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Around the NFL II - Even NFLier


y2lamanaki

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48 minutes ago, Chrissooner49er said:

Which I interpret to mean we must use our 1st pick on an edge rusher...not a DB (nor a trade for Ramsey, either).

Yeah, I am torn on this. Especially if Bosa is truly in play again. I can't trade the #1 overall for Jalen Ramsey. But trading back with a team wanting to get to the top, using the first we get in return on Ramsey, and having the ammo to get a pass rusher in the mid-late first? I think that is definitely a path I would take. 

But there are two separate ways our defense is very bad - and creating turnovers is one of them. Having to force a QB to throw to Ramsey or Sherman would almost certainly help with that (of course, one could also argue that so would a pass rush). If we can find a way to improve the pass rush in free agency or through an accumulation of extra draft picks, though, I absolutely trade for Ramsey.

Heck, if we have the #1 overall, maybe the Jags make a trade up for Herbert that involves a swap of firsts (of which they look certain to be top 10), Ramsey, and our 2nd. We could still get one of the top EDGE guys in that scenario. 

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11 minutes ago, y2lamanaki said:

Yeah, I am torn on this. Especially if Bosa is truly in play again. I can't trade the #1 overall for Jalen Ramsey. But trading back with a team wanting to get to the top, using the first we get in return on Ramsey, and having the ammo to get a pass rusher in the mid-late first? I think that is definitely a path I would take. 

But there are two separate ways our defense is very bad - and creating turnovers is one of them. Having to force a QB to throw to Ramsey or Sherman would almost certainly help with that (of course, one could also argue that so would a pass rush). If we can find a way to improve the pass rush in free agency or through an accumulation of extra draft picks, though, I absolutely trade for Ramsey.

Heck, if we have the #1 overall, maybe the Jags make a trade up for Herbert that involves a swap of firsts (of which they look certain to be top 10), Ramsey, and our 2nd. We could still get one of the top EDGE guys in that scenario. 

I want Dieonte Thompson in the worst way, also. Our (free, unless Tartt is hurt) safety play is a big part of not creating turnovers, because the free safety is the one that is supposed to feast on all of the outside leverage we work with our corners. Passes deep have been more efficient than the average play as a whole by DVOA, but we've allowed passes over the deep middle and deep (defensive) right to go for 86.7% and 71.2% above the average pass play respectively, both just about last in the league. We've been way better against short passes (especially those not towards the defense's right, there's a pattern here) and deep passes towards Sherman's side of the field. Long story short, the deep center and deep right are the weak spots. Yes, that is partly pass rush, but it is also incompetant play at crucial secondary positions. We're a touch below the median in terms of sack rate per play (thanks, Raiders). We're freaking terrible in the secondary.

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1 hour ago, y2lamanaki said:

Yeah, I am torn on this. Especially if Bosa is truly in play again. I can't trade the #1 overall for Jalen Ramsey. But trading back with a team wanting to get to the top, using the first we get in return on Ramsey, and having the ammo to get a pass rusher in the mid-late first? I think that is definitely a path I would take. 

But there are two separate ways our defense is very bad - and creating turnovers is one of them. Having to force a QB to throw to Ramsey or Sherman would almost certainly help with that (of course, one could also argue that so would a pass rush). If we can find a way to improve the pass rush in free agency or through an accumulation of extra draft picks, though, I absolutely trade for Ramsey.

Heck, if we have the #1 overall, maybe the Jags make a trade up for Herbert that involves a swap of firsts (of which they look certain to be top 10), Ramsey, and our 2nd. We could still get one of the top EDGE guys in that scenario. 

Honestly, I don't think that we end up with the first overall pick, so I'm not really that concerned about trading our first for Ramsey. I'll re-evaluate that if we do in fact end up with the first round pick. I still think we win at least one more game, possibly week 17 against the Rams when they are resting their starters. 

If we end up with the first overall pick, I'd be more willing to give up more value by giving them our second rounder this year and #1 next year as opposed to simply this year's #1. 

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39 minutes ago, Forge said:

I'd trade that pick for Ramsey in a heartbeat lol

eh, don't think I would. Not enough years on his rookie deal, and he's a bit of a nut, yeah? I would work something out that equaled 1st rd value.. but top 10 draft value? eh. 

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13 minutes ago, oldman9er said:

eh, don't think I would. Not enough years on his rookie deal, and he's a bit of a nut, yeah? I would work something out that equaled 1st rd value.. but top 10 draft value? eh. 

He's the best corner in the NFL. I feel like your odds of getting a comparable player, even in the top 5, are pretty slim (exhibit A: Solomon Thomas). The hardest part is to gauge whether the position is worthy to pass up the edge rusher this team so desperately needs. Corner, while important, is nowhere near as important as a pass rusher. But given the fact that he's an elite player in the NFL and a known quantity, I'm not really keen on passing that up for an unknown. 

I don't think he's a nut. He's outspoke and has opinions, but he's not really been a menace or anything. I called him high maintenance in another thread. 

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3 minutes ago, Forge said:

I don't think he's a nut. He's outspoke and has opinions, but he's not really been a menace or anything. I called him high maintenance in another thread. 

Yeah, plus he would have a great tutor on how to be annoyingly confident and a great team player simultaneously on the other side of the field in Sherman. Pretty ideal, really. 

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1 hour ago, Forge said:

He's the best corner in the NFL. I feel like your odds of getting a comparable player, even in the top 5, are pretty slim (exhibit A: Solomon Thomas). The hardest part is to gauge whether the position is worthy to pass up the edge rusher this team so desperately needs. Corner, while important, is nowhere near as important as a pass rusher. But given the fact that he's an elite player in the NFL and a known quantity, I'm not really keen on passing that up for an unknown. 

I don't think he's a nut. He's outspoke and has opinions, but he's not really been a menace or anything. I called him high maintenance in another thread. 

*2nd best behind Patrick Peterson

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9 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

*2nd best behind Patrick Peterson

I could get behind that. Point still stands though lol. He's an elite talent and producer. He's worth a top 10 pick. 

Now, would I be more inclined to offer this years #2 and next years 1 more so than a top 3 pick this year? Absolutely. Just don't know if that would be an option. 

That being said, there's a corner in this draft that could be worthy of a top 3 pick (I don't think he'll go there given the defensive front available, but he could), and could be a viable selection for us. I really have a hard time seeing why anyone would want to take Greedy in the top 3 rather than just the pick for Jalen Ramsey. 

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5 hours ago, Forge said:

I could get behind that. Point still stands though lol. He's an elite talent and producer. He's worth a top 10 pick. 

Now, would I be more inclined to offer this years #2 and next years 1 more so than a top 3 pick this year? Absolutely. Just don't know if that would be an option. 

That being said, there's a corner in this draft that could be worthy of a top 3 pick (I don't think he'll go there given the defensive front available, but he could), and could be a viable selection for us. I really have a hard time seeing why anyone would want to take Greedy in the top 3 rather than just the pick for Jalen Ramsey. 

Is greedy with that? I don t think so.

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