JetsandI Posted December 18, 2018 Share Posted December 18, 2018 19 minutes ago, rickyt31 said: We just need one QB to look franchise ready. That will force the teams that need someone by then to have to trade up for him. If there are more good QBs, that increases the chances of one of the QBs falling to their pick. Justin Herbert and Daniel Jones could offer that. Still, Drew Lock and Clayton Thorson sound good idea for top 2nd round picks as I can see Jaguars sitting back and taking BPA in 1st with settling down with either Lock or Thorson in 2nd. B teams remain unknown to me. Dwayne Haskins is hard to figure out. Since he is totally anti-Urban Meyers in terms of qb type any team that may like him should follow the Panthers blueprint for Cam Newton. Unfortunately, I see none of teams that fit in the mold. That is why I ask for 3 qbs instead of 2 just in case if Haskins opts for NFL shot. It is very important to me that both Herbert and Jones need to opt for NFL shot. Thus, counting one qb coming out of NCAA doesn't sound optimistic as it could be only Haskins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby816 Posted December 18, 2018 Share Posted December 18, 2018 Our track record on mid round WRs is just awful though. Stewart, Hansen, Smith, Saunders, Evans, Hill. Enunwa didn't look that good this season when he was healthy. Robby is starting to play better. But I think when we call these good solid 2's we are giving them too much credit. Anderson will always be useful bc of his speed and size as being a deep threat. Enunwa though is disappointing for me. I think if we are calling him a valuable piece in developing Darnold we are kidding ourselves. He's played more like a 4th WR then a good #2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetskid007 Posted December 18, 2018 Share Posted December 18, 2018 2 hours ago, Bobby816 said: Since Leo hasn't really broken out and we have good DEs like Anderson and Shepard to start. I'm for trading him for a late 1st early 2nd. Oakland got a 1st for Cooper and at that time that looked like a top 15 pick as well. I think we at least can land an early 2nd for Leo being his situation is nearly identical contract wise. Stupidity. Leo is the reason why these players pile up the stats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetsandI Posted December 18, 2018 Share Posted December 18, 2018 59 minutes ago, Bobby816 said: Our track record on mid round WRs is just awful though. Stewart, Hansen, Smith, Saunders, Evans, Hill. Enunwa didn't look that good this season when he was healthy. Robby is starting to play better. But I think when we call these good solid 2's we are giving them too much credit. Anderson will always be useful bc of his speed and size as being a deep threat. Enunwa though is disappointing for me. I think if we are calling him a valuable piece in developing Darnold we are kidding ourselves. He's played more like a 4th WR then a good #2. If you look for number one WR then neither is the answer for you. Big Q is ideal for slot receiver. Anderson is ideal for deep threat. Both have to play bigger than their ideal roles in order to have game production for Jets. Right now, health issue and sharing targets are killing Anderson and Big Q's statistics. Yes, Anderson owns 5 tds but his receiving yards per game this year remains unsightly. Both Anderson and Big Q are indeed the valuable pieces for Darnold. Whether it is #1 or #4. If they ask for more money then they have to stay better than 4th spot consistently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockice_8 Posted December 18, 2018 Share Posted December 18, 2018 3 hours ago, Bobby816 said: Since Leo hasn't really broken out and we have good DEs like Anderson and Shepard to start. I'm for trading him for a late 1st early 2nd. Oakland got a 1st for Cooper and at that time that looked like a top 15 pick as well. I think we at least can land an early 2nd for Leo being his situation is nearly identical contract wise. Shepard has been pretty non existent. I wouldn't be penciling him into a starting role. I'd be ok with trading Williams but I'd want a nice return and we would need to replae Williams because I'm not banking on Shepard to take his spot. We'd need a guy like McClendon to come back or a younger version of him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockice_8 Posted December 18, 2018 Share Posted December 18, 2018 52 minutes ago, jetskid007 said: Stupidity. Leo is the reason why these players pile up the stats. I read somewhere that Leo doesn't doubled nearly as much as we would think. So saying these other guys are a product of him is a bit off base. I remember Leo being pretty far down the list in terms of % of the time he was doubled. If someone is willing to pay up a 1st or early 2nd you have to consider it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetsandI Posted December 18, 2018 Share Posted December 18, 2018 10 minutes ago, Rockice_8 said: I read somewhere that Leo doesn't doubled nearly as much as we would think. So saying these other guys are a product of him is a bit off base. I remember Leo being pretty far down the list in terms of % of the time he was doubled. If someone is willing to pay up a 1st or early 2nd you have to consider it. If you spoke of after 5 games statistic I remembered that. Von Miller was there in top list while Leo was on somewhat between above average or average. Right now, up or down or the same? dunno. edit: It is authored 6 days ago and it remains unclear.... https://footballmaven.io/jets/news/the-leonard-williams-double-team-argument-is-getting-tired-i4S2S_sj2UGsvRlrIK-hJA/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockice_8 Posted December 18, 2018 Share Posted December 18, 2018 1 minute ago, JetsandI said: If you spoke of after 5 games statistic I remembered that. Von Miller was there in top list while Leo was on somewhat between above average or average. Right now, up or down or the same? dunno. Yeah it was around mid season if I remember. Think Cimini posted something about it. Seems like that was always his built in excuse for Jets fans but just doesn't seem to hold any factual truth to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockice_8 Posted December 18, 2018 Share Posted December 18, 2018 He does rank highly in QB pressures though for what it's worth. Just isn't a big statistical guy. Not sure how many of his pressures lead to an incomplete pass because of him and how many were still completed negating the effect of the pressure. Williams is a home grown guy and seems like a good guy but his play leaves a lot to be desired and I'd hate to have to pay 16M+ for a guy like that when you can find competent DT's for a fraction of the price. I prefer to build the defense with guys who sack the QB and make plays in the passing game. Until these pressure start translating to sacks it's hard to view Williams as a big money building block. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetsandI Posted December 18, 2018 Share Posted December 18, 2018 5 minutes ago, Rockice_8 said: He does rank highly in QB pressures though for what it's worth. Just isn't a big statistical guy. Not sure how many of his pressures lead to an incomplete pass because of him and how many were still completed negating the effect of the pressure. Williams is a home grown guy and seems like a good guy but his play leaves a lot to be desired and I'd hate to have to pay 16M+ for a guy like that when you can find competent DT's for a fraction of the price. I prefer to build the defense with guys who sack the QB and make plays in the passing game. Until these pressure start translating to sacks it's hard to view Williams as a big money building block. He is team's 2nd in TFL with 8. I can't decide on what next contract for Leo right now but after playing for new HC and DC we shall learn what the actual value he will be. How about Brandon Copeland? He has been useful for Jets this season. Love to keep him longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockice_8 Posted December 18, 2018 Share Posted December 18, 2018 13 minutes ago, JetsandI said: He is team's 2nd in TFL with 8. I can't decide on what next contract for Leo right now but after playing for new HC and DC we shall learn what the actual value he will be. How about Brandon Copeland? He has been useful for Jets this season. Love to keep him longer. Yeah I'd be good keeping Copeland because he'll likely come at a reasonable contract. Even though money doesn't seem to be of much concern for the near future I'd like to pay high impact players big money and I don't know if Williams is that guy. Copeland would be a nice rotational pass rusher to keep around. If we land one in FA or land Bosa having Jenkins/Copeland to pair with Bosa or another guy would keep them fresh as a nice trio. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby816 Posted December 18, 2018 Share Posted December 18, 2018 1 hour ago, Rockice_8 said: I read somewhere that Leo doesn't doubled nearly as much as we would think. So saying these other guys are a product of him is a bit off base. I remember Leo being pretty far down the list in terms of % of the time he was doubled. If someone is willing to pay up a 1st or early 2nd you have to consider it. Read the exact same thing. That there's this myth that he's doubled all the time and eating space for all these guys to make plays. And its just not true. The guy is just an above average player. And I'd rather see us cash in on him via trade then pay him top DL money. But he's just not worth it. We should have already learned this from Mo and Sheldon. And they produced more than that of Leo. Leo just doesn't have effort or attitude issues and he's likeable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby816 Posted December 18, 2018 Share Posted December 18, 2018 2 hours ago, jetskid007 said: Stupidity. Leo is the reason why these players pile up the stats. He's not doubled nearly as often as you think. He just is an above average player IMO. And he's about to start being paid like a star DL, when he isn't that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetsandI Posted December 19, 2018 Share Posted December 19, 2018 Bottom line is Mike Maccagnan should not repeat the Muhammad Wilkerson error with Leonard Williams. If Jets like him then they just pay the right price to keep him around. Otherwise, we move on. Counting on a potential trade for him is a waste of time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby816 Posted December 19, 2018 Share Posted December 19, 2018 31 minutes ago, JetsandI said: Bottom line is Mike Maccagnan should not repeat the Muhammad Wilkerson error with Leonard Williams. If Jets like him then they just pay the right price to keep him around. Otherwise, we move on. Counting on a potential trade for him is a waste of time. Well Leo isn’t playing good enough to get paid what top guys are. He’s well below the chunk of guys getting paid 10mill per or more per season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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