deathstar Posted March 18, 2019 Share Posted March 18, 2019 1 minute ago, AlexGreen#20 said: Pretty sure the threat of a TE being able to turn it on and blow by somebody gives them extra cushion to be able to work underneath and throughout the entire route tree. Ok. There are a lot of things that factor into a TE being able to 'turn it on and blow by somebody'. 40 yard time is a factor, sure. So are explosive measures like vertical and broad jump - Hock's elite there. His 3 cone and short shuttle are equally elite, meaning his routes will be pretty damn crisp. All of those are as big of a factor as how fast he can run 40 yards in a straight line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incognito_man Posted March 18, 2019 Share Posted March 18, 2019 3 minutes ago, deathstar said: I understand I was brief but I linked why I believed Hockenson was an equivalent athlete and he replied that Fant runs 40 yards faster without addressing anything else. What more needs to be shown? A 4.5 vs 4.7 TE is a very different player... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deathstar Posted March 18, 2019 Share Posted March 18, 2019 1 minute ago, incognito_man said: What more needs to be shown? A 4.5 vs 4.7 TE is a very different player... ... so I suppose Vernon Davis was the best TE of all time? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PossibleCabbage Posted March 18, 2019 Share Posted March 18, 2019 100% of the reasons that Fant won't be better than Hockenson are about personality, which NFL teams are better equipped to evaluate than I am. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FinneasGage Posted March 18, 2019 Share Posted March 18, 2019 9 hours ago, AlexGreen#20 said: Fant is a better NFL prospect than Hockenson, change my mind i agree, i said the same thing earlier in here i think. i just get a little pause w/ his lack of high-pointing and lack of ability after he snags it. i think he's TE1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skibrett15 Posted March 18, 2019 Share Posted March 18, 2019 12 minutes ago, deathstar said: I've seen you say this a lot. I want to make sure I understand to what extent you're advocating not running the ball. How many pass attempts do you believe Rodgers should have a game in proportion to run attempts (obviously not Rodgers not running the ball)? 66-70% while the game is in question. 20-30% while up 2 or more scores in the 4th quarter. Should work out to about 60-40 on a winning team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incognito_man Posted March 18, 2019 Share Posted March 18, 2019 4 minutes ago, deathstar said: ... so I suppose Vernon Davis was the best TE of all time? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FinneasGage Posted March 18, 2019 Share Posted March 18, 2019 1 minute ago, PossibleCabbage said: 100% of the reasons that Fant won't be better than Hockenson are about personality, which NFL teams are better equipped to evaluate than I am. i do kinda feel like he got his brother to publicly complain about his usage for him but that's just conjecture. he seems a little immature, but he didn't say anything wrong in public interviews even when reporters were baiting him into stuff. i don't think he'll be a problem. hock 100% won't cause issues though. i don't think it's an "issue" w/ fant though personally Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deathstar Posted March 18, 2019 Share Posted March 18, 2019 Just now, incognito_man said: Well what are you saying man? There's more to an athlete than their 40 time. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skibrett15 Posted March 18, 2019 Share Posted March 18, 2019 4 minutes ago, deathstar said: ... so I suppose Vernon Davis was the best TE of all time? it's a big part of the reason he's still an effective player at 34/35 or whatever he is right now. The rest of his game was borderline deficient, and yet he's still a good player because of the juice in those legs. Dont' have any opinion on Iowa TEs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexGreen#20 Posted March 18, 2019 Share Posted March 18, 2019 5 minutes ago, deathstar said: I understand I was brief but I linked why I believed Hockenson was an equivalent athlete and he replied that Fant runs 40 yards faster without addressing anything else. What do you want me to say? Hock is .625 inches taller and 2 lbs heavier. Fant ran .2 seconds faster on the 40 Fant put up 3 more bench reps (who cares?) Fant was .21 seconds faster in his 3 come. 2 inches higher vert 4 inches higher broad. Bigger hands, longer arms. Literally every aspect of measurable athleticism favors Fant and in the case of the most representative measurements, they favor him by a lot. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gopackgo247 Posted March 18, 2019 Share Posted March 18, 2019 1 minute ago, incognito_man said: 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deathstar Posted March 18, 2019 Share Posted March 18, 2019 2 minutes ago, AlexGreen#20 said: What do you want me to say? Hock is .625 inches taller and 2 lbs heavier. Fant ran .2 seconds faster on the 40 Fant put up 3 more bench reps (who cares?) Fant was .21 seconds faster in his 3 come. 2 inches higher vert 4 inches higher broad. Bigger hands, longer arms. Literally every aspect of measurable athleticism favors Fant and in the case of the most representative measurements, they favor him by a lot. My belief is that Hock is equally as elite when compared to other prospects at the tight end position. We have a database of prospects to back that up. https://twitter.com/MathBomb For all intents and purposes they're equivalent athletes compared to their peers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexGreen#20 Posted March 18, 2019 Share Posted March 18, 2019 16 minutes ago, deathstar said: My belief is that Hock is equally as elite when compared to other prospects at the tight end position. We have a database of prospects to back that up. https://twitter.com/MathBomb For all intents and purposes they're equivalent athletes compared to their peers. So because this dude's formula is bad at comparing athletes on the higher end of the spectrum, you're going to ignore the raw data? That's ******* retarded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannondale Posted March 18, 2019 Share Posted March 18, 2019 Why is it with Hackysack everyone is willing to dismiss an inch here or a second there ? It all matters. And if it can be overcome today, it may not be overcome tomorrow. The sum of all the parts add up - either positively or negatively. Dismissing "every little thing" is how you end up with an average player, or worse. We are not talking about a 4th rounder here. At #12 or even #30 you better have some elite skillsets. Since he doesn't have any, and plays tight end, his value drops Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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