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2019 Free Agency Thread

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46 minutes ago, BackinBlack said:

i wonder how many of those 6 drops came on the raiders vs the cowboys.

drops are such a weird stat, i feel like Cooper had at least 6 drops for us in the first 6 weeks lol

I don’t know but Crabtree was with Baltimore all year.

 

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7 minutes ago, Bitty 2.0 said:

 You’re kidding me right you’re blaming the QB for drop passes, John Elway used to break his WRs fingers with how hard he threw the ball.

Since Cooper and Crabtree are still in the top 20 for droped balls this year, I guess it’s the WRs fault.

https://www.foxsports.com/nfl/stats?season=2018&week=100&category=RECEIVING&opp=0&sort=11&qualified=1&sortOrder=0&page=1

 

First how many dropped passes did Cooper have while with the Raiders.  I can not find any stats that show his time in Oakland vs Dallas.  Second to say he is in the top 20 does not tell the entire story.  He is in 18th place but tied with 12 other people so his ranking is somewhere between 18 and 29.  Third you forgot to mention that Cook is also ranked 3rd-6th on that sight.  Although Cook is receiving more targets his drops have increased at a greater rate since leaving GB.  He has always dropped passes but Cook's worst ranking before playing in Oakland was 35th.  He has been top ten in drops both years here but tied for 9th with 14 other players in 2017.  Like I said the only constant is Carr.

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2 hours ago, Devilshark69 said:

whats up yall, been awhile .im glad bitty showed those drop stats. I can count how many good quaterbacks ive watched play for our team over the last 43 yrs ON ONE HAND! stabler, plunkett, hoss, gannon, and DC. and none were with us for more than than 10 yrs except stabler. do I even need to list all the other garbage. Carr can be better yes, hes definitely skittish , hes only like the 16th highest paid qb now theres worse making more. qb market and draft are crap anyways.  I believe carr will improve in what everyone here knows is a complex system. everyone on here knows coop wasn't living up to his #4 spot (especially leading in drops) and crabs lost concentration all the time too. definitely not carrs fault.

He is 15th 2019( will drop to 13th with Flacco and Tannehill), 10th 2020 (drop to 7th with the previous 2 plus Bortles), and 7th 2021 (5th with Flacco and A Smith).  He will move up and down the list with cuts and young QBs getting paid but the question is does he deserve top 10 money.  Will he grow into a top ten QB in Gruden's system because other than 2016 he has not been.  Also do we want to build a really good team around an average starter at QB or spend and/or draft a top QB if he does not grow into what we all hope he can be next year?

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I’ve gone back and forth on him but I would rather get some speed and talent on both sides of the ball and see what he can do with it. If it doesn’t work this year, get a qb next year to play in a good situation.  I’m not against drafting a qb after the third round this year though. I just feel like we have too many other needs to use anything higher than a third.

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39 minutes ago, drfrey13 said:

First how many dropped passes did Cooper have while with the Raiders.  I can not find any stats that show his time in Oakland vs Dallas.  Second to say he is in the top 20 does not tell the entire story.  He is in 18th place but tied with 12 other people so his ranking is somewhere between 18 and 29.  Third you forgot to mention that Cook is also ranked 3rd-6th on that sight.  Although Cook is receiving more targets his drops have increased at a greater rate since leaving GB.  He has always dropped passes but Cook's worst ranking before playing in Oakland was 35th.  He has been top ten in drops both years here but tied for 9th with 14 other players in 2017.  Like I said the only constant is Carr.

And Crabtree was ranked fourth.

its crazy to suggest the QB throwing motion causes their drop passes.  They literally see thousands of passes from Carr every year.

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2 hours ago, Bitty 2.0 said:

And Crabtree was ranked fourth.

its crazy to suggest the QB throwing motion causes their drop passes.  They literally see thousands of passes from Carr every year.

Not to mention one of the things that Crabbs and Jones first noticed about Care was how catchable a ball he threw.

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3 hours ago, Bitty 2.0 said:

And Crabtree was ranked fourth.

its crazy to suggest the QB throwing motion causes their drop passes.  They literally see thousands of passes from Carr every year.

Well, sure its crazy to blame the QB. they are NFL WRs , you are paid to catch the ball
just saying that, it seems no matter the WR Carr throws too.. we seem to have more drops than average. 

if you dont think the way the ball comes out of a QBs hand, impacts a catch you are crazy.

Im sure you would agree that a tight spiral is easier to catch than a wobbly pass?
Have you ever tried to catch a ball angled downward, but coming in flat? To me it is the toughest thing, worse than a wobbly ball. 

Not saying that those are Carrs issues, just that I dont think its crazy to think that, maybe some of it is on the QB since we have seen it with so many different WRs. 


 

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Carr's 2019 base salary is now fully guaranteed.  He is a Raider through the year now since he now has over $27 million in dead cap if traded.

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Just now, drfrey13 said:

Carr's 2019 base salary is now fully guaranteed.  He is a Raider through the year now since he now has over $27 million in dead cap if traded.

ya, of course... glad I didn't waste any time out of my life getting into those Carr debates

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5 hours ago, BackinBlack said:

Well, sure its crazy to blame the QB. they are NFL WRs , you are paid to catch the ball
just saying that, it seems no matter the WR Carr throws too.. we seem to have more drops than average. 

if you dont think the way the ball comes out of a QBs hand, impacts a catch you are crazy.

Im sure you would agree that a tight spiral is easier to catch than a wobbly pass?
Have you ever tried to catch a ball angled downward, but coming in flat? To me it is the toughest thing, worse than a wobbly ball. 

Not saying that those are Carrs issues, just that I dont think its crazy to think that, maybe some of it is on the QB since we have seen it with so many different WRs. 


 

 Jordy Nelson is not on that list

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5 hours ago, Bitty 2.0 said:

 Jordy Nelson is not on that list

he is not. but he was on the next page. 
also;
2016 - 152 targets 2 drops (with Rodgers) = 1.3%
2018 - 88 targets 3 drops = 3.4%

but that has way to little data to make an argument, i am having trouble finding his drop stats.. 2016 is the only year i could find for some reason, found 2015, but he was injured that year. 
 

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4 hours ago, BackinBlack said:

he is not. but he was on the next page. 
also;
2016 - 152 targets 2 drops (with Rodgers) = 1.3%
2018 - 88 targets 3 drops = 3.4%

but that has way to little data to make an argument, i am having trouble finding his drop stats.. 2016 is the only year i could find for some reason, found 2015, but he was injured that year. 
 

The numbers vary from site to site but the Washington Post and sporting charts has 2009 to 2016 numbers.

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9 hours ago, Bitty 2.0 said:

 Jordy Nelson is not on that list

Some players can adapt, some are on the margin (They will have a high variance year to year), and some can only do it one way (The players you see that fall apart when going to another team or QB).  It could be that Cook and Cooper just have a hard time seeing Carr's ball but it is not his fault.  It could also be that Jordy is just a great pass catcher and Carr has a strange ball to catch.  Nobody knows anything for certain because this team transitions to knew coaches and schemes to much.  Now we are going to see a high turnover rate in personnel so there will be bumps in the road and some players will not fit.  I just hope it comes together quickly and a huge step in that directions would be Carr playing well.  If he is not the one we will not be good for an extra 2-3 years at least and I do not want to wait that long.

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15 hours ago, drfrey13 said:

Carr's 2019 base salary is now fully guaranteed.  He is a Raider through the year now since he now has over $27 million in dead cap if traded.

To me this means Murray is out of the running for us in the draft. No way to the Raiders use a 1st on a guy who’s waffling on playing football. Especially when they have 20 million tied into the position. I doubt that Murray would want to sit the bench which he’d almost certainly do due to Carr’s price tag. 

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2 hours ago, Chali21 said:

To me this means Murray is out of the running for us in the draft. No way to the Raiders use a 1st on a guy who’s waffling on playing football. Especially when they have 20 million tied into the position. I doubt that Murray would want to sit the bench which he’d almost certainly do due to Carr’s price tag. 

yay!

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