Other coaching news

[ravishingone]

28 minutes ago, Buc Ball said:

I think there’s a difference between acting as an apologist and presenting objective facts/ challenging poor arguments.

Koetter hasn’t created a good environment or culture for this team. There’s a long list of situations he’s mishandled:

- The whole Doug Martin thing

- The whole Winston thing

- Not holding Warhop accountable

- Not holding Smith accountable until it was beyond untenable

- The whole Monken thing

- The Oline rotation

You also make a great point around Jackson basically calling the shots. You don’t allow a player to pick and choose the what and when. The minute you start doing that, pack your bags because that player doesn’t respect you.

Koetter has created a negative environment. Everything in the media is about what players shouldn’t do, not what they should do. We’re coached negatively and as a result, the players appear to focus on not making mistakes, rather than making positive plays. His message simply doesn’t work as an HC.

It s a crap show that no QB can consistently win in.  What it be a stretch to get better QB performance from either Fitz or Jameis with less 7 step drops even if the oline stayed the same?

Could the pass defense get worse without Grimes? Why would they expect D Smith to consistently hold the edge to keep throwing the ball over 10 yds.  The Skins certainly didnt ask the oline to do that unless it was max protect.  My point is the coaching staff is relying on players to do things they can t or aren t willing to do.  

On a separate note, why the hell is the coaching staff having Vea line up off the LOS.  Brentson Buckner, wtf 🤔

[ravishingone]

It s not unprecedented for a team to can a coordinator and HC, those Brownies sure seal clubbed the Falcons today.  Maybe a 7 game audition for Monken?  🤔

[REDandPEWTER]

4 minutes ago, ravishingone said:

It s not unprecedented for a team to can a coordinator and HC, those Brownies sure seal clubbed the Falcons today.  Maybe a 7 game audition for Monken?  🤔

I mean I’m all for it. I think Monken has so much upside as a future coach. Stripping him of the play calling for no reason could seal Koetters fate tomorrow. 

[Lil' Shorty]

I don’t want Monken to be the HC because this whole staff and front office needs to go, but yeah why not, fire Koetter and let Monken show what he can do for 7 weeks.

 

GM: Jeff Ireland (who’s in New Orleans)

HC: Dan Campbell (who’s in New Orleans)

Maybe we can even sign Mark Ingram in free agency..

[ravishingone]

Just now, Lil' Shorty said:

I don’t want Monken to be the HC because this whole staff and front office needs to go, but yeah why not, fire Koetter and let Monken show what he can do for 7 weeks.

 

GM: Jeff Ireland (who’s in New Orleans)

HC: Dan Campbell (who’s in New Orleans)

Maybe we can even sign Mark Ingram in free agency..

I m just trying to make sense why Koetter took back play calling.  There was no benefit with only possible negatives, which happened today.  He proved he wasn t the most effective plat caller on the staff.  His public admission he doesn t over see the defense.  I kind of feel like Koetter is trying to abandon ship at this point.  I mean he has publically under mined both of his coordinators and his starting QBs.  

He may not survive past Monday.  This is crazy even for the Bucs franchise.

[Lil' Shorty]

2 hours ago, ravishingone said:

I m just trying to make sense why Koetter took back play calling.  There was no benefit with only possible negatives, which happened today.  He proved he wasn t the most effective plat caller on the staff.  His public admission he doesn t over see the defense.  I kind of feel like Koetter is trying to abandon ship at this point.  I mean he has publically under mined both of his coordinators and his starting QBs.  

He may not survive past Monday.  This is crazy even for the Bucs franchise.

I think he’s just gone mad. This is getting worse than Schiano.

[Lil' Shorty]

We all seem to be able to list a handful of HC candidates, but few GM candidates.

Outside of Joe Douglas, Eliot Wolf or Jeff Ireland, any other names you guys would be interested in?

[Buc Ball]

12 hours ago, ravishingone said:

It s a crap show that no QB can consistently win in.  What it be a stretch to get better QB performance from either Fitz or Jameis with less 7 step drops even if the oline stayed the same?

Could the pass defense get worse without Grimes? Why would they expect D Smith to consistently hold the edge to keep throwing the ball over 10 yds.  The Skins certainly didnt ask the oline to do that unless it was max protect.  My point is the coaching staff is relying on players to do things they can t or aren t willing to do.  

On a separate note, why the hell is the coaching staff having Vea line up off the LOS.  Brentson Buckner, wtf 🤔

A general theme of this regime has been that we don’t put players in a situation or position to succeed. It really isn’t rocket science, but we seem intent on fitting players into a scheme, rather than fitting our scheme around the strengths of the players we’ve got.

Lovie did it defensively, Koetter did it offensively, Smith did it defensively. There’s a definite theme. 

[bucsfan333]

1 hour ago, Buc Ball said:

A general theme of this regime has been that we don’t put players in a situation or position to succeed. It really isn’t rocket science, but we seem intent on fitting players into a scheme, rather than fitting our scheme around the strengths of the players we’ve got.

Lovie did it defensively, Koetter did it offensively, Smith did it defensively. There’s a definite theme. 

I feel like a lot of our coaching probably looks like

with little in the way of adjustments or anything. Just lots of, "Here's the thing. Do the thing. Even if you can't. Just do it."

Then when guys can't, we start over with the same ****. And do it over and over and over. And when it still doesn't work, we just keep doing it. Because that's what we do.

Jameis sucks at the deep ball? Better chuck it deep early and often.

We run zone off coverage? Better draft press man CBs.

We want safeties that can cover? Better bring in hard hitting box safeties.

We prioritize pass blocking and receiving in our RBs? Better draft a guy who's never done either.

We wanna run a defense that only rushes four to get pressure? Better take the biggest guy in the draft and plop him right in the middle.

Then "messages aren't getting across" because guys can't/haven't ever done what they're being asked to do. It's asinine.

 

Let's start our search by eliminating guys that have "their scheme" and go from there.

[REDandPEWTER]

4 minutes ago, bucsfan333 said:

I feel like a lot of our coaching probably looks like

with little in the way of adjustments or anything. Just lots of, "Here's the thing. Do the thing. Even if you can't. Just do it."

Then when guys can't, we start over with the same ****. And do it over and over and over. And when it still doesn't work, we just keep doing it. Because that's what we do.

Jameis sucks at the deep ball? Better chuck it deep early and often.

We run zone off coverage? Better draft press man CBs.

We want safeties that can cover? Better bring in hard hitting box safeties.

We prioritize pass blocking and receiving in our RBs? Better draft a guy who's never done either.

We wanna run a defense that only rushes four to get pressure? Better take the biggest guy in the draft and plop him right in the middle.

Then "messages aren't getting across" because guys can't/haven't ever done what they're being asked to do. It's asinine.

 

Let's start our search by eliminating guys that have "their scheme" and go from there.

To be fair. If jameis can’t throw the deep ball he shouldn’t be a starter. 

You also can’t eliminate shots down the field either. Limit it but not eliminate  

And we can’t play straight up man defense all game either  we have to confuse qbs now a days  man is too easy to pick apart with the rules  

it’s almost as if you’re saying simplify the scheme and not implement coverages to confuse opposing offenses.

 

[bucsfan333]

1 minute ago, REDandPEWTER said:

To be fair. If jameis can’t throw the deep ball he shouldn’t be a starter. 

You also can’t eliminate shots down the field either. Limit it but not eliminate  

And we can’t play straight up man defense all game either  we have to confuse qbs now a days  man is too easy to pick apart with the rules  

it’s almost as if you’re saying simplify the scheme and not implement coverages to confuse opposing offenses.

No. I'm saying if you're gonna put emphasis on things, draft guys that can can actually do it. If not, change how you do things. Enough of this 'do it anyway' bull****.

[Buc Ball]

5 minutes ago, bucsfan333 said:

I feel like a lot of our coaching probably looks like

with little in the way of adjustments or anything. Just lots of, "Here's the thing. Do the thing. Even if you can't. Just do it."

Then when guys can't, we start over with the same ****. And do it over and over and over. And when it still doesn't work, we just keep doing it. Because that's what we do.

Jameis sucks at the deep ball? Better chuck it deep early and often.

We run zone off coverage? Better draft press man CBs.

We want safeties that can cover? Better bring in hard hitting box safeties.

We prioritize pass blocking and receiving in our RBs? Better draft a guy who's never done either.

We wanna run a defense that only rushes four to get pressure? Better take the biggest guy in the draft and plop him right in the middle.

Then "messages aren't getting across" because guys can't/haven't ever done what they're being asked to do. It's asinine.

 

Let's start our search by eliminating guys that have "their scheme" and go from there.

It’s just bizarre.

Davis and VH3 are press corners. Whether they’re any good at the pro level at that skill, we don’t know, but that’s what kind of players they are - why don’t we use them there?

Winston doesn’t have a good deep ball, so why continuously ask him to do something that’s one of the weaker parts of his game. Focus on what the players you draft can actually do as a starting point. Now, granted, if we draft a QB first overall, you’d expect him to have the ability to make every throw, but there’s no harm in bringing a prospect along slowly.

There’s a degree of management that needs to go into getting any young player up to speed. Get them doing what they’re comfortable at, let them derive confidence from that, teach them the stuff they need to get better at. Give them a base to go back to and derive confidence from when they find the other stuff challenging. 

I have no doubt being a good special teams coverage guy has helped Ryan Smith improve as a corner. He knows there’s something he’s good at which helps him contribute to the team positively and he can take the confidence from that into the times when it gets tough at corner. Not the best example though, but someone who has improved a bit, despite the scheme issues in the secondary.

We just seem to throw guys in at the deep end and hope for the best.

[REDandPEWTER]

55 minutes ago, bucsfan333 said:

No. I'm saying if you're gonna put emphasis on things, draft guys that can can actually do it. If not, change how you do things. Enough of this 'do it anyway' bull****.

Change things to vanilla defense that you see in preseason? There are things you cannot do just to satisfy players bc it wouldn’t work either. You can’t just simplify the team bc nfl defensive schemes run across the league bc our guys are too stupid to understand? 

I understand to play to the strengths of guys. But do you think Belichick makes things easier for his players ? Heck no 

[ravishingone]

10 hours ago, Lil' Shorty said:

We all seem to be able to list a handful of HC candidates, but few GM candidates.

Outside of Joe Douglas, Eliot Wolf or Jeff Ireland, any other names you guys would be interested in?

I would keep an eye on Rick Smith.  He took a family leave, but BOB and him didn t have a great working relationship.  Hopefully his wife can win her battle and he can resume his  career.

[bucsfan333]

8 minutes ago, REDandPEWTER said:

Change things to vanilla defense that you see in preseason? There are things you cannot do just to satisfy players bc it wouldn’t work either. You can’t just simplify the team bc nfl defensive schemes run across the league bc our guys are too stupid to understand? 

I understand to play to the strengths of guys. But do you think Belichick makes things easier for his players ? Heck no 

I said nothing about simplification. 

BB builds his schemes around his personnel. Thanks for giving the penultimate example of what I'm talking about. 😀