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Broncofan

Ownership Battle Looming

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Man, this does sound like it's going to get ugly.  What's really interesting is that CEO Joe Ellis would be removed if this injunction wins out.

 

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6 minutes ago, AKRNA said:

Sounds like nothing more than the continuing squabble between Beth and Brittany for eventual control. Maybe we've got an attorney that could weigh in. I think it's quite an uphill battle to topple the trustees.

 

https://denver.cbslocal.com/2018/10/25/denver-broncos-pat-bowlen-pat-bowlen-trust-william-bill-bowlen/

Agree it's unlikely - let's face it though, the timing was no coincidence.   A road game @KC, the Chad Kelly news, the timing is meant to cast more shade at the current ownership/trust.   Seems way more likely that the injunction fails, but to say it's been a rough week in the media for our org is an understatement.

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To expand, not crazy about the "billionaire's kid takes over" option from a qualification standpoint, and I doubt the Bowlen family would be as cash-rich as potential buyers. 

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Just another off field distraction we don't need. About the only good thing regarding this is that it takes a bit of heat away from the Chad Kelly situation.

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Annabel doesn't come across looking great IMO, almost like the evil step-mother on any Disney princess movie.

 

 

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14 hours ago, Broncofan said:

Agree it's unlikely - let's face it though, the timing was no coincidence.   A road game @KC, the Chad Kelly news, the timing is meant to cast more shade at the current ownership/trust.   Seems way more likely that the injunction fails, but to say it's been a rough week in the media for our org is an understatement.

This is exactly right. This has been as bad of a week from a PR standpoint as anything in team’s history other than McSpyGate. The difference being Mac was an easy target and eventually an easy piñata for the team once he was finally canned. That is not the case here as this directly impacts the organization’s principle officer, Joe Ellis. 

Bill Bowlen showed a lot of savvy leaking this to Nikki when he did; instead of talking Broncos/Chiefs talk radio is spending all day talking ownership issues. 

Interestingly, but unsurprisingly, MHR has nothing on this. I’m sure Ellis/Smyth told them to ignore it or lose their credential. 

Edited by AnAngryAmerican

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2 hours ago, AnAngryAmerican said:

This is exactly right. This has been as bad of a week from a PR standpoint as anything in team’s history other than McSpyGate. The difference being Mac was an easy target and eventually an easy piñata for the team once he was finally canned. That is not the case here as this directly impacts the organization’s principle officer, Joe Ellis. 

Bill Bowlen showed a lot of savvy leaking this to Nikki when he did; instead of talking Broncos/Chiefs talk radio is spending all day talking ownership issues. 

Interestingly, but unsurprisingly, MHR has nothing on this. I’m sure Ellis/Smyth told them to ignore it or lose their credential. 

I saw that.

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Someone correct me if I am wrong, but I thought I had read something about Bowlen putting this trust together 10+ years ago, before his health started to deteriorate.

I know we all here respect Pat Bowlen and recognize that Pat Bowlen and John Elway are the 2 most influential people to be a part of this franchise.

Whether the trustees have made mistakes or not, if Bowlen put this in place before his health declined, I fully support it.  I also think that the trustees have at least in personnel done what Bowlen has wished (biggest being having Elway as a part of the organization).

I know some in this forum and many Broncos fans think Elway needs to go, I am not in that camp, even with some poor drafts and a few down years Elway since becoming VP of football operations has been one of the best in the league.

I don’t think Bill Bowlen’s motion has much of a chance, but if it does the future of this franchise could potentially be in even more jeopardy and we should be even more concerned about what happens at the top of this organization rather than who the next QB is going to be.

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1 hour ago, germ-x said:

Someone correct me if I am wrong, but I thought I had read something about Bowlen putting this trust together 10+ years ago, before his health started to deteriorate.

I know we all here respect Pat Bowlen and recognize that Pat Bowlen and John Elway are the 2 most influential people to be a part of this franchise.

Whether the trustees have made mistakes or not, if Bowlen put this in place before his health declined, I fully support it.  I also think that the trustees have at least in personnel done what Bowlen has wished (biggest being having Elway as a part of the organization).

I know some in this forum and many Broncos fans think Elway needs to go, I am not in that camp, even with some poor drafts and a few down years Elway since becoming VP of football operations has been one of the best in the league.

I don’t think Bill Bowlen’s motion has much of a chance, but if it does the future of this franchise could potentially be in even more jeopardy and we should be even more concerned about what happens at the top of this organization rather than who the next QB is going to be.

FTR, I don't think Elway should go yet -  but he clearly shouldn't be in charge of all facets of the team's operations (cough, QB evaluation, cough).   I think though that he does need to keep evolving, and realizing the status quo in how the org operates isn't good enough.   The change in draft philosophy is a really encouraging sign - but it has to continue, and it has to extend to how they approach QB evaluation.  

The middle ground perspective is that Elway's earned more than enough leash to get another HC/QB shot.   I think few would argue that.   But it should also come with the understanding the chances to right the ship are finite - and frankly, Elway should embrace more outside input and opinion.   He's ruled the org with an iron fist - and that's fine if you are the smartest guy in the room.  But times change...and the ability to adapt and change decides whether or not you remain the smartest guy in the room.   This will be Elway's biggest challenge, he's shown the ability to change before in other areas, but not QB evaluation.  Is he willing to cede more responsibility/control in areas he just isn't that good at?  Time will tell there.

 

Edited by Broncofan

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21 hours ago, Broncofan said:

FTR, I don't think Elway should go yet -  but he clearly shouldn't be in charge of all facets of the team's operations (cough, QB evaluation, cough).   I think though that he does need to keep evolving, and realizing the status quo in how the org operates isn't good enough.   The change in draft philosophy is a really encouraging sign - but it has to continue, and it has to extend to how they approach QB evaluation.  

The middle ground perspective is that Elway's earned more than enough leash to get another HC/QB shot.   I think few would argue that.   But it should also come with the understanding the chances to right the ship are finite - and frankly, Elway should embrace more outside input and opinion.   He's ruled the org with an iron fist - and that's fine if you are the smartest guy in the room.  But times change...and the ability to adapt and change decides whether or not you remain the smartest guy in the room.   This will be Elway's biggest challenge, he's shown the ability to change before in other areas, but not QB evaluation.  Is he willing to cede more responsibility/control in areas he just isn't that good at?  Time will tell there.

 

I get it, but this is almost like acting finding a QB isn’t difficult.  It’s the most difficult position in all of sports to find.

Elway’s taken his shots, some of them maybe dumb ones (Lynch), but when you’re drafting in the 20s every year finding a QB isn’t easy unless you want to mortgage the future on one, which maybe should’ve been the route.

Obviously we can all go back to the 2018 draft and debate whether it should have been Rosen/Allen at #5 instead of Chubb. This was a draft Denver had the opportunity to take a QB high and chose not to.  We will see down the road.  However, taking Rosen/Allen at #5 and them not being franchise caliber guys is just as big if not more so a set back than taking a guy like Lynch in the 20s.  Nothing Rosen/Allen have done this year makes me think they’re guys to build a franchise around and that’s the ultimate goal at QB...anything less and you’re in the position Denver is in now.

Elway should listen to others, but to be honest, the QB position is a bit of a crap shoot unless they’re established veterans. There are plenty of examples of top 10-15 guys that either are average or fail that have the required talent and mental makeup that would make anyone think they’d be successful.  You really just don’t know, even if you think a guy is a slam dunk pick, the NFL is a completely different animal than the NCAA and a QB can’t (no matter how good) rely on being physically gifted 75% of the time like other positions in the NFL.  Everyone on the field can play, timing is an absolute must, pre snap reads are an absolute must, you’re almost constantly facing pressure, and the windows for open WRs are non existent compared to the NCAA.  

Elways taken his jabs at QB and failed, which is by far the higher percentage league wide.  But aside from that he continues to put together a pretty talented team.  If Elway goes, this franchise is doomed for a decade+, IMO.

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35 minutes ago, germ-x said:

I get it, but this is almost like acting finding a QB isn’t difficult.  It’s the most difficult position in all of sports to find.

Elway’s taken his shots, some of them maybe dumb ones (Lynch), but when you’re drafting in the 20s every year finding a QB isn’t easy unless you want to mortgage the future on one, which maybe should’ve been the route.

Obviously we can all go back to the 2018 draft and debate whether it should have been Rosen/Allen at #5 instead of Chubb. This was a draft Denver had the opportunity to take a QB high and chose not to.  We will see down the road.  However, taking Rosen/Allen at #5 and them not being franchise caliber guys is just as big if not more so a set back than taking a guy like Lynch in the 20s.  Nothing Rosen/Allen have done this year makes me think they’re guys to build a franchise around and that’s the ultimate goal at QB...anything less and you’re in the position Denver is in now.

Elway should listen to others, but to be honest, the QB position is a bit of a crap shoot unless they’re established veterans. There are plenty of examples of top 10-15 guys that either are average or fail that have the required talent and mental makeup that would make anyone think they’d be successful.  You really just don’t know, even if you think a guy is a slam dunk pick, the NFL is a completely different animal than the NCAA and a QB can’t (no matter how good) rely on being physically gifted 75% of the time like other positions in the NFL.  Everyone on the field can play, timing is an absolute must, pre snap reads are an absolute must, you’re almost constantly facing pressure, and the windows for open WRs are non existent compared to the NCAA.  

Elways taken his jabs at QB and failed, which is by far the higher percentage league wide.  But aside from that he continues to put together a pretty talented team.  If Elway goes, this franchise is doomed for a decade+, IMO.

In the ideal world, Elway cedes control of the O key personnel decisions like QBOTF to an O-minded HC.   And continues to use his strengths for the rest of the GM position, so long as he continues to incorporate more metrics and skills analysis into the draft board, rather than his past love of toolsy guys, great.   

Re: tough job picking QB's, absolutely.   But part of the job is knowing when to take your shots, and when to pass.   Let's face it, the decision to offer Brock an extension, and then to take Keenum over all the rest of the stopgap QB's (who all signed for a LOT cheaper), they're beyond just "well, it's hard to get it right" - they were brutally bad decisions.   When other choices existed.     It's a total cop-out to say "finding a QB is hard" and give Elway/Kubiak a pass - investing as much as Elway was going to with Oz (with Kubiak signing off as HC), and as much as he and Kubiak hooked their wagon to Keenum when there were a lot of stopgaps available this year, it shows a very serious problem in their combined QB evaluation that goes beyond "it's tough for everyone".   It also reinforces the notion that you don't sit tight on 1 option, either - just like how NE keeps looking for the next guy even when they had the heir in JimmyG, that's one approach that Elway should seriously consider adopting in 2019-20, if he doesn't dive into the putrid pool of Rd1 rookies (and man, it's quite putrid where we will be picking).

As for Rosen/Allen, of course they aren't going to show much in 5 games (remember, not starting right away) - that's why Elway didn't want to commit to a rookie QB.    The fact Rosen's flashed in other games actually is a strong sign he's going to work out, provided his OL gets upgraded, and he avoids a big injury.    Rookie struggles are the norm - Goff, Wentz, etc. are the rule, the Watsons are the incredibly rare exception.    Even stinkers like the one we just saw.  Either way, time will tell.

I don't share in the call that Elway must go - but he's clearly no longer teflon, either.   Just like losing his strengths would set us back if he were to go, the status quo where we can't attract a top O mind, that's untenable, too.  The easiest solution would be if Elway realizes that he needs an outsider's perspective to change whatever methodology Kubiak & he are using.  

Edited by Broncofan

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^^^I don't think the extension to Brock was wrong....he deserved it.  During the Super Bowl season Brock was a major reason we made it to the playoffs.  He played well during that season.  Even in that Chargers game most of the turnovers were not his fault.  If that game went the other way, we'd be talking about Super Bowl champion Brock.  Brock, however, followed the money and I cannot blame him for that.  He is the richest backup in the league now.  In all, Brock was not THAT bad.  I actually would have signed him over Keenum in the interim between him and finding QBOTF.  

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While they never let it on publicly, they had to know that the Keenum signing was a risk, hence the two-year, front-loaded deal they signed him to. The history of the NFL is laden with one-hit QB wonders and Case is far from the first one to flame out. I’ve said it several times that I think Elway really wanted to give the vets, several of whom took hometown discounts to stay here, one last chance at getting another ring. 

Now I think the writing is on the walls that after this year they’re going to blow the whole thing up. I wouldn’t be surprised to see sweeping changes made not only to the roster and coaching staff but I think a few of Elway’s lieutenants in the Front Office get shown the door. 

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