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Mitchell Countdown


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2 hours ago, Madmike90 said:

There is no 100% correct answer on this because there are so many moving parts to having a successful career in the NFL...I think Trubisky is strong mentally but there comes a point where no matter how strong you are if you get hit enough or throw enough INTs it starts to effect you...the very best go through this...I remember seeing Aaron Rodgers falling apart against the cardinals when they sacked him 8 times and hit him umpteen more times...he was angry and scared back there...Payton Manning for years got owned in Foxboro for years as a Colt because they were in his head...even the usually unflappable Tom Brady panics when he is being hit too many times...it's natural and these are three of the very best of all time...we have a quality OL but who is getting open? Then he is holding the ball too long...then he is hearing footsteps even when they aren't coming and throwing up poor passes...too much of that and he is David Carr and not Derek...

Now as I said that is not 100% going to happen and maybe he goes out there and becomes a total star...but just looking at guys like Rodgers who sat and really learned their craft as an NFL QB I just think that type of development will lead to better long term gains...I think Trubisky gets you 2 more wins this season than Glennon would...I think giving him a season to learn the pro game and an NFL locker room gets you 10 seasons of excellent QB play and gives you a chance to be competitive.

My biggest concern with Trubisky---and the biggest fear I've had for many years now in terms of a rookie QB--is that this fanbase may be too stupid to acknowledge that 100% of NFL QBs have their bad days.

I've seen this city build up a QB in one game, and then want to run him out of town in one game.

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51 minutes ago, IronMike84 said:

My biggest concern with Trubisky---and the biggest fear I've had for many years now in terms of a rookie QB--is that this fanbase may be too stupid to acknowledge that 100% of NFL QBs have their bad days.

I've seen this city build up a QB in one game, and then want to run him out of town in one game.

You mean like they're going to do to Glennon on Sunday the first time he does something underwhelming? I'll be at the first 2 home games - if Glennon is still starting by week 3 against Pittsburgh I expect the boo birds are gonna be pretty damn loud. That's not really fair to him, but the chosen one is sitting behind him. That's reality. 

I really hate that Fox is talking to us like we are all dumb though, with the whole "Glennon earned" being starter. He didn't. Dude had one good drive. 

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10 hours ago, AZBearsFan said:

You mean like they're going to do to Glennon on Sunday the first time he does something underwhelming? I'll be at the first 2 home games - if Glennon is still starting by week 3 against Pittsburgh I expect the boo birds are gonna be pretty damn loud. That's not really fair to him, but the chosen one is sitting behind him. That's reality. 

I really hate that Fox is talking to us like we are all dumb though, with the whole "Glennon earned" being starter. He didn't. Dude had one good drive. 

The problem with Glennon is that they are all going to be bad days, or maybe mediocre days.

 

I think fans can accept bad, when there is some good.

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13 hours ago, Madmike90 said:

There is no 100% correct answer on this because there are so many moving parts to having a successful career in the NFL...I think Trubisky is strong mentally but there comes a point where no matter how strong you are if you get hit enough or throw enough INTs it starts to effect you...the very best go through this...I remember seeing Aaron Rodgers falling apart against the cardinals when they sacked him 8 times and hit him umpteen more times...he was angry and scared back there...Payton Manning for years got owned in Foxboro for years as a Colt because they were in his head...even the usually unflappable Tom Brady panics when he is being hit too many times...it's natural and these are three of the very best of all time...we have a quality OL but who is getting open? Then he is holding the ball too long...then he is hearing footsteps even when they aren't coming and throwing up poor passes...too much of that and he is David Carr and not Derek...

Now as I said that is not 100% going to happen and maybe he goes out there and becomes a total star...but just looking at guys like Rodgers who sat and really learned their craft as an NFL QB I just think that type of development will lead to better long term gains...I think Trubisky gets you 2 more wins this season than Glennon would...I think giving him a season to learn the pro game and an NFL locker room gets you 10 seasons of excellent QB play and gives you a chance to be competitive.

Outside of Rodgers that is pretty rare.

 

Everyone says that Rodgers sitting 3 years was a good thing, but what if the Packers wasted 2 years of Rodgers career? What if he was ready year 2 and they sat him behind an aging Brett Favre?

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23 hours ago, WindyCity said:

Outside of Rodgers that is pretty rare.

 

Everyone says that Rodgers sitting 3 years was a good thing, but what if the Packers wasted 2 years of Rodgers career? What if he was ready year 2 and they sat him behind an aging Brett Favre?

For 3 years? Sure...but not for one season...Phillip Rivers never started a game his first two years...Carson Palmer didn't play at all his rookie year...Tom Brady never started a game as a rookie...nor did Drew Brees...Matt Stafford only started 10 games...Eli Manning & Alex Smith only started 7...Kirk Cousins started started 1...I think if Trubisky turns out in that ball park losing one year of his career would be well worth it.

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10 hours ago, WindyCity said:

Everyone says that Rodgers sitting 3 years was a good thing, but what if the Packers wasted 2 years of Rodgers career?

Ted Thompson is still wasting Rodgers' career to this day.

Not that I'm complaining. I think it's hilarious that Green Bay has largely squandered a HOF QB's career because they're more concerned with poorly building a platoon defense than adding offensive weapons.

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I think one reason we are putting Trubisky on the backburner is Loggains' experience.

He was an assistant in DAL when Romo was coming up. They saw Romo had talent but was raw, so they had him run the scout team vs the starting defense. So he was not running their system per se, but was getting a lot of reps and getting them away from the scrutiny of the fans and media. He was able to be aggressive, make throws without costing the team a game, and was forced to become a smarter player due to his team constantly being inferior to the opposition. Windows were minuscule, timing had to be faster due to OL not being talented, and he had to be able to start reading the field faster.

It sounds like Loggains was a big proponent of the method, crediting a lot of Romo's quick processing and release due to this.

It's hard to say what the best approach is. He can get a lot of reps like this but doesn't build chemistry with the starters, but really that might not be much in the long term with Miller aging, Meredith out, and mostly a rental WR corps, and Loggains highly unlikely to be his Tom Moore. He can get the reps without enduring the 2010 Cutler beatdown.

Pros of starting now include getting the experience with these players, which might help dictate who we want to re-sign if they flourish with him. While a slant is a slant, he can work a real system and finally get experience under pressure. There is no substitute in practice for that. You can do the 3rd and 15 drills, 2 minute drills, etc, but there is no way in hell those properly simulate a playoff game, or running them under the volume of Arrowhead Stadium.

Either way this year isn't going to make him elite or a bust because he played all 16 or sat every game out. Neither approach risks making him JaMarcus Russell, and with Glennon being his only threat to prevent from starting, he will at latest walk into the starting role in 2018. If they think they can accelerate his learning by sitting him a year, then I am fine with waiting.

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14 hours ago, Madmike90 said:

For 3 years? Sure...but not for one season...Phillip Rivers never started a game his first two years...Carson Palmer didn't play at all his rookie year...Tom Brady never started a game as a rookie...nor did Drew Brees...Matt Stafford only started 10 games...Eli Manning & Alex Smith only started 7...Kirk Cousins started started 1...I think if Trubisky turns out in that ball park losing one year of his career would be well worth it.

The list is equally long of guys who have played right away and been successful.

I do not think that there is any evidence that suggest one is better than the other.

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4 minutes ago, Madmike90 said:

But does that list include the GOAT and a guy who is arguably top 5 of all time as well? Does it include the NFLs highest paid player? Does it include all those Super bowls?...patience is a virtue my friend.

It includes much younger QBs so we have no idea what they will become.

There is no evidence that Brady sitting made him a better player, or that Brees sitting made him a better player. There are far more important factors to success. Brady is going to skew any argument because of his ridiculous level of success.

 

Patience is fine, but it has to be based on what you are seeing and not an irrational fear.

 

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5 minutes ago, WindyCity said:

It includes much younger QBs so we have no idea what they will become.

There is no evidence that Brady sitting made him a better player, or that Brees sitting made him a better player. There are far more important factors to success. Brady is going to skew any argument because of his ridiculous level of success.

 

Patience is fine, but it has to be based on what you are seeing and not an irrational fear.

 

There is also no evidence that sitting didn't help improve these guys or make them better players...my point is there is not a 100% sure fire proven method for it...but for me letting a guy with 13 career starts sit and learn for a season in the pros while building around him seems like a far better idea than throwing him out there and hoping for the best when the rest of your team gives you no hope of winning anything this season.

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5 hours ago, Madmike90 said:

There is also no evidence that sitting didn't help improve these guys or make them better players...my point is there is not a 100% sure fire proven method for it...but for me letting a guy with 13 career starts sit and learn for a season in the pros while building around him seems like a far better idea than throwing him out there and hoping for the best when the rest of your team gives you no hope of winning anything this season.

I think that Fox has shown a track record of favoring veterans, even some horrendous ones, over playing a young QB.

I think that might play into this more than an honest evaluation of Mitch.

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