove he can play. Admit this is what it is, giving a player who needed football experience after a year off time. I'm pretty sure this is just Hue trying to avoid the media criticism that he didn't sit him....it a way only Hue could blunder it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mind Character Posted August 13, 2018 Share Posted August 13, 2018 39 minutes ago, NateDawg said: I played baseball up through college and played other competitive sports up until then. I’ve not seen extra playing time used as a punishment before. Punishment in practice/public shaming and not playing in a game are what I personally have been around. I’m not saying it’s not possible here, but it’s also unconventional and something I’m not buying on its face. Baseball is not a substitution intensive game... there is less repeated physical running and full speed exertion where a player is so gassed that they need a substitute. I'm not only saying that it's possible but a familiar method used in football by coaching: That is, the use of physical/cardio exertion while doing something that requires mental focus as a means to punish a player. These can include repeated wind sprints, suicide runs, laps around the field during practice... holding a medicine ball and running gassers with an assistant coach for the duration of practice, making them do bear crawls 50 and 100 yards, bleacher runs... etc... Those types of punishments come in practice... but without a practice for a cardio intensive position like WR.. especially for a player that is out of shape... run 40 yard routes at full speed (even a 10 yard slant or curl means the WR is covering more than 10 yards).. repeatedly... making the WR run vertical routes repeatedly is akin to cardio punishement ... it also has the bonus of not hurting the team and putting the punished player in a position where they have to keep fighting and not give up to show the team that they are willing to sacrifice and push through things there mind tells them to do (quit, give less effort... smoke weed) for the betterment of the team. Football and Hockey have a different cardio demand than baseball whereby without a substitution (especially at the WR position- a position required to run 10, 20, 40, 60 yard wind sprints ... then run back to the huddle or push another 200 pound human down the field) is on par with the grueling wind sprints or conditioning exertion that I'm sure you did in prep for baseball or other sports... In high school my friend Andy violated curfew and did one of the dumbest things ever... but we needed him desperately as a team.... instead of hurting us as a team... he ran verticla routes all game long into the 4th quarter even when the game was decided ( we blew the team out by 35... lol .. high school sports were awesome)... Coach told him that he had to sprint full speed back to the line of scrimmage or he wouldn't play for the rest of the playoffs... after the game he then had to do 100 yard gassers until he cried like a baby while we as a team watched... we carried him back to the locker room ... got him water... his tongue was dragging and he was exhausted... he could've quit... and hurt the team... instead he paid the price... and we were better for it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReggieCamp Posted August 13, 2018 Share Posted August 13, 2018 1 hour ago, Mind Character said: The more and more I read on here and in the news .... the more I realize people have never played real competitive sports a day in their lives... I like your football posts a lot, but this is condescending bullish*t. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETSGOBROWNIES Posted August 13, 2018 Share Posted August 13, 2018 43 minutes ago, CBrownsman said: No but the inevitable problem with admitting that is you are forcing a player to play when tired and lethargic when injuries are more an issue. Eh, he was mostly just running. 43 minutes ago, CBrownsman said: I hear that Callaway sustained a minor rib injury during that game and wasn't able to come out of the game afterwards. Ok. Nothing with a rib gets worse from running tbh, it’s just uncomfortable. 43 minutes ago, CBrownsman said: I am just glad its noting more serious, because if he had fallen on something or broken something it would be a MUCH worse story line. See above. 43 minutes ago, CBrownsman said: Also sitting him would have been much more of a punishment. Callaway wants to play and wants to get time to prove he can play. Admit this is what it is, giving a player who needed football experience after a year off time. I don’t think most guys do want to play during the preseason in the middle of camp, etc. 43 minutes ago, CBrownsman said: I'm pretty sure this is just Hue trying to avoid the media criticism that he didn't sit him....it a way only Hue could blunder it Lol no, he’s getting no free passes at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MSURacerDT55 Posted August 13, 2018 Share Posted August 13, 2018 1 hour ago, NateDawg said: I played baseball up through college and played other competitive sports up until then. I’ve not seen extra playing time used as a punishment before. Punishment in practice/public shaming and not playing in a game are what I personally have been around. I’m not saying it’s not possible here, but it’s also unconventional and something I’m not buying on its face. Yeah, it's pretty common in the game of football, I actually like it, a lot. Everyone doesn't respond to being put in time out like a lot of people who haven't played the game suggest (not you), this is a game that requires mental as well as physical toughness, not a better way to activate the critical thinking machine more than something tangible like this. Also he gets closer to game shape, I actually love that they aren't babying these guys any longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mind Character Posted August 13, 2018 Share Posted August 13, 2018 30 minutes ago, ReggieCamp said: I like your football posts a lot, but this is condescending bullish*t. As a specialist in bullsh*t ... you hit it right on the nose.... But I can't help it in this trash media sports town... where if a person played football they would've observed these very basic things and could easily fathom how it makes sense to make an athlete exert themselves as a form of punishment... 2 hours ago, Mind Character said: The more and more I read on here and in the news .... the more I realize people have never played real competitive sports a day in their lives... If so, they'd have memories of someone on a team doesn't something wrong and they'd be familiar with the various types of consequences and what they do for the team. There are multiple ways to punish an out of shape player (Before I knew he was being punished I knew he was out of shape by watching early game): 1.) (Punish the Player & the Team) Chastise the player individually... make them apologize to the team... and punish the player individually by taking them out of activities (this hurts the team if the player will be needed for team success). 2.) (Punish the Team... Have the team Punish the Player) Do group/team punishment and have the team hold the player accountable via shaming or social reprimand. 3.) (Punish the Player & Make them Improve their value to the team) Chastise the player individually...make them stand in front of the team and apologize... then have them exert their self physically and mentally through conditioning or strenuous play. The team sees them having to pay a price for the team... they come back more valuable to the team... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CBrownsman Posted August 13, 2018 Share Posted August 13, 2018 1 hour ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said: Eh, he was mostly just running. Ok. Nothing with a rib gets worse from running tbh, it’s just uncomfortable. See above. I don’t think most guys do want to play during the preseason in the middle of camp, etc. Lol no, he’s getting no free passes at this point. I definitely cant agree with you here, Running happens at practice, up and down stairs, or on the field. He was being put up against players who are trying to prove themselves to make the Giants football team. He was being thrown the ball often, jammed at the line, hit after catches and after he got his hands on the ball. I understand your point, but an NFL game, even in the pre-season, is not just running... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas5737 Posted August 13, 2018 Share Posted August 13, 2018 21 minutes ago, Mind Character said: As a specialist in bullsh*t ... you hit it right on the nose.... But I can't help it in this trash media sports town... where if a person played football they would've observed these very basic things and could easily fathom how it makes sense to make an athlete exert themselves as a form of punishment... Yeah, this punishment makes sense if he is being punished for being out of shape. For a drug charge? Not really. His ability to move up the depth chart was really aided by not coming out at the half where he wasn't able to make a few tough catches. 2nd half we got a glimpse of what he can do and he went from a disappointment to our surefire #3 WR . If that is punishment there are 20-30 other players currently on the roster who would like to be punished and have a chance to show what they can do with extended play in a game. It's good for us if the league looks at it as "we took care of it" and nothing else is done. I'll even call Hue a genius if the league buys it. It isn't the same as having to run sprints in practice. It's like punishing someone in baseball by making them hit all day long and not let them play the field. Much more of a reward than a punishment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mind Character Posted August 13, 2018 Share Posted August 13, 2018 @Thomas5737 As with most of our discussions man, we'll just have to agree to disagree.... ....on whether it was a punishment or not, but those I heard and read online seem to agree with you. I do find it interesting b/c I watched Callaway's college snaps and during the game from his very first snaps I said the following in the preseason thread.... On 8/9/2018 at 8:16 PM, Mind Character said: yeah ... Callaway looks chubby and out of shape.... On 8/9/2018 at 7:53 PM, Mind Character said: is it me or does he look a little chunky/out of shape... I said so b/c he was gassing out after the first vertical route and 20 yard come back... those were literally his first few snaps... I then went on to say that his body look so much heavier than and less fit than his Florida day... Within that context it seems to me that simply taking him out of activity in the game... hurts Callaway AND the TEAM... b/c we need him to be successful for our team to thrive... By implementing a multi-faceted punishment... it makes Callaway pay a price in sweat, exertion, and mental toughness... while not hurting the TEAM.... The punishment was multi-faceted: 1.) Sit down with Hue and Dorsey... 2.) Having to get up in front of over 80 men (coaches, players, execs...) and apologize and make oneself accountable to he players for what he did and explain himself... 3.) Run himself ragged in a game... when he wanted to quit... no letting him.. making him prove his worth to the team... and become more valuable as a piece of the team... ---------------------------------- I already made my points about the individual versus team dynamic when it comes to rewarding and punishing a player... It's a fine line to walk... but what's been done makes sense imo. 56 minutes ago, Mind Character said: There are multiple ways to punish an out of shape player (Before I knew he was being punished I knew he was out of shape by watching early game): 1.) (Punish the Player & the Team) Chastise the player individually... make them apologize to the team... and punish the player individually by taking them out of activities (this hurts the team if the player will be needed for team success). 2.) (Punish the Team... Have the team Punish the Player) Do group/team punishment and have the team hold the player accountable via shaming or social reprimand. 3.) (Punish the Player & Make them Improve their value to the team) Chastise the player individually...make them stand in front of the team and apologize... then have them exert their self physically and mentally through conditioning or strenuous play. The team sees them having to pay a price for the team... they come back more valuable to the team... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas5737 Posted August 13, 2018 Share Posted August 13, 2018 1 hour ago, Mind Character said: ...on whether it was a punishment or not, but those I heard and read online seem to agree with you. If they call it a punishment then it is a punishment but it is a punishment that allows Callaway the volume to outproduce other young wide receivers on the roster who are also trying to make the team or move up the depth chart. I think Callaway played 53 snaps and Mayfield 45 and Chubb the vast majority at RB and it makes sense since they need to see what each brings but Chubb/Mayfield certainly weren't being punished. I'm sure both would like to start next game and even be named starters for the regular season and have to play whole games all of the time. If this works as punishment I'm happy with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtmmike Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 if he does not come up positive on the urinalysis give him a 1 game suspension and move him to phase 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MistaBohmbastic Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 So I was behind the glass for Next Level today, and Emmett and Jerod both thought Hue should have benched him. I was astonished. I, for one, LOVE what Hue did. Why should one player's actions detriment the entire team? This is a guy who has not played in a real game for nearly TWO YEARS, and he has been tearing it up in practice. The team NEEDS to get him opportunities to shake the rust off, so for punishment, why not force him into EVERY opportunity? I heard he puked afterwards from exhaustion. Sounds like punishment enough to me. Benching him would have gotten ZERO benefit. This way, he is disciplined while also developing chemistry with his teammates and getting live reps. He said it won't happen again, he's got his second chance with the Browns, so make him give his all. I'm completely cool with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod Johnson Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 Hue could have avoided calling it a punishment and this debate would have never needed to happen. He needs the playing time because he's going to be expected to be a reliable contributor this season and is probably far from being there mentally and physically. I'd rather risk beating him up in a preseason game than roll into the regular season with him not near the top of his game and bogging everything down. I liked Njoku's extended playing time for the same reason, although he's probably miles ahead of Callaway. It feels different from previous seasons where we just throw our best talent on the field when the season starts and have 100 miscues and penalties that ultimately cost the game. It's like a little injection of Mangini without going full Mangini. Hopefully we get Gordon back soon and just avoid Dez altogether. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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