Cakeshoppe Posted October 29, 2018 Share Posted October 29, 2018 1 hour ago, cannondale said: It seems he returns a lot of kicks for someone that's not supposed to return any .... allegedly. Any stats on that ? Returning from the end zone ? At first I thought his momentum was taking him pretty close to the goal line but when I re-watched it, I'm gonna call his bluff. It wasn't that close at all and it was a clean catch. He could have stayed put pretty easily IMO. Call it adrenaline, call it wanting to make a play, but don't say it was too close to the goal line I’d disagree on this take. Watch frame by frame. By the time he secures the ball and gets his head back level, he’s already started the stride that takes him out of the end zone. I think his explanation is, at the very least, plausible. He’s also proven to be a smart and savvy player on kickoffs before, and I’ve never seen any issues from him with attitude. Re: the discussion above about auto-touchbacks, I think it has merit but that’s a coaching point. He’s clearly still being told to catch kicks in the end zone or else he’d be told to just plant his feet on the goal line and just let everything over his head hit the ground. Given that, I’m dubious that there’s any real blanket ban on fielding from the end zone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shanedorf Posted October 29, 2018 Share Posted October 29, 2018 25 minutes ago, Norm said: wait, it is? Yup - another new rule to enhance safety/ eliminate kickoffs But Monty is also the guy who knew how to put one foot in and one foot out of bounds to get the penalty on the kick off and place the ball at the 40 yard line. He's plenty smart enough...he simply misjudged the kick's trajectory and wasn't sure if it was gonna land in the EZ or in the field of play. He said he wasn't being selfish or disobeying direct orders - he just wasn't sure where that ball was gonna land - and previous kick offs were plenty deep where it wasn't even a question. Also: from a strategy POV, the Rams best move was to kick it short and force the return, Monty was likely aware of that when he saw the kick coming in "shorter" than the earlier ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shanedorf Posted October 29, 2018 Share Posted October 29, 2018 With the new kickoff / touchback rules, I think that kick from Detroit would have been ruled a touchback at the 25 instead of the 40 on the penalty because the ball hit the EZ before it bounced out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leader Posted October 29, 2018 Author Share Posted October 29, 2018 7 minutes ago, Cakeshoppe said: I’d disagree on this take. Watch frame by frame. By the time he secures the ball and gets his head back level, he’s already started the stride that takes him out of the end zone. I think his explanation is, at the very least, plausible. He’s also proven to be a smart and savvy player on kickoffs before, and I’ve never seen any issues from him with attitude. Re: the discussion above about auto-touchbacks, I think it has merit but that’s a coaching point. He’s clearly still being told to catch kicks in the end zone or else he’d be told to just plant his feet on the goal line and just let everything over his head hit the ground. Given that, I’m dubious that there’s any real blanket ban on fielding from the end zone. This is too simple to screw up. You KNOW you dont even have to catch the ball for it to be ruled a touchback. All it has to do is reach the EZ. You KNOW (as in figure out - check - look - determine - find out - ascertain <for the Ivy League graduates>.........) where you're standing in the EZ at the KO - and all you have to do - if you're hell bent on catching the damn thing - is "calculate" if you move a step closer to the goal line - or not. Come on. Its not even preschool rocket science. If the coach told you not to return it: A). dont catch it. B). if you really, really, really....for some ungodly reason feel compelled to catch it - know where you are in the EZ. Is that too hard? As for the video evidence - Ty is well inside the goal line when he caught the ball. It should have been easy to KNOW that - and take a knee. He didnt - for some reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cakeshoppe Posted October 29, 2018 Share Posted October 29, 2018 3 minutes ago, Leader said: This is too simple to screw up. You KNOW you dont even have to catch the ball for it to be ruled a touchback. All it has to do is reach the EZ. You KNOW (as in figure out - check - look - determine - find out - ascertain <for the Ivy League graduates>.........) where you're standing in the EZ at the KO - and all you have to do - if you're hell bent on catching the damn thing - is "calculate" if you move a step closer to the goal line - or not. Come on. Its not even preschool rocket science. If the coach told you not to return it: A). dont catch it. B). if you really, really, really....for some ungodly reason feel compelled to catch it - know where you are in the EZ. Is that too hard? As for the video evidence - Ty is well inside the goal line when he caught the ball. It should have been easy to KNOW that - and take a knee. He didnt - for some reason. He’s tracking a ball in the sky. I don’t know about you but when I look up, the ground a yard in front of me is no longer within my field of vision. If your point is that teams should just let kicks hit the ground in the end zone instead of trying to catch them for a TB, i don’t disagree but it’s a separate issue. It’s clearly not what’s being coached. Yeah I think he messed up. My point is that I think his story of not directly disobeying what he was told because he was throwing a fit is at least plausible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
packfanfb Posted October 29, 2018 Share Posted October 29, 2018 2 hours ago, TheOnlyThing said: Rob DemovskyESPN Staff Writer Ty Montgomery said he's always told to keep kickoffs in the end zone but he was worried he might be too close to the goal line. He admitted it was a mistake but clearly wasn't happy that a teammate or teammates were quoted anonymously insinuating that he was selfish. People can defend Monty all they want and the personal threats, etc are of course terrible, but his explanation that he needed to come out because he was close to the goalline is as laughable as Suh saying he stomped on EDS because he was trying to gain his balance... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leader Posted October 29, 2018 Author Share Posted October 29, 2018 11 minutes ago, Cakeshoppe said: He’s tracking a ball in the sky. I don’t know about you but when I look up, the ground a yard in front of me is no longer within my field of vision. If your point is that teams should just let kicks hit the ground in the end zone instead of trying to catch them for a TB, i don’t disagree but it’s a separate issue. It’s clearly not what’s being coached. Yeah I think he messed up. My point is that I think his story of not directly disobeying what he was told because he was throwing a fit is at least plausible. Understand your point - and not hassling you about it - but hey - if you've ever played a alot of football (and Ty Montgomery certainly has done that......) determining where you are in relation to a kickoff (or punt even) isnt as hard as you describe. Again - you determine where you are on the field BEFORE THE KICK - and judge your whereabouts - change them in your head - as you track and move to the ball. Its not all that hard actually. But listen - lets say it is difficult (which it isnt....) Do you think it possible to catch the ball (again - not that you have to but if for some reason you simply MUST.....) THEN check where you''re at? To look at the ground for a second? Ty certainly had time to do that. The nearest defender when he caught the ball was 20+ yards away. And oh btw.......Ty Montgomery has been returning kicks since college. I cant speak to (or know of) his pop warner or high school days. But its not like its foreign to him. He screwed up - badly. Why he did it - anybody's guess except for Ty Montgomery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheOnlyThing Posted October 29, 2018 Share Posted October 29, 2018 According to Silver’s report, McCarthy docked Montgomery snaps after already once refusing to heed coaching instructions to stay in the end zone, after which Montgomery was reportedly furious. His eventual decision to take it out of the end zone with just over two minutes could have been viewed as an “I’ll show you moment,” or perhaps more generously as a “I can make a play, this is why I’ve been taking it out.” https://www.acmepackingcompany.com/2018/10/29/18037976/ty-montgomery-fumble-rams-trade-deadline-aaron-rodgers-mike-silver I have not actually seen the bolded text allegation above reported (Silver's article is below), but if Ty had previously defied the coaches and brought balls out of the end zone, then he needs to go. Now. http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000980254/article/rodgers-doesnt-get-chance-at-hollywood-ending Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
packfanfb Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 49 minutes ago, Shanedorf said: Yup - another new rule to enhance safety/ eliminate kickoffs But Monty is also the guy who knew how to put one foot in and one foot out of bounds to get the penalty on the kick off and place the ball at the 40 yard line. He's plenty smart enough...he simply misjudged the kick's trajectory and wasn't sure if it was gonna land in the EZ or in the field of play. He said he wasn't being selfish or disobeying direct orders - he just wasn't sure where that ball was gonna land - and previous kick offs were plenty deep where it wasn't even a question. Also: from a strategy POV, the Rams best move was to kick it short and force the return, Monty was likely aware of that when he saw the kick coming in "shorter" than the earlier ones. Huh? Misjudged it? He caught the ball....in the endzone. When he caught the ball...in the endzone, there is nothing to judge. Just take a knee...in the endzone. Are people really arguing this? Monty caught the ball with both feet 1-2 yards...in the endzone. He also had extra reason to err on the side of downing the ball...in the endzone, with 2:05 left on the clock to preserve the 2 min warning. People are talking about this like he's an outfielder who misjudged a flyball. He caught the ball and was standing...in the endzone... Moreover he didnt even hesitate bringing it out. He didnt do a double take and "say oh **** i stepped out of the endzone, now I have to go." He was returning that ball all the way. Misjudged...lmao. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
packfanfb Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 17 minutes ago, TheOnlyThing said: According to Silver’s report, McCarthy docked Montgomery snaps after already once refusing to heed coaching instructions to stay in the end zone, after which Montgomery was reportedly furious. His eventual decision to take it out of the end zone with just over two minutes could have been viewed as an “I’ll show you moment,” or perhaps more generously as a “I can make a play, this is why I’ve been taking it out.” https://www.acmepackingcompany.com/2018/10/29/18037976/ty-montgomery-fumble-rams-trade-deadline-aaron-rodgers-mike-silver I have not actually seen the bolded text allegation above reported (Silver's article is below), but if Ty had previously defied the coaches and brought balls out of the end zone, then he needs to go. Now. http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000980254/article/rodgers-doesnt-get-chance-at-hollywood-ending He probably just misjudged it those times too... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 I'm not saying it's a lie, but how the **** would Silver know this...Silver is a MONSTER ****** when it comes to the Packers and ****ting on them, and that's from someone who never feels anyone has it out for our fans and team other than Cowherd's act. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Packerraymond Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 Whether or not we cut Ty really doesn't matter to me. I'm not going to be upset, the people trying to make it about his character are idiots though. Dude made a stupid play because he wanted to be a hero. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Fussnputz Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 52 minutes ago, Packerraymond said: Whether or not we cut Ty really doesn't matter to me. I'm not going to be upset, the people trying to make it about his character are idiots though. Dude made a stupid play because he wanted to be a hero. "...because he wanted to be a hero." Isn't that a character issue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 Ty's a pretty decent dude as far as I can tell. He's not Randall. That buys him some good will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 33 minutes ago, Mr. Fussnputz said: "...because he wanted to be a hero." Isn't that a character issue? Maybe, can be. But if we are ****ting on competitors... Look at this way, if he runs it back all the way and it came out he did it because he believed he could change the game, would anyone be mad? No. So it's less about what he did and more about the outcome I actually feel like he really did get nervous about the goal line and didn't think....he was going to fumble Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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