Josh Wells placed on IR

[pwny]

This one didn’t get posted, so here it is.

[JaguarCrazy2832]

Crap, I thought he was just out this week?

[LinderFournette]

34 minutes ago, JaguarCrazy2832 said:

Crap, I thought he was just out this week?

week to week i thought, 

[Jags]

We have been decimated by the injury bug on offense. How many players are on IR right now? 

 

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/injured-reserve/

 

I went through this list and noticed that we have at least 5 players (backups included) that would've had a good impact on our team that currently on IR. 

[pwny]

2 hours ago, Jags said:

We have been decimated by the injury bug on offense. How many players are on IR right now? 

This is the whole list. 

11 Lee, Marqise IR
67 Hughes Jr., Mike IR
49 Goolsby, DeAndre IR
74 Robinson, Cam IR
30 Grant, Corey IR
88 Seferian-Jenkins, Austin IR
46 Tinker, Carson IR
72 Wells, Josh IR

This doesn't include the guys who got injury settlements during camp/preseason and are no longer on the team.

 

Also, I don't really like being that guy, but this is kinda a *told you so* moment. Last year, we went largely unscathed with injuries across the board, but we had some depth at the positions we did get hit (IOL had Shatley and Chris Reed both play okay, we had waves of receivers play well, and Ivory mimicked Fournette's play style). This year, we cut quality depth in favor of "these players played well, so let's just expect them to do well this year" and predictably it's failed.

There's no way to predict that we'd lose two Left Tackles and to prepare for that, but you gotta put depth at positions that can naturally take on a larger burden like WR or RB, and they didn't do it. So this is what we're getting. 

On the defensive side, Hayden had been out for a while and it's barely noticeable because of how having Harrison and Patmon there has alleviated most of the burden, despite Hayden playing like the best Nickel in football while he was in.

[DuvalsKing]

On 10/13/2018 at 12:17 PM, pwny said:

This is the whole list. 

11 Lee, Marqise IR
67 Hughes Jr., Mike IR
49 Goolsby, DeAndre IR
74 Robinson, Cam IR
30 Grant, Corey IR
88 Seferian-Jenkins, Austin IR
46 Tinker, Carson IR
72 Wells, Josh IR

This doesn't include the guys who got injury settlements during camp/preseason and are no longer on the team.

 

Also, I don't really like being that guy, but this is kinda a *told you so* moment. Last year, we went largely unscathed with injuries across the board, but we had some depth at the positions we did get hit (IOL had Shatley and Chris Reed both play okay, we had waves of receivers play well, and Ivory mimicked Fournette's play style). This year, we cut quality depth in favor of "these players played well, so let's just expect them to do well this year" and predictably it's failed.

There's no way to predict that we'd lose two Left Tackles and to prepare for that, but you gotta put depth at positions that can naturally take on a larger burden like WR or RB, and they didn't do it. So this is what we're getting. 

On the defensive side, Hayden had been out for a while and it's barely noticeable because of how having Harrison and Patmon there has alleviated most of the burden, despite Hayden playing like the best Nickel in football while he was in.

It was the reason why I suggested they should have drafted Sony Michal this past draft instead of Taven. Sony would be paying dividends right now. It would have took a lot of burden off of Blake.. Doug is right Blake isn’t the issue well he is the issue but he isn’t the focal point of the issue. Meaning we knew what type of football we wanted to play coming into this season ball control put the ball in backs hands. Yet we find ourselves down to the 3rd string LT and now you want to continue running long developing passing plays with a make shift O-line. But yet we can’t pound the ball in the running game because we’re heavily depending on Yeldon with not much behind him. Even Charles coming in this week it was hard to expect anything spectacular from him. Thus Doug and Hackett  have not figured out a way to game plan a scheme in order to work around the teams flaws . Bill is a master mind at this actually Doug did a good job with this last year with moving pieces on the oline not to this extent because we had guys missing in spot time not the season. He also had injuries in the receiving corps last year Hackett needs to step it up.. everyone that wears jags gear inside that building is responsible in some shape of form as to why the game plan and execution has been non existent for the past 2 weeks.

[JaguarCrazy2832]

Is he gone gone or able to come back?

[Tugboat]

4 hours ago, DuvalsKing said:

It was the reason why I suggested they should have drafted Sony Michal this past draft instead of Taven. Sony would be paying dividends right now. It would have took a lot of burden off of Blake.. Doug is right Blake isn’t the issue well he is the issue but he isn’t the focal point of the issue. Meaning we knew what type of football we wanted to play coming into this season ball control put the ball in backs hands. Yet we find ourselves down to the 3rd string LT and now you want to continue running long developing passing plays with a make shift O-line. But yet we can’t pound the ball in the running game because we’re heavily depending on Yeldon with not much behind him. Even Charles coming in this week it was hard to expect anything spectacular from him. Thus Doug and Hackett  have not figured out a way to game plan a scheme in order to work around the teams flaws . Bill is a master mind at this actually Doug did a good job with this last year with moving pieces on the oline not to this extent because we had guys missing in spot time not the season. He also had injuries in the receiving corps last year Hackett needs to step it up.. everyone that wears jags gear inside that building is responsible in some shape of form as to why the game plan and execution has been non existent for the past 2 weeks.

I mean, if we're playing that game...they really didn't need to spend a 1st round pick on a RB.  They probably should've spent a pick or grabbed one of the real Priority UDFA guys at the position, but you hit on the real problem right there with the bolded.  We're down to a depth fringe player at LT, and it's turned our extremely expensive OLine into a "makeshift OLine" that can't really get much work done.

There was a pretty large contingent of people 'round here before the draft who really thought that going with an OLineman was the ticket.  Especially if they could find somebody with a bit of RT/Swing Tackle upside.  A guy like say...Connor Williams starting for the team that just trounced us in Dallas might've been nice to have.  Either as a Guard, or...when **** hits the fan with injuries, as a guy who would probably be a better LT bandaid than anyone we're down to now.

It comes down to assessing depth on the team and where you do/don't have it, and how you can find ways to provide extra insurance or opportunities to balance out a drop in play at one position by leaning more on something else.  ie. We've got a RT who...was mediocre to begin with and appears to have regressed, but has very very little ability to pick up slack if you have to start helping a backup LT on the other side more.  And he has essentially zero LT capability.  So they should've been looking at that LT position depth as a potentially critical linchpin in this "dominate the trenches, control the ball" type of offense they want to impose, and a potential liability where 1 injury could sink us.  They got lucky and Wells played surprisingly well for his short stint...but OT was a position that was not difficult to identify as a potentially major liability and a position of questionable depth.  Bad combo.

If we're talking coulda, woulda, shoulda...that's the position they really ought to have addressed.  And had ample opportunity to do so, beyond throwing a mid-round pick on a developmental project with some character flags.

[LinderFournette]

1 hour ago, Tugboat said:

I mean, if we're playing that game...they really didn't need to spend a 1st round pick on a RB.  They probably should've spent a pick or grabbed one of the real Priority UDFA guys at the position, but you hit on the real problem right there with the bolded.  We're down to a depth fringe player at LT, and it's turned our extremely expensive OLine into a "makeshift OLine" that can't really get much work done.

There was a pretty large contingent of people 'round here before the draft who really thought that going with an OLineman was the ticket.  Especially if they could find somebody with a bit of RT/Swing Tackle upside.  A guy like say...Connor Williams starting for the team that just trounced us in Dallas might've been nice to have.  Either as a Guard, or...when **** hits the fan with injuries, as a guy who would probably be a better LT bandaid than anyone we're down to now.

It comes down to assessing depth on the team and where you do/don't have it, and how you can find ways to provide extra insurance or opportunities to balance out a drop in play at one position by leaning more on something else.  ie. We've got a RT who...was mediocre to begin with and appears to have regressed, but has very very little ability to pick up slack if you have to start helping a backup LT on the other side more.  And he has essentially zero LT capability.  So they should've been looking at that LT position depth as a potentially critical linchpin in this "dominate the trenches, control the ball" type of offense they want to impose, and a potential liability where 1 injury could sink us.  They got lucky and Wells played surprisingly well for his short stint...but OT was a position that was not difficult to identify as a potentially major liability and a position of questionable depth.  Bad combo.

If we're talking coulda, woulda, shoulda...that's the position they really ought to have addressed.  And had ample opportunity to do so, beyond throwing a mid-round pick on a developmental project with some character flags.

i believe Parnell has played some Left tackle back with dallas for a few games.  why not use him there and have the current LT play RT or even try flowers or richardson there. 

 

if you wanna play a real what if game what if game how about picking Brian o'neil OT pittsburgh over Dj chark.  how about if Chukwuma Okorafor  had fallen 1 more spot to us. do we pick him or do we still pick harrison.  

the team obviously knew we needed an OL and we did pick him but hes dealt with an injury and seemed to struggle in the preseason but the team i feel thinks hes strictly a RT.  theres not many potential LT choices at the spots we were picking that wouldnt have been reaches. 

[DuvalsKing]

I

10 minutes ago, LinderFournette said:

i believe Parnell has played some Left tackle back with dallas for a few games.  why not use him there and have the current LT play RT or even try flowers or richardson there. 

If you end up having to play Flowers for any significant time prepare for the team to lose that particular day.

[LinderFournette]

3 minutes ago, DuvalsKing said:

I

If you end up having to play Flowers for any significant time prepare for the team to lose that particular day.

maybe facing good talent like Ngakoue and Campbell will help him. maybe our best OL ever could work with him a little. we are gonna lose until theres some changes around the offense.  clearly the OL isnt playing to decent standards and part of that is being down a LT.  Left tackles dont grow on trees nor did we really have a chance at potentially picking someone who could play there even if it was for a few games. 

 

if u end up playing Blake bortles for any amount f time prepare for a top 5 pick. 

[DuvalsKing]

1 hour ago, LinderFournette said:

maybe facing good talent like Ngakoue and Campbell will help him. maybe our best OL ever could work with him a little. we are gonna lose until theres some changes around the offense.  clearly the OL isnt playing to decent standards and part of that is being down a LT.  Left tackles dont grow on trees nor did we really have a chance at potentially picking someone who could play there even if it was for a few games. 

 

if u end up playing Blake bortles for any amount f time prepare for a top 5 pick. 

I agree with majority of what you said although you are what you are. I don’t think Flowers will come here without being in the type of camp that the Jags run and just miraculously turn into even serviceable. I’ve watch Flowers extensively over the past few yrs because my best friend is a huge Giants fan and he blows my text line up repeatedly weekends upon weekends expressing his complete and utter dislike for Flowers. I didn’t believe it was to the points that he complained about I’m like he can’t be any worse than Luke Joeckle.. lets just Flowers makes Luke look like a young Joe Thomas. Let’s say here Luke played ok for stints he would even have games where he would play well for a duration of a game and give up a sack at a critical time in the game. But I’ve sat and watched games where I’ve seen Flowers whooped the whole game. Flowers should be the tell-tell sign to just how starved the league is for offensive line help because Flowers shouldn’t even be in the league. Which bring us to the point where you said LTs don’t grow on trees. That’s a fact so expect suitable LT at this point in the season isn’t going to be likely. Which is why in the NFL coaching is important which is why coaches like Belicheck are who they are. Year after year they have key people go in and out like a revolving door whether free agency or injury and they continue to plug and play guys that a lot of people have written off, or thrown to the waste side and continue to churn out Ws. 

Doug has to figure it out when you have orchestrated a plan to go with Blake. When Tom, Dave, and Doug decided that they were going to go with Blake they should have had a plan if everything around Blake broke down. They had to know he wouldn’t be able to shoulder the burden of carrying this team. So it’s on Doug to adjust and figure out what his plan B was going to be Bill has adjusted after losing 2 straight because he is a master mind. Now can Doug counter punch that’s what we have to see from this coaching staff they’ve been out coached severely l these past 2 weeks. 

[LinderFournette]

3 minutes ago, DuvalsKing said:

I agree with majority of what you said although you are what you are. I don’t think Flowers will come here without being in the type of camp that the Jags run and just miraculously turn into even serviceable. I’ve watch Flowers extensively over the past few yrs because my best friend is a huge Giants fan and he blows my text line up repeatedly weekends upon weekends expressing his complete and utter dislike for Flowers. I didn’t believe it was to the points that he complained about I’m like he can’t be any worse than Luke Joeckle.. lets just Flowers makes Luke look like a young Joe Thomas. Let’s say here Luke played ok for stints he would even have games where he would play well for a duration of a game and give up a sack at a critical time in the game. But I’ve sat and watched games where I’ve seen Flowers whooped the whole game. Flowers is should be the tell tell to just how starved the league is for offensive line help because Flowers shouldn’t even be in the league. Which bring us to the point where you said LTs don’t grow on trees. That’s a fact so expect suitable LT at this point in the season isn’t going to be likely. Which is why in the NFL coaching is important which is why coaches like Belicheck are who they are. Year after year they have key people go in and out like a revolving door whether free agency or injury and they continue to plug and play guys that a lot of people have written off, or thrown to the waste side and continue to churn out Ws. 

Doug has to figure it out when you have orchestrated a plan to go with Blake. When Tom, Dave, and Doug decided that they were going to go with Blake they should have had a plan if everything around Blake broke down. They had to know he wouldn’t be able to shoulder the burden of carrying this team. So it’s on Doug to adjust and figure out what his plan B was going to be Bill has adjusted after losing 2 straight because he is a master mind. Now can Doug counter punch that’s what we have to see from this coaching staff they’ve been out coached drastically these past 2 weeks. 

step 1 is getting our defense back to playing like sacksonville.  start with getting the corners on press man to man. play a single safety over the top.  have Jack or Telvin be a spy on the QB especially if they are of the mobile abilities.

step 2 we need to get our Rush offense on track.  we need to get the Oline creating holes and our RBs hitting the hole hard. 

step 3 we need blake to visit with house and fix his motion cuz its clearly regressed again. 

[Tugboat]

10 hours ago, LinderFournette said:

i believe Parnell has played some Left tackle back with dallas for a few games.  why not use him there and have the current LT play RT or even try flowers or richardson there. 

 

if you wanna play a real what if game what if game how about picking Brian o'neil OT pittsburgh over Dj chark.  how about if Chukwuma Okorafor  had fallen 1 more spot to us. do we pick him or do we still pick harrison.  

the team obviously knew we needed an OL and we did pick him but hes dealt with an injury and seemed to struggle in the preseason but the team i feel thinks hes strictly a RT.  theres not many potential LT choices at the spots we were picking that wouldnt have been reaches. 

You don't move Parnell to LT because he's already getting massacred at RT right now.  He can't do it.

I'm not talking like crazy "what if" scenarios here either.  I'm talking about a guy who would've made a lot of sense and was very available at our pick...who is starting as an NFL guard and has very recent LT experience in College at least.

 

I feel like there's a disconnect between "team obviously knew we needed an OL" and...grabbed Richardson as a flyer later.  And like i said above...it's gotta be about more than just, "OLine" in general.  You have to look at how the pieces can move around and supply additional layers of depth if, or in our case when things go badly and you run into injuries.  We have some really non-versatile pieces, and a few guys who can play multiple spots on the interior...where most depth guys can play all 3 spots anyway.  What they seemed to do in general...was expect the same level of health as last year, and go from there.  Which is the problem.  We were never going to be as lucky as last year with injuries.  That was an outlier.

[Tugboat]

8 hours ago, LinderFournette said:

step 1 is getting our defense back to playing like sacksonville.  start with getting the corners on press man to man. play a single safety over the top.  have Jack or Telvin be a spy on the QB especially if they are of the mobile abilities.

step 2 we need to get our Rush offense on track.  we need to get the Oline creating holes and our RBs hitting the hole hard. 

step 3 we need blake to visit with house and fix his motion cuz its clearly regressed again. 

I honestly think Step 2 (and 3 to an extent) are being seriously overlooked for their impact on Step 1.

Our defense has some issues with certain types of movement and play design in an offense and that's a problem.  But probably the bigger problem, is that they're really not designed to be on the field all day.  The more you stress a defense by asking them to play all the time after stalled and ineffective/catastrophic offensive drives...the more that defense is going to become prone to breakdowns.

If you want to run a physical "dominate the trenches, control the ball" sort of gameplan...you have to actually control the ******* ball.  Which our offense right now, is utterly incapable of doing for more than like a minute and a half at a time.  Fix the offense so they can at least string together some meaningful drives to give the other unit a breather, and the defense will start to look a lot better again.  Until then...no mix of man or zone is going to fix what's really broken with our defense...and that's time on the field. 

Against the Cowboys, we got thumped on time of possession by almost 20 minutes.  That's never going to work.  Part of that is the defense collapsing, but it's a vicious cycle when the offense goes out there and putters around for a few snaps before giving the ball right back to the opposing team.  You win games with this sort of team concept by actually controlling the ball.  When we out-possess or at least hit par with the other team, we win.  When we don't, we lose.  It's pretty clear.  It's not about scoring a million points a game...it's about owning the football, and we're not doing that right now at all because our offense blows.