ravishingone Posted February 2, 2019 Share Posted February 2, 2019 13 hours ago, bucsfan333 said: He's only got 21 guys. Like most teams do. No Jacobs at RB and Taylor at OL interesting. That's a whole lot of dline talent to pass on for the Bucs in the first round. Jonah could really pick up some hype if he grades out well in Indy. Hopefully he can end the debate in Indy if he can play tackle. Measurements and athletic testing will determine a lot for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kgarrett12486 Posted February 2, 2019 Share Posted February 2, 2019 17 hours ago, bucsfan333 said: Everyone wants a Saquon Barkley or an Ezekiel Elliot. But they're hard to find. We just need a running game that can pick up third and short and run clock in the fourth quarter. Running the ball any other time is a waste. A decent line will help us toward that far more than any RB. Barber is more than capable. But he can't get hit at the LOS 25% of the time anymore. If you're drafting a RB in the 1st round, you'd better be drafting that elite franchise 3 down back, ala Elliott, Barkley, Gurley. If not, you can find capable starters into the late round and hidden gems all over... I disagree with the only need to run it on 3rd and short and 4th quarter. That's just false. Teams that consistently get deep into the playoffs always have a strong run game. It's still an essential part of successful offenses that sustain their level. Plus, it goes a long way with helping TOP and keeping your D fresh... Peyton Barber is an ok starter, it is as simple as that. If he gets blocking, he can get positive yards. However, he's still on of the least efficient RBs in the league. PFF had him graded as the 2nd worst starter in this aspect. PFF also takes into account contact at the LOS and YAC. He's just not a guy that you're going to get a lot from after contact is made, which is what the higher end RBs give you... I don't see a game changing RB in this class. Honestly, with the holes we have on the OL and the needs on defense as a whole, I'm focusing my resources there in the draft. It's a deep class for these spots... I think we need to be looking at the FA class for a RB upgrade. It's a good year for them... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bucsfan333 Posted February 2, 2019 Share Posted February 2, 2019 1 hour ago, kgarrett12486 said: I disagree with the only need to run it on 3rd and short and 4th quarter. That's just false. Teams that consistently get deep into the playoffs always have a strong run game. It's still an essential part of successful offenses that sustain their level. Plus, it goes a long way with helping TOP and keeping your D fresh... Maybe five or 10 years ago. Running in the NFL now is a waste of a down. You don't need to establish the run or any of the other old cliches anymore. You just need to move the chains and score points. Passing the ball gives you a far greater chance of doing that than running the ball. Especially with the rules as they are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lil' Shorty Posted February 2, 2019 Share Posted February 2, 2019 At this point Bosa and Allen are out of reach at 5 to me. I’m locked in on Quinnen Williams or Ed Oliver for our first pick. If we can trade down and still get them all the better. McCoy back or not those guy would help set the tone on defense each week with Vea and JPP. Second round I’m looking at OL because I just don’t see that great of an upgrade coming from FA and you can’t pass on DL in the 1st. Who knows where guys will be slotted come April but guys like either Wis SR G’s could be in play, Dillard or Lindstorm, or maybe another top OT slips. Third round might be too late but if he’s there or worth a trade up into the 3rd go grab Jaylon Ferguson to be the RUSH LB. Remake the lines. To me you can grab a DB or RB in free agency and if the lines improve via the draft it will be better value all around to approach it like that. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kgarrett12486 Posted February 2, 2019 Share Posted February 2, 2019 1 hour ago, bucsfan333 said: Maybe five or 10 years ago. Running in the NFL now is a waste of a down. You don't need to establish the run or any of the other old cliches anymore. You just need to move the chains and score points. Passing the ball gives you a far greater chance of doing that than running the ball. Especially with the rules as they are. Nah, running is still essential even in today’s NFL. Offenses are definitely more geared toward pass first, which is great. However, the prolific offenses that sustain success (Chiefs, Rams, Saints, Chargers, Steelers) these teams run the ball in almost a 60/40 split. They still feature the pass heavily, but they know the value in running the ball as well. They certainly don’t just run it on 3rd and short on to just eat clock. You don’t need to be old school and run the ball like Baltimore did this year (although even they took the league by storm with that for a while lol), but you can’t make yourself 1 dimensional either. Just look at the success rate of teams that have to play from behind and abandon the run. The numbers screw dramatically in the defenses favor. Running the ball keeps the defense guessing... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bucsfan333 Posted February 2, 2019 Share Posted February 2, 2019 7 minutes ago, kgarrett12486 said: Nah, running is still essential even in today’s NFL. Offenses are definitely more geared toward pass first, which is great. However, the prolific offenses that sustain success (Chiefs, Rams, Saints, Chargers, Steelers) these teams run the ball in almost a 60/40 split. They still feature the pass heavily, but they know the value in running the ball as well. They certainly don’t just run it on 3rd and short on to just eat clock. You don’t need to be old school and run the ball like Baltimore did this year (although even they took the league by storm with that for a while lol), but you can’t make yourself 1 dimensional either. Just look at the success rate of teams that have to play from behind and abandon the run. The numbers screw dramatically in the defenses favor. Running the ball keeps the defense guessing... The Pats throw the ball 50 times one week and throw it 30 the next. And they've sustained a level of success never seen before. You don't have to be balanced running the ball 40% of the time if you can just as easily dump it off for five or six yards. The Chiefs won games ONLY because Andy Reid gave Mahomes so many different ways to spread the ball out. Their defense was awful but they were able to win shootouts throwing the ball and sprinkling in runs when they needed to. You throw the ball to get the lead and run the ball to close out the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kgarrett12486 Posted February 2, 2019 Share Posted February 2, 2019 2 minutes ago, bucsfan333 said: The Pats throw the ball 50 times one week and throw it 30 the next. And they've sustained a level of success never seen before. You don't have to be balanced running the ball 40% of the time if you can just as easily dump it off for five or six yards. The Chiefs won games ONLY because Andy Reid gave Mahomes so many different ways to spread the ball out. Their defense was awful but they were able to win shootouts throwing the ball and sprinkling in runs when they needed to. You throw the ball to get the lead and run the ball to close out the game. The Pats have had plenty of games this year where Michel has rushed 20+ times for well over 100 yards and scored multiple times and they’ve won comfortably. The Chiefs had plenty of games where Hunt ran 20+ times for well over 100 yards and scored multiple times and they’ve won comfortably. Just look at the difference in the Rams offense when Gurley/Anderson haven’t gotten going in the run game. They’ve lost games because of it. Point is there in no cut/dry way to win on offense. It’s all game flow and matchup specific and the teams that have FO’s and Coaches that understand this and can adjust on the fly have better success... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bucsfan333 Posted February 2, 2019 Share Posted February 2, 2019 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHOMP_CHOMP Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 (edited) On 2/2/2019 at 11:26 AM, bucsfan333 said: Maybe five or 10 years ago. Running in the NFL now is a waste of a down. You don't need to establish the run or any of the other old cliches anymore. You just need to move the chains and score points. Passing the ball gives you a far greater chance of doing that than running the ball. Especially with the rules as they are. 5 out of 6 NFC playoff teams ranked in the top-11 in rushing in the NFL. Only team not in there was the Eagles 3 out of 6 AFC teams ranked in the top-8 in the NFL in rushing. Chargers and Chiefs ranked 15th and 16th respectively, so still in the top half of the league. And thats just yards. No team ranks below 20th in attempts. So all of these teams are constantly trying to running the ball. Both the Rams and the Patriots were top-5 in rushing. Im sorry, but you are just wrong here. Running is still extremely important. Edited February 4, 2019 by CHOMP_CHOMP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bucsfan333 Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 2 minutes ago, CHOMP_CHOMP said: 5 out of 6 NFC playoff teams ranked in the top-11 in rushing in the NFL. Only team not in there was the Eagles 3 out of 6 AFC teams ranked in the top-8 in the NFL in rushing. Chargers and Chiefs ranked 15th and 16th respectively, so still in the top half of the league. And thats just yards. No team ranks below 20th in attempts. So all of these teams are constantly trying to running the ball. Both the Rams and the Patriots were top-5 in rushing. Im sorry, but you are just wrong here. Running is still extremely important. You're getting the cause and effect backwards. They ran the ball because they were winning during games. They weren't winning during games because they were running the ball. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHOMP_CHOMP Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 2 minutes ago, bucsfan333 said: You're getting the cause and effect backwards. They ran the ball because they were winning during games. They weren't winning during games because they were running the ball. Im sorry man. But you have it backwards. The foundation to any good football team is a running game. The Pats just finished the post season as the #1 rushing team. They finished the regular season as the #5 rushing team. I mean you can choose to believe what you want obviously. But trends and stats don't lie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ravishingone Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 8 minutes ago, CHOMP_CHOMP said: Im sorry man. But you have it backwards. The foundation to any good football team is a running game. The Pats just finished the post season as the #1 rushing team. They finished the regular season as the #5 rushing team. I mean you can choose to believe what you want obviously. But trends and stats don't lie. You need to know @bucsfan333 is either Trevor Sikkema or a very close relative. 😎 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHOMP_CHOMP Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 I do 100% agree that the game is changing and becoming more pass happy, but the running game is still the foundation and the key cog for most good offenses. Both the Rams and the Pats were top-5 in play action plays. Chiefs, and Saints were top-10 as well. I also agree that on 3rd and short, and in the 4th quarter are the most essential times to run the ball. I think that is clear common sense lol. But an effective run game is the most important part of any offense. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bucsfan333 Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ravishingone Posted February 5, 2019 Share Posted February 5, 2019 I wonder with a new staff, if the philosophy of drafting oline will change. I believe Licht has drafted 1 olinemen that didn t play tackle in college. They need a guard, will they draft a prospect who played guard in college? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.