WEEK 2 GDT - Chiefs @ Steelers

[43M]

3 hours ago, 3rivers said:

he just likes to start off bad and get into a shootout . He promotes  the new steelers ,(passing steelers) , not the old steelers ground game and TOP. When you are down 21-0 and have a few 3 and outs and are terrible, then the shootout is about to happen.  

Ben hasn't played well in september from 2015 onward, so this is actually the beginning of camp for him but he is getting game cheques

First off, while he sometimes gets off to slow starts, to insinuate he does it on purpose is laughable.

Secondly, our offense isnt built for Cowher-ball.   We dont have the road graders up front, nor do we have he defense to support that type of offense, and havent for quite a while.   And Cowher-ball (or Marty-ball, whatever you wanna call it), last time I checked, held us back for quite some time.    The type of offense we currently run isnt the problem...its the consistency and playcalling that are lacking.

Third, if you want to blame anyone for Ben being rusty, blame the coaches.   I mean, maybe he deserves some blame as well, but the coaches could send him out more than they do if they feels he needs the reps.   They dont.....and this is what happens.

And while Ben struggled last game at times, he had 4 TDs and no turnovers.    While Ben deserves some blame for certain things, the defense couldnt stop anything.

[3rivers]

agree about the D, that is the main problem. It would help if the offence could put up some points and get the ground game going a bit to keep the bad D off the field. Balance, or some hint of it will help the D, because from what I have noticed, the D looks to be a major problem . Guys can't tackle, safeties are lost and CB coverage is lacking. That isn't bens fault but if he could keep them off the field a bit more 

[warfelg]

Interesting stat pupped up on ESPN:

Brown is 1st in routes run over 15 yards, 2nd in targets over 15 yards, 53rd in catch percent over 15 yards (20%)

[VigilantZombie]

8 hours ago, FourThreeMafia said:

When has he ever blamed his WRs?   Please provide exact quotes and/or video/audio evidence.

I can provide many instances of Ben saying in press conferences that HE needs to play better.  Never heard him once blame a WR or OLine, but I admittedly, I may have missed it....so please, provide just one instance of this.   Thanks.

Im talking in game, wouldnt know what he is saying but we have all seen instances where he is seemingly telling the reciever he did something wrong, but its just the result of a bad throw. But "always" which is yhe word I chose i would agree is unfair because yes its true that post-game he does blame himself.

[warfelg]

19 minutes ago, wwhickok said:

Im talking in game, wouldnt know what he is saying but we have all seen instances where he is seemingly telling the reciever he did something wrong, but its just the result of a bad throw. But "always" which is yhe word I chose i would agree is unfair because yes its true that post-game he does blame himself.

Slight hot take here:

Ben is too selfless when it comes to blame.  I think that Ben laying some blame on the WR at times wouldn't foster this area where WR's can't talk about lack of touches.  I know Hines Ward did it; IIRC Holmes did it; Wallace did it; and now Brown?  Kinda hard to say this many #1 WR's had problems with being a diva.  I think it's down to the QB who constantly blames himself, making WR's think it isn't their problem.  I just once want to see Ben say that they didn't see the same thing, and they need to work on seeing the same thing.

[43M]

2 hours ago, wwhickok said:

Im talking in game, wouldnt know what he is saying but we have all seen instances where he is seemingly telling the reciever he did something wrong, but its just the result of a bad throw. But "always" which is yhe word I chose i would agree is unfair because yes its true that post-game he does blame himself.

No offense, but this is kind of along the same lines of faux outrage people have for Tomlin's PERCEIVED sideline activity.   Just petty and contrived complaints about something that doesnt warrant it.

I know what youre referring to, and Im not even saying that AT TIMES, he doesnt blame his WRs....but just as often, I see him upset with himself.    And the times I do see him giving his WRs a look like "You zigged when you shouldve zagged", but sometimes, that IS the case.    However, maybe its his fault some of those times....but in the heat of the game, you cant really knock on him for it, especially when we dont have the details.    It would be one thing if he was always berating his WRs and throwing temper tantrums....but the fact that Ben has seemingly always had a decent relationship with his WRs, I would say he isnt blaming them as much as you think....and when he does, it might be warranted in many cases.

There are alot of legit things to knock on Ben for, but I dont feel this is one of them.   Just my 2 cents.  

[VigilantZombie]

2 hours ago, FourThreeMafia said:

No offense, but this is kind of along the same lines of faux outrage people have for Tomlin's PERCEIVED sideline activity.   Just petty and contrived complaints about something that doesnt warrant it.

I know what youre referring to, and Im not even saying that AT TIMES, he doesnt blame his WRs....but just as often, I see him upset with himself.    And the times I do see him giving his WRs a look like "You zigged when you shouldve zagged", but sometimes, that IS the case.    However, maybe its his fault some of those times....but in the heat of the game, you cant really knock on him for it, especially when we dont have the details.    It would be one thing if he was always berating his WRs and throwing temper tantrums....but the fact that Ben has seemingly always had a decent relationship with his WRs, I would say he isnt blaming them as much as you think....and when he does, it might be warranted in many cases.

There are alot of legit things to knock on Ben for, but I dont feel this is one of them.   Just my 2 cents.  

No offense taken i can appreciate your opinion and dont completely disagree with you. 

[AFF]

7 hours ago, warfelg said:

Interesting stat pupped up on ESPN:

Brown is 1st in routes run over 15 yards, 2nd in targets over 15 yards, 53rd in catch percent over 15 yards (20%)

Yep, AB is just a victim in all this.

Still on pace 144 catches 1300 yds and 8 tds with yardage surely to go up.

But Ben with his 4100-31-11 stat line in his last 14 games is to blame for AB pouting and having a tantrum with his OC on TV while they were LOSING.

And now, he won’t be punished for going AWOL Monday(Tomlin wouldn’t confirm or deny it was excused at his press conference....I.e he wasn’t excused) except for a little fine...what a joke.

[Chieferific]

11 minutes ago, AlanFanecaFan said:

Yep, AB is just a victim in all this.

Still on pace 144 catches 1300 yds and 8 tds with yardage surely to go up.

But Ben with his 4100-31-11 stat line in his last 14 games is to blame for AB pouting and having a tantrum with his OC on TV while they were LOSING.

And now, he won’t be punished for going AWOL Monday(Tomlin wouldn’t confirm or deny it was excused at his press conference....I.e he wasn’t excused) except for a little fine...what a joke.

I understand your point and your frustration with his antics but in this case but I think he was more irritated about not getting the ball when he was wide open especially on some potential TDs and not so much about not being targeted enough. 

[warfelg]

Just now, Chieferific said:

I understand your point and your frustration with his antics but in this case I think he was more irritated about not getting the ball when he was wide open especially on some potential TDs and not so much about not being targeted enough. 

That, and I think he's getting frustrated with the inefficiency at which the offense is operating too.  It's very feast or famine right now.

[Chieferific]

24 minutes ago, warfelg said:

That, and I think he's getting frustrated with the inefficiency at which the offense is operating too.  It's very feast or famine right now.

If that's the case then this has been brewing for a while because that's been going on for years. 

[MOSteelers56]

I think a major aspect to this is what we've seen of Fitchner's offense compared to Haley's.

When teams bracketed AB in years past, Haley would get creative in ways to feed him the ball. Fitchner seems to be going to the other WR's when AB is blanket covered with 2-3 guys. 

This might be completely wrong but it is just something I thought of. 

[Dcash4]

44 minutes ago, MOSteelers56 said:

I think a major aspect to this is what we've seen of Fitchner's offense compared to Haley's.

When teams bracketed AB in years past, Haley would get creative in ways to feed him the ball. Fitchner seems to be going to the other WR's when AB is blanket covered with 2-3 guys. 

This might be completely wrong but it is just something I thought of. 

I do think you are treading the right path. The idea that he is mad because Roethlisberger is missing him is crazy to me. Can it be part of the problem, sure, but its not going to be the core issue. 33 targets in 2 games is a nuts work load. I believe what he is more concerned with is that there hasn't been much game planning to HELP Brown fight the double teams. They are just essentially putting him out there and letting him fend for himself. Those are the things that get frustrating -- when those targets are stuck fitting between 2-3 people and when you finally get the ball in your hands you have nothing to do with it. 

Last game is an awful example though. We ran no huddle so damn much that you cannot truly get into play calling and set up stuff. The X receiver lines up at the X spot and there are rarely motions -- its the nature of the no huddle beast. Game flow had a lot to do with that, but it is very limiting to you getting your play makers in situations that can cause stress to a defense. 

I thought Haley was awful at this as well, but I want to see more Brown in the slot, motions to the outside of brown, motioning Brown across formation, etc. Haley found ways to get the ball to Brown, but no one has ever just set Brown up for success from the lineup. I want to see us be more flexible -- especially with a guy like JuJu who can be inside/outside and McDonald who can be tight, slot, or wide in formations. 

Outside looking in -- I would think his frustrations lay entirely with Fitcher. First time NFL play caller, replacing a guy that Brown produced with, and in the first two games showed no awareness for trying to HELP Brown out. Add losing, add Ben missing open shots, add an egomaniac me first guy -- you have a powder keg. 

[VigilantZombie]

Seems as though Fichtner is content almost using AB as a 'decoy'. 

[Dcash4]

30 minutes ago, wwhickok said:

Seems as though Fichtner is content almost using AB as a 'decoy'. 

Decoys don’t get 33 targets though. Seems more like a first year NFL playcaller assuming good players will get theirs.

It’s still hard to tell who Fitcher is though. A slopfest and a whacked flow game are not great barometers.