Ragnar Danneskjold Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 I think when you look at McCarthy without a HOF QB, you have to consider the QB he has to play. Sure, they sucked under Hundley, but if there was no HOF QB, a guy like Hundley would have been 1 of 2 or three guys competing for the spot, and the team would have moved on very quickly. With Matt Flynn starting, , a guy who couldn't win a starting spot in the NFL, McCarthy is .500. Flynn played a good game at New England in 2010, and had a record setting performance in 2011 against Detroit, the only two games he had when he had full years in the system. He managed to go 2-2 coming in mid season in 2013. One would have to think that Flynn would be more the floor for QB talent that McCarthy would have absent an entrenched star QB, and the rest of the roster would be better because of extra cap space and some years drafting earlier than the 20's. I just don't buy the last year sucked so McCarthy sucks without a HOF QB line. It is lazy analysis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick_gb Posted October 18, 2018 Author Share Posted October 18, 2018 30 minutes ago, Ragnar Danneskjold said: I think when you look at McCarthy without a HOF QB, you have to consider the QB he has to play. Sure, they sucked under Hundley, but if there was no HOF QB, a guy like Hundley would have been 1 of 2 or three guys competing for the spot, and the team would have moved on very quickly. With Matt Flynn starting, , a guy who couldn't win a starting spot in the NFL, McCarthy is .500. Flynn played a good game at New England in 2010, and had a record setting performance in 2011 against Detroit, the only two games he had when he had full years in the system. He managed to go 2-2 coming in mid season in 2013. One would have to think that Flynn would be more the floor for QB talent that McCarthy would have absent an entrenched star QB, and the rest of the roster would be better because of extra cap space and some years drafting earlier than the 20's. I just don't buy the last year sucked so McCarthy sucks without a HOF QB line. It is lazy analysis. I think there's more behind the HOF QB talk for MM. No Killer instinct? No adapting to a failing game plan mid-game? Inability or unwillingness to use players like Aaron Jones despite your QB wanting it. His while noble but irritating faith in his coordinators even though year after year they don't put up results (see Dom Capers) -- Capers should have been fired WELL before he was. It's a mix of things that don't sit right when it comes to MM for me and to look at just Win % without Aaron Rodgers and say that makes him a better coach for it is just lazy analysis as well. If you guys want to blindly follow him because he's put up good decent winning % behind a backup quarterback you're more then welcome to. However, myself? I expect more than a good winning percentage when you have arguably the best QB in the NFL playing for you and so should you guys. Please note: I am not saying by any means that I hate Mike McCarthy -- I am simply stating some of the things I dislike about him (all coaches have their faults, including BB). However, mostly I'm just not content winning games, I want this team to win Championships and you may say he did in 2010 but 8 years ago is meaningless to me when you have an Aaron Rodgers behind center. Sometimes change is a good thing and while also being necessary and their pressers lately seem to show that things aren't all peachy between the two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSG Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 6 minutes ago, incognito_man said: He's actually 5 games above .500 without Rodgers. 27-22-1. I guess every good/great coach who has coached HOFers is fortunate. Also, every HOFer that has played for a good/great coach like McCarthy is fortunate as well. It's funny how that works. That isn't what I stated. He's 2 games over .500 when Aaron Rodgers isn't playing or doesn't finish a game due to injury. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incognito_man Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 4 minutes ago, SSG said: That isn't what I stated. He's 2 games over .500 when Aaron Rodgers isn't playing or doesn't finish a game due to injury. Ok. So you're point is what? How does MMs record in games in which the teams star player gets gets injured compare league-wide? Without that info, your factoid is completely meaningless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheech Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 32 minutes ago, Ragnar Danneskjold said: I just don't buy the last year sucked so McCarthy sucks without a HOF QB line. It is lazy analysis. Last year sucked because MM expected his backup QB to run the same offense as his HOF QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squire12 Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 1 hour ago, Ragnar Danneskjold said: You don't know that. The team would have drafted earlier, so he would be coaching a team with a better roster overall. How McCarthy would do without a HOF QB is just wild speculation that has no known answer. You have any facts to prove the bolded part of the above. Plenty of teams draft earlier and do not have a better roster. Irony of pointing out the flaw of anothers assumption. ..then making your own assumption Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheech Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 9 hours ago, Ragnar Danneskjold said: I think packer fans are too accepting of the whole Aaron Rodgers is the greatest QB to have ever played the game concept. He is one of the greatest, but I think there is a lot of hyperbole in that title. He's had stretches where he's played better than any other QB I've ever seen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 Nobody can/could do the things he does, as often and as consistently. He's unreal. I probably hold him too high of a standard. But IDK how much you can get better when you just look at what he does out there so often. He'll never be the ring king but IDC. I'll swear it until I die. And am absolutely convinced would even if he wasn't a Packer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leader Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 19 minutes ago, Cheech said: He's had stretches where he's played better than any other QB I've ever seen. You know what I love? On some of ARs post game pressers (not always) he gets into his own head and starts spewing out route patterns versus coverages with reception zones and high/low targets and such. It's pure QB-speech. Then compare that to what you hear from Brady. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 6 minutes ago, Leader said: You know what I love? On some of ARs post game pressers (not always) he gets into his own head and starts spewing out route patterns versus coverages with reception zones and high/low targets and such. It's pure QB-speech. Then compare that to what you hear from Brady. "Buy Uggs and my def not PED supplements" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incognito_man Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 42 minutes ago, squire12 said: You have any facts to prove the bolded part of the above. Plenty of teams draft earlier and do not have a better roster. Irony of pointing out the flaw of anothers assumption. ..then making your own assumption Yes. The fact that higher drafted players are better is very, very well established. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ragnar Danneskjold Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 52 minutes ago, Cheech said: He's had stretches where he's played better than any other QB I've ever seen. You aren't old enough to say that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheech Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 9 minutes ago, Ragnar Danneskjold said: You aren't old enough to say that. I think you need to re-read what I said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ragnar Danneskjold Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 59 minutes ago, squire12 said: You have any facts to prove the bolded part of the above. Plenty of teams draft earlier and do not have a better roster. Irony of pointing out the flaw of anothers assumption. ..then making your own assumption Sure, I am. I think when you look at other teams though, there is evidence that the teams that go for a period of time without a franchise QB and thus draft at the top of the round end up with better non QB rosters. Look at Minnesota and how many of their good players were accumulated on down years. Or the Rams- they didn't draft Aaron Donald after a great year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ragnar Danneskjold Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 1 minute ago, Cheech said: I think you need to re-read what I said. I read what you wrote. I have lived through the careers of those other QB's you have "seen". I've experienced those same stretches out of those other QB's as well, just like I have experienced stretches where they have been off like Rodgers has been lately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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