How would you use the Le'Veon sized chunk of cap space that will free up this offseason?

[Chieferific]

2 minutes ago, Dcash4 said:

Interesting. And Irvin then signed a deal for about $9M per. Very different hype sourounding each player at the time, but interesting comparison. 

I had a gut feeling it was going to be close. It turned out to be exact. One caveat came to mind. If I recall correctly, Irvin wasn't an every down player in Seattle. I think he rotated in on Passing downs. Dupree may have been on the field more. However, Dupree hasn't always been the Rush LB. So perhaps that evens out.  Besides the stats, I think they are similar players. They both win with quickness. Neither has power or a plethora of Rush moves. To me, the intended signing of Irvin is more of a reflection on how they feel about Chick. You don't sign Dupree's "twin" if you don't like Dupree. 

[Dcash4]

6 minutes ago, Chieferific said:

To me, the intended signing of Irvin is more of a reflection on how they feel about Chick. You don't sign Dupree's "twin" if you don't like Dupree. 

Agreed. Just felt like a “more horses” scenario. Attempt to keep high effort TJ and Bud fresh and not take a step back. 

[VigilantZombie]

2 hours ago, Dcash4 said:

I’m not tying to put words in MOs mouth, but I don’t think he is trying to say Bud is worth $10-$15M a year...just that $3M in today’s NFL is super low. Elite guys are getting $17-$20M, top starters $13M plus. Actually looking at the reality of the NFL and how money is tending, $5-6M isn’t starter money, and probably right in line with what Dupree could be had for. More from a team that has, and need to spend, the money. 

He is going to be 26 and has 18 career sacks. We dislike him because he is a failed first rounders. The NFL won’t look at him like we do. 

I actually completely disagree with you as far as the money you mentioned okay you're not wrong. I do think you're wrong about how the NFL will view him it's what you mean is that the NFL will view him as an asset. Quite frankly in my opinion he's right in line with the value of someone like Bruce Irvin who was just cut by the Raiders. You say 18 career sacks I say that's less than 5 a season.

 

You don't draft an outside linebacker that is supposed to be a pass rusher in the first round 4 as little as 5 sacks and season it just don't do it. And that isn't what the Steelers drafted in for. Is it is between keeping him on a 9 million dollar contract and letting him walk and get big money somewhere else The Following season or signing him in the offseason for 6 Plus million dollars a year I'd rather pay him the 9 million for one year

[VigilantZombie]

For the record how I feel about Dupree has nothing to do with a hatred for the player. It does however have to do with being sick and tired of watching this team keep around mediocrity. That mediocrity that we keep keeping on the roster is why we haven't won a Superbowl in however many years. Vince Williams we're not expecting to completely suck as a starter although some of us we're not displeased with him being signed to a new contract he is a very good example of that.

 

Quite frankly Justin Hunter is also a very good example of that there is a reason he has been cut from multiple teams. Dupree is going to be the latest example of that. He isn't terrible but he also isn't anything more than a career backup at this point.

It would be great to see him miraculously put it all together and be a premier starter but if you honestly think that is going to happen you have not watched him play for the last 4 years

[Chieferific]

@wwhickok, some contradictions here. You previously stated that you would "love" to get Irvin. Then you say that you value Irvin the same as Dupree (a player you criticize often). I don't know what the Irvin deal was but he said he took a discount. I bet it is still more then $3 Million a year. A figure you appeared to balk at for Dupree. Both have similar stats and both were 1st Rd picks (Dupree was the better value at the time). Your takes are a bit confusing. Can you clarify?

[VigilantZombie]

3 minutes ago, Chieferific said:

@wwhickok, some contradictions here. You previously stated that you would "love" to get Irvin. Then you say that you value Irvin the same as Dupree (a player you criticize often). I don't know what the Irvin deal was but he said he took a discount. I bet it is still more then $3 Million a year. A figure you appeared to balk at for Dupree. Both have similar stats and both were 1st Rd picks (Dupree was the better value at the time). Your takes are a bit confusing. Can you clarify?

Absolutely you're right I did say that here's the reason I said I'd love to give purvin and I don't think I initially explained why I felt that way to begin with. I feel very confident it if you can use it free in a solid rotation into this is why I said what I said about the contact number if you use him in a solid rotation with a guy like perhaps Bruce Irvin who is a very similar player I feel like he can be more effective I feel like if you had added Bruce and they did try to their credit that you keep Dupree fresh you keep Irvin fresh and you don't lose anything from one place to the next

[VigilantZombie]

I don't know if that helps create some clarity or not but basically I wouldn't have wanted to go out and spend huge money on her but by any means and I was a little disappointed to see that he signed with the Falcons but I am happy to see that he did not sign with the Patriots and I can understand after realizing Atlanta is his hometown why he signed with them. But I will say this one teen Irvin was a lot more about the guys behind Dupree than it was about Dupree. And for the record quite frankly I could obviously be completely wrong about Dupre becoming a better player and frankly if I'm being completely honest I really hope I am I don't think that I am obviously but I hope that I am wrong and he does become a premier starter and I have to eat crow it wouldn't be the first time but it would frankly be something I'd be very pleased with

[Chieferific]

4 minutes ago, wwhickok said:

Absolutely you're right I did say that here's the reason I said I'd love to give purvin and I don't think I initially explained why I felt that way to begin with. I feel very confident it if you can use it free in a solid rotation into this is why I said what I said about the contact number if you use him in a solid rotation with a guy like perhaps Bruce Irvin who is a very similar player I feel like he can be more effective I feel like if you had added Bruce and they did try to their credit that you keep Dupree fresh you keep Irvin fresh and you don't lose anything from one place to the next

Ok. But you would be rotating a Dupree (whom you do not like as a OLB) with a fresh "Dupree" in Irvin who is essentially the same player. See where the confusion lies?

[Dcash4]

49 minutes ago, wwhickok said:

I actually completely disagree with you as far as the money you mentioned okay you're not wrong. I do think you're wrong about how the NFL will view him it's what you mean is that the NFL will view him as an asset. Quite frankly in my opinion he's right in line with the value of someone like Bruce Irvin who was just cut by the Raiders. You say 18 career sacks I say that's less than 5 a season.

 

You don't draft an outside linebacker that is supposed to be a pass rusher in the first round 4 as little as 5 sacks and season it just don't do it. And that isn't what the Steelers drafted in for. Is it is between keeping him on a 9 million dollar contract and letting him walk and get big money somewhere else The Following season or signing him in the offseason for 6 Plus million dollars a year I'd rather pay him the 9 million for one year

Your second paragraph is exactly why I’m right about how the NFL will view him. You only see him as a failed 1st round pick, which is fine because he is. But he isn’t a failed first round pick of 31 other teams, he is OUR failed first round pick— we wear the scar. They will view him for his on field worth, which is a borderline average starter/3rd rusher. That mediocrity will most likely see him paid between $4-$7M. 

I’m not sure what you mean when you use the word asset, like he wouldn’t be. An asset doesn’t have a definition to anyone but the owner. DHB is a former top 10 pick who is still an asset. Not at receiver, but as a special teamer. Dupree doesn’t have to be Khalil Mack to be an asset. He is probably a quality third guy.  

The comparison has already been made about Irvin here and those 18 sacks in less than 5 years (as you said) saw Irvin get $9M per. That was 2 years ago. The numbers have gone up. Thinking that it’s asinine that Bud couldn’t sniff numbers like that is well....asinine. 

[Chieferific]

Irvin contract: The Falcons signed him to a $3.2 Million contract prorated for the 8 remaining games. So basically $1.5 Million. Irvin still gets his Raider money which makes a total of $9.75 Million this year. 

https://thefalconswire.usatoday.com/2018/11/07/bruce-irvin-contract-details-for-1-year-deal-with-falcons/

[VigilantZombie]

45 minutes ago, Dcash4 said:

Your second paragraph is exactly why I’m right about how the NFL will view him. You only see him as a failed 1st round pick, which is fine because he is. But he isn’t a failed first round pick of 31 other teams, he is OUR failed first round pick— we wear the scar. They will view him for his on field worth, which is a borderline average starter/3rd rusher. That mediocrity will most likely see him paid between $4-$7M. 

I’m not sure what you mean when you use the word asset, like he wouldn’t be. An asset doesn’t have a definition to anyone but the owner. DHB is a former top 10 pick who is still an asset. Not at receiver, but as a special teamer. Dupree doesn’t have to be Khalil Mack to be an asset. He is probably a quality third guy.  

The comparison has already been made about Irvin here and those 18 sacks in less than 5 years (as you said) saw Irvin get $9M per. That was 2 years ago. The numbers have gone up. Thinking that it’s asinine that Bud couldn’t sniff numbers like that is well....asinine. 

When I used the word *** at which depending on how you use it I guess we can have different meanings but the way I was using it I meant more of a premier starter but you are right and you know what any that's the argument some of the other people that have disagreed with me or trying to make and I think that you stated it in a more clear way to me my comprehension is weird I guess but anyway you are right that whatever he is in for some teams that will be enough. And you are also right I simply view him as a failed first round pick but if I'm being completely honest I'm not sure that I would be happy with his production right now if you were drafted in the first three rounds. The fact is he was drafted in the first round so I can't say for sure but I believe that I wouldn't be happy if he were drafted within that first three tiers. To me I don't know here's my issue with the contract amount our defense needs help and for a moment let's take Bud Dupree out of the equation all together how much money do you honestly think and I'm genuinely asking a question here for anybody who wants to answer how much money do you think we will be left with not including Bud Dupree after we resign our own players going into free agency? And with that amount do you feel that is enough to sign Bud Dupree to a new contract end legitimately improve the defense even if it's only by one position? If you can honestly say yesterday. Maybe I can bite the bullet on bringing Bud Dupree back but if you think that we will not be left with enough money to make a legitimate free agent move because I honestly feel we need to then I am in favor of letting Bud Dupree walk

[VigilantZombie]

1 minute ago, Chieferific said:

Irvin contract: The Falcons signed him to a $3.2 Million contract prorated for the 8 remaining games. So basically $1.5 Million. Irvin still gets his Raider money which makes a total of $9.75 Million this year. 

https://thefalconswire.usatoday.com/2018/11/07/bruce-irvin-contract-details-for-1-year-deal-with-falcons/

I mean so let's do a little hypothetical math here 416 games that contract would be worth 6.4 million dollars to me I don't know I still feel like that's a little high for what bud Dupree brings to the table but my opinion honestly may change if he continues to have good production throughout the rest of the season. I have admittedly been very critical of Bud Dupree but I promise you it's not because I hate him it is however because I'm very disappointed. And you feel like there is a legitimate rationale to my complaints against but you pre I just not mean that my contract expectations are accurate and I'm fine with that. But I do feel that when we go into free agency we need to do something on defense.

[VigilantZombie]

That word that was bleeped out because I spoke it via voice text of course was asset

[3rivers]

14 hours ago, Dcash4 said:

Who said you must pencil him in as a starter and keep other guys from opportunities? $3M for a roster spot is a steal...doesn’t means he is your exclusive starter. If you bring him back for that low, it’s most likely as a rotational player. $3M is also easy to walk away from. Your not taking anything away from anyone else. 

with his team and FO, there is a bias towards their own draft picks as long as they aren't in trouble with tomlin. Dupree hasn't been in trouble and has slowly improved ( a bit) so that along with being a draft pick of theirs has me favouring him getting the start.  I wouldn't start him, but that's how I see it with this cast currently . 3M is easy to walk away from, that I agree with and that would be my limit, keep him on that as a rotational player if the other 2 STARTERS need a breather or aren't healthy. 

Dupree has slightly improved, but not enough to be a starter for the standard and I still want them to get Adeyini on the roster and rotate him to see how he does in comparison . They should have been learning about some players on the roster now so they can decide going into next season. The limited number of active players on a roster doesn't help the matter either. 

5 hours ago, Chieferific said:

Bud Dupree: 46 games in career. 18 Sacks.

Bruce Irvin: First 46 games of career; 18 Sacks. 

 

Both benefited from he talent around them and stats are misleading at times. I just go by the play and how the player affected the games more than stats. I do like the FF stat for the OLB's and if there was a under 3 second pressure stat.  I wouldn't doubt it if duprees  18 sacks are mostly past 4 seconds or from other teammates forcing the QB in his direction.  

To be clear, I'm not sold on him as a legit pass rusher despite what others say, where he was drafted, what stats he has etc. At least he has improved, but to me , there is quite a ways to go to actually be considered the standard.  

Now how about asking why is coty starting instead of Sutton? I am glad they are benching burns, but they still didn't make the right decision from what I have seen. Burns is wasting a roster spot as of now and look what teams we will face  in this schedule.  

[Dcash4]

1 hour ago, 3rivers said:

Both benefited from he talent around them and stats are misleading at times.

😳

Yes, Cam Chancellor, Earl Thomas, and Richard Sherman are the same as Artie Burns, Mike Mitchell, and Coty Sensabaugh.