2019 prospects and outlook

[Bobby816]

Let’s get back on topic and talk about prospects!!!

[doumeyer]

6 hours ago, Bobby816 said:

Let’s get back on topic and talk about prospects!!!

For me it is hard to get into this prospect thing, with only one pick in the first 65 picks in the 2019 draft as things stand now. Everything depends how we do in the FA market. And what Macc, will do with the third overall pick in the draft, will he take the BPA, or will he try to trade down? If we do trade down we will not get the same kind of deal the Colts got last year. We all know the key to this off season is to get the right players on offensive for Darnold. I think you are right, if we can get Bell it would be a great step in the right direction. Most of our help on offensive will come from the FA market, if we don't pick up at least one second round pick.

[Bobby816]

Personally I think we get 2 OLineman in FA and wind up missing out on Bell, making us have to spend our money once again in defense and we get 2 DEs and a CB. Which in turn makes the draft very tricky for us. Bc that would eliminate getting an edge in the draft. So would make things interesting. Based purely on talent Q. Williams is really the only guy for sure worthy of the 3rd pick if we couldn’t trade down. Josh Jacobs could be argued as well. Say we draft Williams bc we can’t trade down... ya we’d have a great defense... but literally only gave Darnold 2 better OLineman. So our offense would still be awful and actually our great defense wouldn’t look great bc they’d be on the field the whole game.

 

If younread between the lines on what Macc has said... offense will be a priority. I think this might be the year he doesn’t go BPA and helps the offense. Especially if he can’t land a difference maker in FA. Ideally if we want a Jacobs or a WR we can trade back and get them and acquire picks. Getting Bell would really open up a lot more avenues for us for FA outside of him and in the draft. We miss on him and we become a team desperate for offensive talent at skill positions.

[barnaby8787]

1 hour ago, Bobby816 said:

Like I said that’s analytic stats. Kinda like the one that said that Leo was the best DLineman in the NFL bc of his QB hurries. Wasn’t results. It’s says. Same as the ones who think Ingram is better than Bell bc of stats like this and should be a target more so then Bell.

So retyping this again and if it gets deleted again, i'm going to webmaster with this whole thing. As a member, I have the right to disagree with you or anyone else on here and state my points.  I was by no means disrespectful in my previous post nor did I violate any rules on FF in the post therefore my post should not have been deleted. Deleting my content and thoughts is extremely disrespectful towards me though.  I'm confident others will agree with me on that as well.

You said my argument about no RB's winning the SB had no logic, but argued that 5 of the 8 remaining teams in the playoffs had an RB drafted in the 1st.   I then said that only 2 were top 15 in DVOA. I also noted that only 3 1st round RB's finished top 15 in DVOA this year.  You said I was reaching with DVOA and that you could care less about it. DVOA is considered by most to be the most respected/best analytic in football.  Our own DC has used it to his advantage in press conferences. I then posted an article showing that drafting an RB early was a waste, but you ignored it in your reply to me.   You then stated that Leo was the best d-lineman in football per analytics, however not one single analytic says that nor will you like find one that puts in the top 10.  You say it's because of his hurries, which is not how analytics works.  You then said that analytics say that Ingram is better than Leveon.  That's not true.  Statistically, they're similar and analytics, like the one you knocked in DVOA actually shows that Leveon is better.  Leveon has had a higher DVOA in 4 out of 5 years in his career. Other advanced analytics also show that Bell is better.  So basically, you tried to negate DVOA and my comments regarding analytics by making up things about analytics that don't exist.  

Posting this again...

There's no such things as analytic stats.  There's analytics and there's stats.

Also posting this again...

You've called out @KingOfTheDot for snarky comments in the past, but think it's appropriate as a moderator to be extremely sarcastic towards me and others while arguing.  You also think a "drop the mic" reference is appropriate insinuating that you won the argument. 

Adding to this, you DM me saying "You want to write ride comments DM me. Doesn’t need to be posted. I’ll be glad to take criticism. But doesn’t need to be an ongoing debate on the forum."  Assuming you meant "rude" comments.  I don't think I was rude in my original post and I definitely did not violate any FF rules. Historically when people are rude in the Jets forum, you've quoted them and warned them.  You didn't do that here, you just deleted my post, which to me says, you didn't find my post rude, you just didn't like being called out on it.  In terms of an ongoing debate, you literally started the debate by directly disagreeing with my post regarding taking RB's in the 1st.  When I tried to end it, you kept going. In terms of being glad to take the criticism, that's not the case otherwise you wouldn't have deleted my original post causing me to have to retype this entire thing. 

You then post "Let's get back on topic and talk about prospects".  We were talking about prospects.  We were talking about why we should or shouldn't use a 1st rounder on a running back.  I proved to you that we shouldn't. You chose to silence me on that.

[JetsandI]

1 hour ago, Bobby816 said:

Personally I think we get 2 OLineman in FA and wind up missing out on Bell, making us have to spend our money once again in defense and we get 2 DEs and a CB. Which in turn makes the draft very tricky for us. Bc that would eliminate getting an edge in the draft. So would make things interesting. Based purely on talent Q. Williams is really the only guy for sure worthy of the 3rd pick if we couldn’t trade down. Josh Jacobs could be argued as well. Say we draft Williams bc we can’t trade down... ya we’d have a great defense... but literally only gave Darnold 2 better OLineman. So our offense would still be awful and actually our great defense wouldn’t look great bc they’d be on the field the whole game.

 

If younread between the lines on what Macc has said... offense will be a priority. I think this might be the year he doesn’t go BPA and helps the offense. Especially if he can’t land a difference maker in FA. Ideally if we want a Jacobs or a WR we can trade back and get them and acquire picks. Getting Bell would really open up a lot more avenues for us for FA outside of him and in the draft. We miss on him and we become a team desperate for offensive talent at skill positions.

Maccagnan and Jets company have low opinion on RB. One of its merits is a team doesn't build around RB.  If you decided to invest in RB that high like top money in FA or 1st round selection then you would be vastly disappointed because you won't get any top production out of RB due to different surrounding.

If Jets actually decided to invest in RB that high then Jets would have to compel to build the offense around RB.  It is possible but what Jets had done this end of 2018 league year suggest Darnold is the one who Jets build around, not RB.  Jets are planning to bolster offense in either FA or draft but it doesn't necessarily start with 1st round pick.

 

If Jets are almost a complete team and needed a RB then help yourself and get top RB available.

Edited January 27, 2019 by JetsandI

[JetsandI]

2 hours ago, doumeyer said:

For me it is hard to get into this prospect thing, with only one pick in the first 65 picks in the 2019 draft as things stand now. Everything depends how we do in the FA market. And what Macc, will do with the third overall pick in the draft, will he take the BPA, or will he try to trade down? If we do trade down we will not get the same kind of deal the Colts got last year. We all know the key to this off season is to get the right players on offensive for Darnold. I think you are right, if we can get Bell it would be a great step in the right direction. Most of our help on offensive will come from the FA market, if we don't pick up at least one second round pick.

What would Jets do with #3 if Nick Bosa, Josh Allen and Clelin Ferrell cemented top 5 material?  Stay put and be prepared with 3rd edge like qb situation of 2018 draft?

[SDotNova]

1 hour ago, Bobby816 said:

Personally I think we get 2 OLineman in FA and wind up missing out on Bell, making us have to spend our money once again in defense and we get 2 DEs and a CB. Which in turn makes the draft very tricky for us. Bc that would eliminate getting an edge in the draft. So would make things interesting. Based purely on talent Q. Williams is really the only guy for sure worthy of the 3rd pick if we couldn’t trade down. Josh Jacobs could be argued as well. Say we draft Williams bc we can’t trade down... ya we’d have a great defense... but literally only gave Darnold 2 better OLineman. So our offense would still be awful and actually our great defense wouldn’t look great bc they’d be on the field the whole game.

 

If younread between the lines on what Macc has said... offense will be a priority. I think this might be the year he doesn’t go BPA and helps the offense. Especially if he can’t land a difference maker in FA. Ideally if we want a Jacobs or a WR we can trade back and get them and acquire picks. Getting Bell would really open up a lot more avenues for us for FA outside of him and in the draft. We miss on him and we become a team desperate for offensive talent at skill positions.

This why I think we don’t miss out on Bell. Lol. Our offseason with and without him looks completely different. We almost can’t affird to not get him. The Jets need to open up the check book and put up some big gtd. 

[JetsandI]

Chuma Edoga in 4th round?  Yeah I wish.  His hand activity looked fine to me. 

 

Rock Ya-Sin- I didn't like to learn that he could end up in 1st but in 2nd or 3rd round isn't out of question.  Natural ball skill? My foot. He always looked at receivers all the way in man coverage. If he turned his head around he would wind up having 2 ints easily.

Khalen Saunders- he is too heavy for Gregg Williams' scheme but oh boy he is fast. Not just quick. Real Fast.  Big, powerful and quick. Hard to ignore him really.

Garrett Bradbury- he looked like he could handle Zero technique DT just fine. With NFL conditioning, he will be much better in strength to go with above average ZBS. I like him.

 

The rest of prospects look much like I thought they would be.

[barnaby8787]

7 minutes ago, SDotNova said:

This why I think we don’t miss out on Bell. Lol. Our offseason with and without him looks completely different. We almost can’t affird to not get him. The Jets need to open up the check book and put up some big gtd. 

I’d be pretty shocked if we didn’t end up with him. I think his suitors will be surprisingly limited. 

[Bobby816]

1 hour ago, JetsandI said:

Maccagnan and Jets company have low opinion on RB. One of its merits is a team doesn't build around RB.  If you decided to invest in RB that high like top money in FA or 1st round selection then you would be vastly disappointed because you won't get any top production out of RB due to different surrounding.

If Jets actually decided to invest in RB that high then Jets would have to compel to build the offense around RB.  It is possible but what Jets had done this end of 2018 league year suggest Darnold is the one who Jets build around, not RB.  Jets are planning to bolster offense in either FA or draft but it doesn't necessarily start with 1st round pick.

 

If Jets are almost a complete team and needed a RB then help yourself and get top RB available.

Tytpically I'd agree with you. But we aren't a typical team. We are a team that hasn't had a single skill position player that scares another team in forever. And we need that desperately. And I think Macc knows it, bc his job is on the line. We cant have yet another season of this offense being bottom 5-10 in the NFL like every single season pretty much.

[Dr.O]

Think Hunter Rendrow, Andy Isabella, and Deebo Samuels would fit nice as the Albert Wilson type role Gase had in his offense last year.

[Dr.O]

Steve Kiem has said that the Cards are moving back to a 3-4, that makes me believe that Josh Allen might be the pick at 1. 

[jetskid007]

Here is the point to make on the RB debate: if that player is the best player available, you take him. Sure thing is better than a maybe. 

While I tend to agree that drafting a RB in round 1 is a mistake, I think Jacobs is the exception. He is Alvin Kamara 2.0. Sure, someone will respond by saying "Kamara was drafted in the 3rd round"... if anyone knew what kind of impact he would have on offense, he would've been drafted top 5; teams simply didn't know how they would use him, and Sean Payton did- he's now provided a blueprint to the league, hence why Jacobs will go high this year. If you've ever watched Kamara play, it's not fair to just label him a RB. He's an offensive weapon and the lifeblood of the Saints offense. Jacobs can be that if used correctly. 

Edited January 27, 2019 by jetskid007

[Bobby816]

51 minutes ago, jetskid007 said:

Here is the point to make on the RB debate: if that player is the best player available, you take him. Sure thing is better than a maybe. 

While I tend to agree that drafting a RB in round 1 is a mistake, I think Jacobs is the exception. He is Alvin Kamara 2.0. Sure, someone will respond by saying "Kamara was drafted in the 3rd round"... if anyone knew what kind of impact he would have on offense, he would've been drafted top 5; teams simply didn't know how they would use him, and Sean Payton did- he's now provided a blueprint to the league, hence why Jacobs will go high this year. If you've ever watched Kamara play, it's not fair to just label him a RB. He's an offensive weapon and the lifeblood of the Saints offense. Jacobs can be that if used correctly. 

Thank you!!!

[SDotNova]

1 hour ago, Dr.O said:

Steve Kiem has said that the Cards are moving back to a 3-4, that makes me believe that Josh Allen might be the pick at 1. 

If Allen goes #1, who do you think the 49ers go with? I find it hard to see the 49ers going Q Williams over Bosa. Which would leave the Jets with a board Q Williams, J Williams, Ferrell and Gary. Tough decision if we stay put.