What Can Brown Do For You? (Hopefully Lose This Time) Week 8 : Steelers host Browns

[VigilantZombie]

1 minute ago, FourThreeMafia said:

Touchdowns are just as much about opportunity as skill... If not more.

While I agree with that I also feel like the runs that Connor has had that are only a couple of yards here and there have decreased greatly and we have seen him really powerful 4 word for significant gains lately and furthermore throughout the season.

[43M]

Just now, wwhickok said:

While I agree with that I also feel like the runs that Connor has had that are only a couple of yards here and there have decreased greatly and we have seen him really powerful 4 word for significant gains lately and furthermore throughout the season.

Not trying to take anything away from Connor... just saying it's not fair to compare how many touchdowns each had without context.

[VigilantZombie]

Bengals are the only 1pm team that won that is that impactful for us.

[VigilantZombie]

1 minute ago, FourThreeMafia said:

Not trying to take anything away from Connor... just saying it's not fair to compare how many touchdowns each had without context.

I agree with that actually I think that one thing we have to consider is Todd Haley who seem to be allergic to running the football on the goal line

[BlaqOptic]

1 hour ago, FourThreeMafia said:

Touchdowns are just as much about opportunity as skill... If not more.

This is true but you also have to factor in that Connor has earned some of his TDs by forcing missed tackles which Bell has struggled with lately.

[CKSteeler]

The subject of why they didn't run more in the redzone came up in the past. Munchak on that subject:

Quote

“Everyone gets big on big and it’s not as easy as you think,” Munchak said when asked about running the ball on the one yard line. “Everyone wants to prove they can run it in from a yard out and it’s usually easier to pass it in from a yard out. I still think you have people going from goal line formation and throwing the ball more than they [run] it. I think the success rate is much higher throwing it than running it.”

https://steelersdepot.com/2017/11/mike-munchak-says-effective-throw-run-near-goal-line/

Munchak is still here and if he actually believes that, he'd as wrong as ever, but we've seen a noticeable change in philosophy in this respect. Bell only had 6 carries inside the 5 yard line last year (all 6 were TD's). They only gave it to Bell 43% of the time when they ran it inside the 5. This on a team that barely took Bell off the field. Conner already has 10 attempts and 6 TD's himself before today (Conner has had 90% of the RB touches inside the 5). Steelers are 3rd in the league at scoring TD's in the redzone at 72%. The closer they got, the less inclined they were to use Bell or run the ball in general. Likewise, on third and short plays they actually passed the ball more than they ran it (though, that's 3-3 or less and most teams throw it more in those situations - I don't have league wide numbers).

Munchak is also a guy who repeatedly made statements to the effect that everyone talked about Bell's patience, but a lot of times the same yards were there if he just ran the play the way it was designed to be run. I think we've seen a lot of that with Conner. The team actually never seemed to like Bell all that much in short yardage situations. That was kind of one of the big reasons they signed Blount to begin with.

This could be about the offensive coordinator. It could be Bell. Bell was never actually bad in short yardage situations converting them at a fairly high rate and scoring when given the chances, but his style may just turn coaches off in those instances. But most teams give All-Pro RB's more than 6 carries inside the 5 throughout the season.

We probably won't get the answer to this in Pittsburgh, but when Bell walks we'll see how his future team uses him down in the redzone and whether he racks up the TD's you'd expect someone with his accolades to have.

[Livewire]

 

[TXsteeler]

15 hours ago, wwhickok said:

They could but I wouldn't do that with Connor I would use that money to improve the team in the offseason because no matter what Connor is going to get his money when it's time there's no reason to rush it that's the kind of thing you do and then end up watching him get a season-ending injury that makes you look foolish

Its money against this year's cap though.

[warfelg]

3 minutes ago, TXsteeler said:

Its money against this year's cap though.

The issue is we can't do it because of the CBA.  James Conner's rookie scale can't be changed until after his 3rd season in the league.  This is the same exact thing that Russell Wilson and his agent tried to argue after his rookie year and second year; and the NFLPA stepped in to remind them what they are calling for broke the CBA rules.

[TXsteeler]

9 minutes ago, warfelg said:

The issue is we can't do it because of the CBA.  James Conner's rookie scale can't be changed until after his 3rd season in the league.  This is the same exact thing that Russell Wilson and his agent tried to argue after his rookie year and second year; and the NFLPA stepped in to remind them what they are calling for broke the CBA rules.

Ah, I figured. Give it to the line then.

[warfelg]

1 minute ago, TXsteeler said:

Ah, I figured. Give it to the line then.

Or the smart thing and roll it into 2019's cap, go into FA with ~$50mil in cap space, and fix the defense.

[Ward4HOF]

17 hours ago, FourThreeMafia said:

No one will say a damn thing either,  but if one small call goes our way... STEALERS CHEET!!! 

Close...it's more like "The STEALERS have the refs int heir pockets...ever since SB XL..."

Then it turns into this long diatribe on how the Seahawks should have won that SB, despite the evidence that they still would've lost...and they conveniently fail to point to the blatant block in the back on BR on that INT return that put them into FG position, and gave them about 40 extra yds, when you count the 15 yd penalty...

Quote

Additionally, while Seattle was incorrectly called for a low block after a key Matt Hasselbeck interception, they were spared from a penalty when Ben Roethlisberger was blocked in the back during a return of a key pick in the third quarter.

Quote

Expert examinations of the game film, including a review by Football Outsiders, an objective third party, show as many as double non-holding calls against Seattle as against the Steelers. 

but, of course...this site doesn't get it ALL right,,,

...the TE catch that wasn't a fumble...and not reviewable...

Quote

 

The Event: Stevens appeared to catch a pass from quarterback Matt Hasselbeck, take three steps, and then have the ball dislodged.

The Examination: Had the tight end, who was called out by linebacker Joey Porter earlier in the week for being "soft," had a firm grip and control of the football, the dislodging would have constituted a fumble.  After all, he had taken multiple steps after receiving the ball from Hasselbeck.

The Proof: As Stevens is bringing the ball into his body from his hands, the football moves, demonstrating a lack of control and thus negating possession prior to the alleged "fumble."

 

...but yeah...ALL the calls went our way in that game...

You all may want to have this site hot-linked,...placed in your 'favorites' or 'bookmarks' lol!!

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/853642-steelers-vs-seahawks-examining-the-controversial-calls-of-super-bowl-xl#slide1

 

But I digress...as always...

 

 

[Ward4HOF]

17 hours ago, TXsteeler said:

So glad Bell didn't sign that contract, not because he isn't a beaste but the value isn't there vs what we can get out of Conner on a rookie deal.

I'm not going to act like I'm some great soothsayer, and some great omnipotent force of nature--so many others saw the same thing I recognized over the past year or two...

Bell, while a very good RB, is not some freak of nature, best-of-the-best RB in the league; he's been GREATLY aided by an OL, that I believe, to be 2nd-to-none in the run game in the NFL...and if NOT the best Run-Game OL in the NFL, they are without a DOUBT... in the top 3.

So many have praised Bell for his 'patience', and shiftiness, and his wondrous abilities to catch balls out of the backfield.  Well, let's do a quick comparison...

2017 Bell (Through 7 Games) -- 684 Rush Yds, 4 TDs, -- 214 Rec Yds, 0 TDs

2018 Conner (Through 7 Games) -- 599 Rush Yds, 9 TDs, -- 323 Rec Yds, 0 TDs

So, please tell me, again, what exactly are we missing with Bell out of the equation??  Oh, I know, -$15M/yr from our Salary Cap...trade this Bum before he loses all his value, and other GMs recognize, it's our OL/Scheme/RB Coach...whatever...but the point is, Bell is looking more and more like JAG...and he knows it...

[Ward4HOF]

16 hours ago, FourThreeMafia said:

Not trying to take anything away from Connor... just saying it's not fair to compare how many touchdowns each had without context.

Well, yeah...but then can we truly compare ANY players???  Can we compare Brady to Manning??  They each had different  QB or Head Coaches?? Offensive Coordinators?? weapons?? environment??  opponents??  How is this any different?  Yeah, different OC, but same OL, same QB, same HC...I'd say it's a heck of a lot more closer comparison than any other comparison that's done in the NFL between RBs, wouldn't you say??

Same thing for WRs??  Can we REALLY compare AB to Julio??  One plays in a dome while the other doesn't. One has Matt Ryan, the other has BR.  They have different OCs, HCs, WR Coaches, schemes, game-plans, so on and so forth--yet those comparisons get made all the time.

So, IMO, it's perfectly fair to compare Bell to Conner, and to be quite frank, it's a closer comparison than another RB we could possibly compare Bell or Conner to, in the NFL, right?

[43M]

10 hours ago, Ward4HOF said:

Well, yeah...but then can we truly compare ANY players???  Can we compare Brady to Manning??  They each had different  QB or Head Coaches?? Offensive Coordinators?? weapons?? environment??  opponents??  How is this any different?  Yeah, different OC, but same OL, same QB, same HC...I'd say it's a heck of a lot more closer comparison than any other comparison that's done in the NFL between RBs, wouldn't you say??

Same thing for WRs??  Can we REALLY compare AB to Julio??  One plays in a dome while the other doesn't. One has Matt Ryan, the other has BR.  They have different OCs, HCs, WR Coaches, schemes, game-plans, so on and so forth--yet those comparisons get made all the time.

So, IMO, it's perfectly fair to compare Bell to Conner, and to be quite frank, it's a closer comparison than another RB we could possibly compare Bell or Conner to, in the NFL, right?

 I never said you couldn't compare them... Just that you can't compare their statistical achievements without context.