Le'Veon Bell -Farewell Miami

[3rivers]

1 minute ago, JustAnotherFan said:

If I'm a GM. Before talking about which system he would fit in and whatnot, you should first ask yourself whether or not he is going to be the same Bell as he was in the past after sitting this long.

Just throwing that out there.

Agree 100% yet there could be a few GM's out there that don't think like this . I would have a weight clause because he looked heavy last year and heavier this year.  When he was light, he was playing his best . I thought he was mediocre at best for the first month last season, I couldn't stand watching them hand off to him and see how slow he was in comparison to previous seasons. 

I expect him to be a valuable threat as a WR out of the backfield, but I unless he gets a good OL, I can't expect him to have the yards rushing or YPC either.  To pay what he expects for that makes no sense to me, but will to a few.  

[JAF-N72EX]

1 minute ago, 3rivers said:

CBA was pathetic but the players agreed to it because they were desperate and they don't do whats best in the long run. RB's should be UFA in a year less time than the other players since their shelf life is much less.  The RB's really got a bad deal on that last agreement. The franchise tag is also a fail when they can be applied more than  once to a player.  

Then consider how QB's can't get hit, play much longer and are getting paid much more than others.  It doesn't seem fair the direction the league has been in and could be going. 

Agreed. My solution to it all would be that they're rookie pay scales should either be more or shorter. Maybe keep everything the same with the exception of RB's. Not sure of that's possible, but something has to be done.

[JAF-N72EX]

3 minutes ago, jrry32 said:

He probably just did you a favor. He didn't add more touches to his count. Sitting out a season won't diminish your skills, and they'll be able to tell if he let himself go when they have FA visits.

Yeah possible. You could tell that during workouts and whatnot. 

[3rivers]

Just now, JustAnotherFan said:

Agreed. My solution to it all would be that they're rookie pay scales should either be more or shorter. Maybe keep everything the same with the exception of RB's. Not sure of that's possible, but something has to be done.

At least with bells drama this season, people (players RBs) might  should remember when the next CBA is put together.  Maybe their pay could be based on carries, a scale that perhaps could be outside of the cap.  Average carries per game scale, and also carries+catches scale .  Determine typical average in recent years and if players are used pas that they get more pay, something like that. For a team to have the rights to a player for 5 years when their career might only be 7 and considering they take the most punishment , it's about as unfair as it can be.  WR's can be defenceless, but RB's aren't, so much for safety and caring for the RB, might as well rob them of their pay scale while at it.

[3rivers]

4 minutes ago, JustAnotherFan said:

Yeah possible. You could tell that during workouts and whatnot. 

other teams don't have specifics that say the steelers might have had in 2015 or 2016 (if the steelers even monitor such drills and times) . The players weight would be about the only part teams can verify,  and I would expect teams to have him go through drills and work out like the redskins did with AP. If he doesn't weigh in the range expected, maybe he will be the new Kap and not be signed

[Matts4313]

11 minutes ago, 3rivers said:

Agree 100% yet there could be a few GM's out there that don't think like this . I would have a weight clause because he looked heavy last year and heavier this year.  When he was light, he was playing his best . I thought he was mediocre at best for the first month last season, I couldn't stand watching them hand off to him and see how slow he was in comparison to previous seasons. 

I expect him to be a valuable threat as a WR out of the backfield, but I unless he gets a good OL, I can't expect him to have the yards rushing or YPC either.  To pay what he expects for that makes no sense to me, but will to a few.  

So the its unfair because the wages reflect a free market system more so than a communist one? Were more valuable people make more money?

Get out of America!!

[JAF-N72EX]

2 minutes ago, 3rivers said:

At least with bells drama this season, people (players RBs) might  should remember when the next CBA is put together.  Maybe their pay could be based on carries, a scale that perhaps could be outside of the cap.  Average carries per game scale, and also carries+catches scale .  Determine typical average in recent years and if players are used pas that they get more pay, something like that. For a team to have the rights to a player for 5 years when their career might only be 7 and considering they take the most punishment , it's about as unfair as it can be.  WR's can be defenceless, but RB's aren't, so much for safety and caring for the RB, might as well rob them of their pay scale while at it.

Well adding catches into the equation would probably most def cause an uproar --(wasn't there a TE trying to get paid like a WR?). 

But yeah, I'm not sure what the final solution would be. But my god, RB's already have such a short life span as it is, they need to do something. Either a 3 year pay scale or pay them more. And quite frankly, I'm all for limiting QB scales in general, not just rookies, and sending some of saved $ toward the RB position. Especially now, 2-way backs are becoming a necessity in any offense while power backs are being weed out like FB's were. 

[3rivers]

Just now, Matts4313 said:

So the its unfair because the wages reflect a free market system more so than a communist one? Were more valuable people make more money?

Get out of America!!

not so much, it's just the ratio is getting more and more out of what some would agree with . Deion Sanders doesn't care for how the QB's are getting so much more, and I usually agree with 21st and Prime.  When you consider the running game and how it helps the QB's and also protects them to a degree, it just adds to what I said. 

And NO to communism 

[JAF-N72EX]

4 minutes ago, Matts4313 said:

So the its unfair because the wages reflect a free market system more so than a communist one? Were more valuable people make more money?

Get out of America!!

Oh boy. 

[Matts4313]

4 minutes ago, 3rivers said:

not so much, it's just the ratio is getting more and more out of what some would agree with . Deion Sanders doesn't care for how the QB's are getting so much more, and I usually agree with 21st and Prime.  When you consider the running game and how it helps the QB's and also protects them to a degree, it just adds to what I said. 

And NO to communism 

 

2 minutes ago, JustAnotherFan said:

Oh boy. 

I was joking... I think the RB salaries are deflated because in part they are easily replaceable and we went through a pretty significant patch were there werent that many great ones. Their average salaries will go up as Gurley, Bell, Zeke, Kamara, Fournette, etc all get contracts the next couple years.

[3rivers]

1 minute ago, JustAnotherFan said:

Well adding catches into the equation would probably most def cause an uproar --(wasn't there a TE trying to get paid like a WR?). 

But yeah, I'm not sure what the final solution would be. But my god, RB's already have such a short life span as it is, they need to do something. Either a 3 year pay scale or pay them more. And quite frankly, I'm all for limiting QB scales in general, not just rookies, and sending some of saved $ toward the RB position. Especially now, 2-way backs are becoming a necessity in any offense while power backs are being weed out like FB's were. 

This is where a team that wins the SB vs the annual favourite could set an example, such as the eagles did last year. They won with a back up QB (that played like a starter) and  RB by committee which worked BECAUSE they had possibly the best OL in the league.  Teams that spend much more cap on QB and WR will most likely lack the OL and running game and it's a lost cause for the RB. RB's depend on the OL a bit more IMO, another reason their value can vary and then add the list of injuries they accumulate . 

 

 

[JAF-N72EX]

1 minute ago, Matts4313 said:

 

I was joking... I think the RB salaries are deflated because in part they are easily replaceable and we went through a pretty significant patch were there werent that many great ones. Their average salaries will go up as Gurley, Bell, Zeke, Kamara, Fournette, etc all get contracts the next couple years.

I know you were. But this forum don't always work that way. I'm sure you know that by now. 

[3rivers]

1 minute ago, Matts4313 said:

 

I was joking... I think the RB salaries are deflated because in part they are easily replaceable and we went through a pretty significant patch were there werent that many great ones. Their average salaries will go up as Gurley, Bell, Zeke, Kamara, Fournette, etc all get contracts the next couple years.

good point because right now the league has quite a few capable RB's that will keep getting better.  Still, lower the QB salary, set a ceiling for them, and then let the RB's have 1 year less on their rookie deals and have incentive as well as a higher base salary.   Don't worry, the person handing off to the RB will still get about 10X what the RB is 

[Pool]

I think it'd be interesting if players were paid based on what tier they were in of their respective position. For example, top 5 positional talents get tier 1 money at 10m/yr whether you are a RB, QB,DE etc tier 2 gets 8m/yr etc.  I think the logistics make this completely unrealistic but I think it's asinine that the best o lineman gets paid less than the worst QB's. Just an interesting thought I had and I look forward to all of you telling me how dumb it is.

[3rivers]

1 hour ago, Pool said:

I think it'd be interesting if players were paid based on what tier they were in of their respective position. For example, top 5 positional talents get tier 1 money at 10m/yr whether you are a RB, QB,DE etc tier 2 gets 8m/yr etc.  I think the logistics make this completely unrealistic but I think it's asinine that the best o lineman gets paid less than the worst QB's. Just an interesting thought I had and I look forward to all of you telling me how dumb it is.

this is good if they can keep players from getting carried away with possibly thinking me first too often. Football is such a team sport  that it should work and this idea makes sense  but could make the understanding of a new cap a bit unusual.  As for the logistics, we have computers that should be able to crunch the numbers in the end. Suppose a base salary/cap hit, then the additional would be because of exceeded performance but how would the cap be adjusted?  I actually like this idea as it could pay the players under the rookie deals in some cases what they are worth relative to what they are getting or what overpaid vets are getting . How does a RB actually get paid if they are under rookie deals for 4  years and then never play out their next deal due to injuries or loss of ability to age or the knife? 

The idea isn't dumb ,  but innovative and more fair. Next is figuring out how the cap works in this system. I would think a grading system would be in place other than stats (for OL ) and it could be done  The league could have set pay scales for every player in the draft, then the incentives for performance exceeding the base salary. Some skill players probably have this in some way, but others don't I can't remember an OL getting incentives for pancake blocks or  having allowed less pressures or the RB averages 5ypc when running that way etc. .