ravishingone Posted October 28, 2018 Share Posted October 28, 2018 9 minutes ago, Buc Ball said: I don’t think we’ve had a single assistant coach move on to a promotion at another team since the Gruden days. Thats an awful lot of sub par coaching talent. nope not at the pro level. Only PJ Fleck in college. So who is talented on the roster and who isnt when the coaching staff is constantly below average. Today was a good defensive performance? 400 yds, 30 pts, no turnovers and 5 offside penalties. Let s hope the Glazers choose wisely this time around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ravishingone Posted October 29, 2018 Share Posted October 29, 2018 Interesting fast- It is almost guaranteed the last 2 DCs (Not counting Duffner) will never coach in the NFL again. Kind of hard to win when your team is so over matched with one of it s coordinators. Don't get me wrong there are some real mutts on the offensive side and special teams who suck also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buc Ball Posted October 29, 2018 Share Posted October 29, 2018 4 hours ago, ravishingone said: Interesting fast- It is almost guaranteed the last 2 DCs (Not counting Duffner) will never coach in the NFL again. Kind of hard to win when your team is so over matched with one of it s coordinators. Don't get me wrong there are some real mutts on the offensive side and special teams who suck also. I expect Smith will get a job elsewhere. He’s probably at the stage where he could get a consultant type role. You need to back to Jim Bates to find a DC that we fired not getting another shot in the NFL, so it wouldn’t surprise me if we see Smith appear somewhere, even if not as a DC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ravishingone Posted October 29, 2018 Share Posted October 29, 2018 10 minutes ago, Buc Ball said: I expect Smith will get a job elsewhere. He’s probably at the stage where he could get a consultant type role. You need to back to Jim Bates to find a DC that we fired not getting another shot in the NFL, so it wouldn’t surprise me if we see Smith appear somewhere, even if not as a DC. He may work for the league, but at his age I think he has no interest in being a position coach. No one is hiring him as a DC again. Another fun fact after Winston s rookie year, George Warhop who has been the oline coach for 5 years now got an additional title which meant more money as "The Run Game Coordinator". Now that is funny. What I am getting and which has been a recurring theme since Gruden, the coaching staff s have not been good enough. A lot of debate on which player is good or bad on this team. It is difficult to say a player isn t good when playing for rhis franchise because the coaches have sucked. How do I know this? When staffs get fired by the Bucs, the rest of the league has shown time and time again they were nt very good because at best they secured lateral jobs after the Bucs. And quite frankly, it isn t that high of a percentage they even get a lateral job. Anyone think Brett Maxie, John Hoke, Mike Bajakian, or Nate Kaczor are more or less likely to get a lateral move after Tampa? Look I was wrong about this staff and Koetter doomed himself when he made no changes in January, sxcept one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REDandPEWTER Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 Seems like no one wants to place blame on players either. Jason Licht needs to be held accountable for his poor drafting and moves. He’s better than Dom but his ego of high risk draft choices haven’t reaped any rewards. Noah Spence or Yannick? Fail Vernon Hargreaves after a putrid junior year? Fail Aguayo over several players including yannick again ? Lol 2014: mike Evans saves this class from being an abomination. Free agency moves. Drafting dumb football players. No GM gets it right but man his evaluation skills are bad in important areas. Can’t find a kicker. Turn style DL. He’s luckily JPp was available for trade. The running game. And QB. He preached TOs kill any team yet drafts one who does nothing but turn it over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buc Ball Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 14 hours ago, ravishingone said: He may work for the league, but at his age I think he has no interest in being a position coach. No one is hiring him as a DC again. Another fun fact after Winston s rookie year, George Warhop who has been the oline coach for 5 years now got an additional title which meant more money as "The Run Game Coordinator". Now that is funny. What I am getting and which has been a recurring theme since Gruden, the coaching staff s have not been good enough. A lot of debate on which player is good or bad on this team. It is difficult to say a player isn t good when playing for rhis franchise because the coaches have sucked. How do I know this? When staffs get fired by the Bucs, the rest of the league has shown time and time again they were nt very good because at best they secured lateral jobs after the Bucs. And quite frankly, it isn t that high of a percentage they even get a lateral job. Anyone think Brett Maxie, John Hoke, Mike Bajakian, or Nate Kaczor are more or less likely to get a lateral move after Tampa? Look I was wrong about this staff and Koetter doomed himself when he made no changes in January, sxcept one. Good points. I don’t think you can put it on any one factor. Are we consistently bad because the coaching is bad? Are the coaches actually getting the best out of a bad group of players? It’s tough to say, but if you coach on a bad team in the NFL, you’re very unlikely to get another equivalent job unless you’re well connected. I think the answer lies somewhere in the middle for this regime. I don’t think we’re getting the most out of the talent we have. David has significantly regressed, even if he is still a good player, for example. I don’t think the talent we’re being provided with is good enough either. Licht seems to be able to identify athletes and people who are physically capable of playing at a high level, but his drafting suggests he struggles to identify players with the mental toughness to play in the NFL. That’s one interpretation. Another is that the coaching staff creates an environment that puts undue pressure on players and focuses on preventing negative plays rather than encouraging positive plays. Either way, we’ve had an inordinately high number of draft picks who have struggled with confidence or more generally with the mental side of the game since 2014. You then have to wonder about the atmosphere the Glazers create at the top of the organisation. We’ve been turned down by several coaches during their tenure and I think the Gruden era very much papered over the cracks. From the way we fired Dungy to the way we continuously prevented talented position coaches interviewing for coordinator positions with other team, you have to imagine there’s more than a few coaches who would think twice before signing, even after all this time. Some kind of change is needed, but I don’t think there’s anyone involved with this team who can claim that they’re not part of the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ravishingone Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 16 minutes ago, Buc Ball said: Good points. I don’t think you can put it on any one factor. Are we consistently bad because the coaching is bad? Are the coaches actually getting the best out of a bad group of players? It’s tough to say, but if you coach on a bad team in the NFL, you’re very unlikely to get another equivalent job unless you’re well connected. I think the answer lies somewhere in the middle for this regime. I don’t think we’re getting the most out of the talent we have. David has significantly regressed, even if he is still a good player, for example. I don’t think the talent we’re being provided with is good enough either. Licht seems to be able to identify athletes and people who are physically capable of playing at a high level, but his drafting suggests he struggles to identify players with the mental toughness to play in the NFL. That’s one interpretation. Another is that the coaching staff creates an environment that puts undue pressure on players and focuses on preventing negative plays rather than encouraging positive plays. Either way, we’ve had an inordinately high number of draft picks who have struggled with confidence or more generally with the mental side of the game since 2014. You then have to wonder about the atmosphere the Glazers create at the top of the organisation. We’ve been turned down by several coaches during their tenure and I think the Gruden era very much papered over the cracks. From the way we fired Dungy to the way we continuously prevented talented position coaches interviewing for coordinator positions with other team, you have to imagine there’s more than a few coaches who would think twice before signing, even after all this time. Some kind of change is needed, but I don’t think there’s anyone involved with this team who can claim that they’re not part of the problem. Excellent points. I firmly believe if the Glazers can get the GM hire right, everything else will fall into place. Licht was the best of the last 3, but he wasn't t good enough in comparison to his peers in the league. I don't think anything more is done to this current roster, this regime is out of additional chances to fix problems they created. If I m the Glazer, this regime convinced them to keep Mike Smith at all costs. Reportedly, the highest paid DC in the league. How many kickers now? Can't blame the Glazers for telling Licht/Koetter fix Cat, 3.75 million spent on kickers is what we budgeted for that position. Besides Joe Douglas, I m intrigued by Eliot Wolf. I expect the Glazers to hire the GM first this time around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
indifference Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 4 hours ago, REDandPEWTER said: Seems like no one wants to place blame on players either. Jason Licht needs to be held accountable for his poor drafting and moves. He’s better than Dom but his ego of high risk draft choices haven’t reaped any rewards. Noah Spence or Yannick? Fail Vernon Hargreaves after a putrid junior year? Fail Aguayo over several players including yannick again ? Lol 2014: mike Evans saves this class from being an abomination. Free agency moves. Drafting dumb football players. No GM gets it right but man his evaluation skills are bad in important areas. Can’t find a kicker. Turn style DL. He’s luckily JPp was available for trade. The running game. And QB. He preached TOs kill any team yet drafts one who does nothing but turn it over. That kicker pick was crucial. Set us back with that idiotic decision. Again, this kicker was showing REGRESSION. I’ve learned my lesson from CFB prospects in that regard. If they arent improving from year to year regardless of “talent” buyer beware. Winston is a valuable lesson in this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REDandPEWTER Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 39 minutes ago, indifference said: That kicker pick was crucial. Set us back with that idiotic decision. Again, this kicker was showing REGRESSION. I’ve learned my lesson from CFB prospects in that regard. If they arent improving from year to year regardless of “talent” buyer beware. Winston is a valuable lesson in this. Winston , Hargreaves are prime examples. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BucsDraftGeek47 Posted October 31, 2018 Share Posted October 31, 2018 9 hours ago, REDandPEWTER said: Winston , Hargreaves are prime examples. the thing that really upsets me is that when we had that number 1 pick, all i wanted was for us to not deal with another Josh Freeman type and i feel like that is exactly what happened Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ravishingone Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 Something I 've thought about awhile and there will be no easy answer over the next 8 weeks. The Todd Monken question? The positives of the current OC, machine like efficiency with yardage and points. Negatives hasn't had a consistent running game for 3 seasons. Now running game is diminished, I agree. However, it sure helps a team who is ahead in the 2nd half to grind out a couple of 1st downs to help the victory. Examples Saints and Eagles. Just superior talent that any decent offensive scheme would capitalize, or brilliance in scheme formulated by Monken? I think it is a given the GM/HC survive with a 9-7`record. However, how confident are you this is a Super Bowl duo? Positives, they also get credit for the offense. Negatives horrific defense and special teams. Stupid arse rotations at different positions. Is it scheme or talent for the weaknesses of the team? Can Licht and Koetter figure it out? That s quite a leap of faith. Hypothetically, GM/ HC gets fired. Didn't the team just fire it s last HC to keep the OC? Is he the next offensive genuis a la Bill Walsh under Mike Brown in Cincy (history lesson ?)? Or is he the next Mike Martz minus a Super Bowl? A genius OC for his time, who was a pretty average HC, but his offense in St Louis was prolific with multiple QBs. Would Monken even want to stay under a new HC, especially if he doesn't get the job? What a sticky mess looking with no easy answers. #ItsABucsLife ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bucsfan333 Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 I honestly don't know what to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REDandPEWTER Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 Honestly I really like Monken and what he brings to the table. I was just thinking this myself. I wouldn’t want to risk losing Monken because I think he’s a straight shooter with a creative offensive mind hindered by a crappy qb situation and run game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REDandPEWTER Posted November 3, 2018 Share Posted November 3, 2018 I’m on shortys Dan Campbell train. We need a coach that will implement discipline and hold others accountable. Yeah we had that with Greg schiano but he didn’t get respect because he was a “Rutgers guy”. Campbell was in New Orleans the past few years and the colts almost hired him when Mcpussy changed his mind. This would allow the Bucs to hopefully retain Monken who gets it from an offensive standpoint, if for some reason he isn’t hired by a college program per say Florida state. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ravishingone Posted November 3, 2018 Share Posted November 3, 2018 Monken s resume gets better by the week. He took a dormant mid major to a bowl game. His QB just shredded a pro defense from college. Pro resume speaks for itself. He probably isnt under contract past this sesson. I find it difficult to believe he would come back as an OC under a new regime. Considering he interviewed for Miss State, he doesnt appear reluctant to go back to college. Very difficult decision looming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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