Game of Thrones - Our Watch has Ended

[NYRaider]

Ultimately Bran was the real big bad for the series. He caused the most blood shed and manipulated everything so that his family could rule. 

[AFlaccoSeagulls]

3 minutes ago, Heimdallr said:

Like @AFlaccoSeagulls just mentioned, Bran's entire story is a huge hole.

They showed he can go into the past and change events. We know he can see everything past and present, and at least a bit of the future. We know he can warg. Yet, he did nothing(?) this season. 

It would make a ton of sense if the 3ER actually orchestrated all this so he ended up on the throne, but they do not explain that well at all. Either Bran/3ER is super powerful and actually the bad guy that did this, or he is... useless? 

They really messed up that story

Yeah after watching 7 seasons of Bran (going into S8) I am 100% convinced that:

A. He's obviously becoming King because why the hell else would they include him for so long, and have so many people sacrifice for him, or

B. He's the most wasted/useless character in storytelling history.

Edited May 20, 2019 by AFlaccoSeagulls

[lancerman]

6 minutes ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said:

Which, of course, S8 does literally nothing to reinforce. There's absolutely nothing to indicate that Bran is the most powerful/important person in the world during this season.

"Oh he has visions!" that he could've used to prevent Dany's massacre, but didn't.

"He can warg!" but he doesn't.

If the show was convincing us that Bran was powerful in his current state, they failed completely and totally. He was 1000000% useless for all of S8. The only thing he accomplished was revealing Jon's heritage, which only drove Dany to become mad and commit genocide and put Bran on the throne as a result. 

And also led to everyone recognizing that Dany inevitably was going to trample over the world in a quest for power and convinced Jon to end the threat before it extended beyond King’s Landing 

[JonStark]

1 minute ago, NYRaider said:

And he knew that if Jon chose to reveal it that millions of innocent people would die and he’d ultimately end up on the throne. So he was willing to sacrifice millions of innocent lives so that he and his family could rule Westeros. 

It all makes sense, the real big bads were the Starks and they manipulated the Targarians and Lannister’s throughout the series.

 

Alright, if you want to play the reach game...

What if Bran saw the path to the least violent future was this one, and altered his moves to fit it? If he keep's Jon's lineage a secret, Dany could've done the same thing and then kept it going throughout the entire world.

We could play the ifs and buts game all day, but I'm still waiting for you to name someone that the remainder of King's Landing and the entirety of the realm would support more than Bran.

[Forge]

5 minutes ago, Heimdallr said:

Like @AFlaccoSeagulls just mentioned, Bran's entire story is a huge hole.

They showed he can go into the past and change events. We know he can see everything past and present, and at least a bit of the future. We know he can warg. Yet, he did nothing(?) this season. 

It would make a ton of sense if the 3ER actually orchestrated all this so he ended up on the throne, but they do not explain that well at all. Either Bran/3ER is super powerful and actually the bad guy that did this, or he is... useless? 

They really messed up that story

That line about "why do you think I came down here" was really bad in my opinion. 

[pwny]

4 minutes ago, BayRaider said:

I agree these are probably the end conclusions in the books. The point is how we got there and how absolutely unorganic they felt and rushed beyond measure. Sloppy execution throughout this entire season as well. Go ahead and watch reactions to Jon killing Danny. It’s blankness. No happiness, sadness, anger, surprised, nothing. It didn’t even feel real because of how poorly written, rushed, and executed the whole thing was. And the writers do deserve the blame because they rushed it on purpose for Star Wars. 

I have zero problem with these being the endings in the book but it will actually feel organic. 

If this is the complaint, I get it.

But the whole “this part doesn’t make sense” thing is really missing the mark. Could they have done a better job lengthening out the story and taking more time to explore things and really delve into it all? Sure. And I do wish there maybe 40 episodes to wrap up these last two seasons rather than what we got. 

But the idea that some of these actions don’t make any sense for the character, or that the endings don’t make sense to the source material, it’s just completely being incapable of connecting anything not right in front of you.

[Forge]

3 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

Ultimately Bran was the real big bad for the series. He caused the most blood shed and manipulated everything so that his family could rule. 

Or he chose to go the route that resulted in more immediate casualties but the better long term future if you want to play that game. Perhaps if someone else ascended the throne, the realm would have been plagued for wars for years upon years, centuries upon centuries.....

[NYRaider]

Just now, Forge said:

Or he chose to go the route that resulted in more immediate casualties but the better long term future if you want to play that game. Perhaps if someone else ascended the throne, the realm would have been plagued for wars for years upon years, centuries upon centuries.....

Millions of people just died so he could become king, he's evil and sadistic. He could've easily stopped Dany at any time but used her army and dragons to defeat his true enemy, the Night King, and then used Jon to drive her crazy, kill millions, and set up the perfect situation for him to assume control with no real threat to his power. 

[AFlaccoSeagulls]

4 minutes ago, lancerman said:

And also led to everyone recognizing that Dany inevitably was going to trample over the world in a quest for power and convinced Jon to end the threat before it extended beyond King’s Landing 

Are you confusing Bran with Varys?

2 minutes ago, Forge said:

That line about "why do you think I came down here" was really bad in my opinion. 

Especially after like 3 or 4 episodes ago when he explicitly said he "doesn't really want anymore".

[BayRaider]

Just now, pwny said:

If this is the complaint, I get it.

But the whole “this part doesn’t make sense” thing is really missing the mark. Could they have done a better job lengthening out the story and taking more time to explore things and really delve into it all? Sure. And I do wish there maybe 40 episodes to wrap up these last two seasons rather than what we got. 

But the idea that some of these actions don’t make any sense for the character, or that the endings don’t make sense to the source material, it’s just completely being incapable of connecting anything not right in front of you.

Yes I agree with this. 

I thought your reply was gonna be defending D&D quoting “73 hours is exactly what we planned”. They didn’t come out with that 73 hour quote until after they were in talks with Star Wars. And who plans for 73 hours? 100% they planned for 80 hours or 90 hours and probably 90. They rushed for Star Wars. So disappointing. 

I have a feeling Star Wars the first two movies could be epic and they rushed the third movie also for another future project. They have really lost my trust. 

[Heimdallr]

1 minute ago, Forge said:

Or he chose to go the route that resulted in more immediate casualties but the better long term future if you want to play that game. Perhaps if someone else ascended the throne, the realm would have been plagued for wars for years upon years, centuries upon centuries.....

It would have been cool if they did something to show Bran predicting outcomes, or ANY sort of backstory that shows his motivation. Is he acting as Bran, or as the 3ER? Was this the best outcome, or just what got him on the throne? How much did he actually know or influence? 

They did a terrible job explaining his character and purpose.

[pwny]

Just now, Forge said:

Or he chose to go the route that resulted in more immediate casualties but the better long term future if you want to play that game. Perhaps if someone else ascended the throne, the realm would have been plagued for wars for years upon years, centuries upon centuries.....

I don’t even think you need the perhaps there. If Bran didn’t do that, Dany still wins the war. But Jon doesn’t know that he’s a Targ, so there isn’t the internal struggle within himself as to whether or not he should love her. He marries Dany, and they rule together. Under the unbroken wheel. 

[lancerman]

Just now, AFlaccoSeagulls said:

Are you confusing Bran with Varys?

Especially after like 3 or 4 episodes ago when he explicitly said he "doesn't really want anymore".

Bran revealed the secret to Sam and instructed him to reveal it to Jon. Which led to a chain of people finding out and ultimately sparking the betrayal of Vary’s.

Don’t forget, Bran had the vision of Drogon over King’s Landing 

[pwny]

2 minutes ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said:

Especially after like 3 or 4 episodes ago when he explicitly said he "doesn't really want anymore".

Did you miss the part where he explained in this episode that he still didn’t want it, but that it was what was best?

[NYRaider]

5 minutes ago, JonStark said:

Alright, if you want to play the reach game...

What if Bran saw the path to the least violent future was this one, and altered his moves to fit it? If he keep's Jon's lineage a secret, Dany could've done the same thing and then kept it going throughout the entire world.

We could play the ifs and buts game all day, but I'm still waiting for you to name someone that the remainder of King's Landing and the entirety of the realm would support more than Bran.

The least violent future was one where millions of innocent people are burned to death? Nice. He could've just told Ayra to sneak into KL or kill her in the north wearing someone else's face, boom, problem solved. 

And um, Jon Snow? The character that was universally loved, admired, and respected by everyone throughout the series? Jamie didn't get put into exile for killing the Mad King. What could a 1,000 unsullied troops do without the dragon? The Northern Army with their allies would've killed them in a day.