Random Ravens Thoughts: New Forum Edition

[DreamKid]

3 hours ago, diamondbull424 said:

Wow. And dudes a rookie? Makes sense why he’s standing out the way he was against rookies. Dudes LITERALLY a grown man.

This team loves over aged players lol.

[coordinator0]

https://russellstreetreport.com/2018/05/28/street-talk/players-laud-martindales-aggressiveness/

Please don't be empty praise, please don't be empty praise, please don't be empty praise...

[sp6488]

15 minutes ago, coordinator0 said:

https://russellstreetreport.com/2018/05/28/street-talk/players-laud-martindales-aggressiveness/

Please don't be empty praise, please don't be empty praise, please don't be empty praise...

I doubt it (cautiously, of course).

This is exactly the verbiage used by Harbaugh when he announced that Martindale would be taking over for Pees.  Also, he's been our LB coach, so I'm sure many of the players do know his style/personality.

[AFlaccoSeagulls]

1 hour ago, coordinator0 said:

https://russellstreetreport.com/2018/05/28/street-talk/players-laud-martindales-aggressiveness/

Please don't be empty praise, please don't be empty praise, please don't be empty praise...

I will admit, the more I hear about this, the more I get the Chuck Pagano feel from him more than the Dean Pees feel.

[SalvadorsDeli]

Obviously, it'll take till the actual games to see whether he can coach the defense up, and whether his playcalling/play designs work. But one thing that's clear even just from reading that one article is that a lot of our players just did not like playing for Pees. A lot of talk about not being "robots" anymore, and that the defense feels more collaborative now and that the players have a voice rather than the coaches mandating from above,... that all feels like a bit more than just the usual fluff and you can hear some pointed criticisms of the previous regime in there. They need to translate that goodwill into actual results for any of this to matter or for Martindale to have made the positive case for being DC but it does underline why Pees needed to go. 

[AFlaccoSeagulls]

18 hours ago, BaltimoreTerp said:

Obviously, it'll take till the actual games to see whether he can coach the defense up, and whether his playcalling/play designs work. But one thing that's clear even just from reading that one article is that a lot of our players just did not like playing for Pees. A lot of talk about not being "robots" anymore, and that the defense feels more collaborative now and that the players have a voice rather than the coaches mandating from above,... that all feels like a bit more than just the usual fluff and you can hear some pointed criticisms of the previous regime in there. They need to translate that goodwill into actual results for any of this to matter or for Martindale to have made the positive case for being DC but it does underline why Pees needed to go. 

Is it too early to start asking the question of "If this many players had this strong of an opinion about playing for Pees, why was he continuously given passes and given an extension?"

[Danand]

Every time there was a media story about someone outside the Ravens was unhappy with- or questioned Dean Pees defense, someone inside the Ravens media organization wrote stuff about how he was loved by the players. Several times I also saw players back him up and praise him for is schemes.

For what it is worth, I see it as a Cam Cameron situation, where he might have some backers in the organization, but his conservative and play it safe and play within a strict scheme isn't what players consider fun.

Sometimes change just feels refreshing, and that is what I think is happening.

For the pass rushers, it can also be small stuff like they now are allowed to commit more to rushing the passer. We all talk about how Dean Pees believed firmly in a pressure pass rush, where the pass rushers also had some run contain duty which means, that they had to pressure the gap instead of attacking wider from the edge. If that is the case, we might see more quarterback hurries as well as more quick and easy gains from offenses.

[AFlaccoSeagulls]

1 hour ago, Danand said:

Every time there was a media story about someone outside the Ravens was unhappy with- or questioned Dean Pees defense, someone inside the Ravens media organization wrote stuff about how he was loved by the players. Several times I also saw players back him up and praise him for is schemes.

For what it is worth, I see it as a Cam Cameron situation, where he might have some backers in the organization, but his conservative and play it safe and play within a strict scheme isn't what players consider fun.

Sometimes change just feels refreshing, and that is what I think is happening.

For the pass rushers, it can also be small stuff like they now are allowed to commit more to rushing the passer. We all talk about how Dean Pees believed firmly in a pressure pass rush, where the pass rushers also had some run contain duty which means, that they had to pressure the gap instead of attacking wider from the edge. If that is the case, we might see more quarterback hurries as well as more quick and easy gains from offenses.

like we didn't already see a wide abundance of this already with Pees.

I mean regardless, if this allows our players to play more freely and do more things that make them great players, I'm all for it. You brought up the pass rush and that's a great example - if we allow our guys to do more creative things - use spin moves, rip moves, swim moves, etc. instead of just bull rushing to create pressure, I'm all for it.

[DreamKid]

Beatdown's next installment of their piece on Joe Flacco's 2017 season-

https://www.baltimorebeatdown.com/2018/5/30/17404910/2017-film-review-the-chronicles-of-joe-flacco

 

This play stood out to me:

 

Watson is a freak athlete even at his advanced age, there isn't much of a difference between he and Hurst's speed/explosiveness. If anything I'd probably give Watson the edge. Hurst is more physical though and on the above play I think the main difference between the two would emerge. Hurst has elite hands and would convert this catch for a touchdown. 

[Danand]

13 hours ago, DreamKid said:

Beatdown's next installment of their piece on Joe Flacco's 2017 season-

https://www.baltimorebeatdown.com/2018/5/30/17404910/2017-film-review-the-chronicles-of-joe-flacco

 

This play stood out to me:

 

Watson is a freak athlete even at his advanced age, there isn't much of a difference between he and Hurst's speed/explosiveness. If anything I'd probably give Watson the edge. Hurst is more physical though and on the above play I think the main difference between the two would emerge. Hurst has elite hands and would convert this catch for a touchdown. 

I listen to the podcast, but I can't take those guys seriously. There is way too much of "I thought this about a player/play, and they didn't do what I think they should have done. What are they doing, are they morrons?"

For what it is worth, I believe the majority considers Flacco an above average quarterback and the sole reason he is an enigma to many is because he is so up and down during the season and then elevates his game in the playoffs.

If we convert Flacco to pure win/losses, I believe he is a 9-7 regular season QB with the ability to win in the playoffs. Then some believe he is an 8-8 to 7-9 QB who is good in the playoffs. 

To me, it becomes idiotic when some then suggest he is a 6-10 or below QB. With the players he has had around him and the revolving door on offense, I find it difficult to throw him under the bus. He gets plenty of blame for his ups and downs, and last season was the perfect example, because of how many things were wrong with that offense. But again, for how bad that offense was, Flacco still put together enough good games to make the team a contender. That is much more than many other quarterbacks and Flacco have been a part of such a team in 9 out of 10 seasons.

[AFlaccoSeagulls]

1 hour ago, Danand said:

I listen to the podcast, but I can't take those guys seriously. There is way too much of "I thought this about a player/play, and they didn't do what I think they should have done. What are they doing, are they morrons?"

For what it is worth, I believe the majority considers Flacco an above average quarterback and the sole reason he is an enigma to many is because he is so up and down during the season and then elevates his game in the playoffs.

If we convert Flacco to pure win/losses, I believe he is a 9-7 regular season QB with the ability to win in the playoffs. Then some believe he is an 8-8 to 7-9 QB who is good in the playoffs. 

To me, it becomes idiotic when some then suggest he is a 6-10 or below QB. With the players he has had around him and the revolving door on offense, I find it difficult to throw him under the bus. He gets plenty of blame for his ups and downs, and last season was the perfect example, because of how many things were wrong with that offense. But again, for how bad that offense was, Flacco still put together enough good games to make the team a contender. That is much more than many other quarterbacks and Flacco have been a part of such a team in 9 out of 10 seasons.

Flacco's stats speak for themselves, though, and those aren't the stats of an above-average QB, plain and simple. They haven't been in any season except 2014, where he had a good supporting cast around him and the best OC in football, arguably. Also, "a contender" is subjective. A contender for the playoffs? Sure. A contender to win a Superbowl? Hardly. We also can't ignore that for basically 3/4 of the season, Flacco was a large reason why we were not winning games. If you credit for him the late-season turnaround, you have to acknowledge his struggles the rest of the year.

As an aside, it's amazing though how many gifs of Flacco throws illustrate almost everything wrong with him as a QB. His lack of pocket presence (not stepping up to avoid the rush) and bad mechanics (throwing off his back foot) on this particular play. The only thing we don't see here is the questionable decision making.

[Danand]

Statistically Flacco will rarely be good/elite on paper. Last season, he had some games where he played well and games where he didn't hold the team back. There are people who believe Blake Bortles is a better QB because of his stats, completely neglecting the fact that he was a reason the Jaguars often played from behind and then he got passing yards in garbage time.

With Flacco, the team has always had a chance in the playoffs. Somehow, just somehow the offense around him has been able to produce (and when I write that, some will point to the one game where he completed 3 yards and talk about how Flacco is always carried by the team)

[AFlaccoSeagulls]

2 hours ago, Danand said:

Statistically Flacco will rarely be good/elite on paper. Last season, he had some games where he played well and games where he didn't hold the team back. There are people who believe Blake Bortles is a better QB because of his stats, completely neglecting the fact that he was a reason the Jaguars often played from behind and then he got passing yards in garbage time.

With Flacco, the team has always had a chance in the playoffs. Somehow, just somehow the offense around him has been able to produce (and when I write that, some will point to the one game where he completed 3 yards and talk about how Flacco is always carried by the team)

Here's a look at our 2015 game logs - aka when we can compare Flacco's output vs. someone else.

Flacco played through week 11, where he tore his ACL/MCL. We had 3 wins in 11 weeks. We had 2 wins in the last 5.

Here's our average passing stats for Flacco's 10 games and Schaub/Clausen/Mallett's 5 games:

Passing Yards: 266.4 with Flacco, 267.8 without.

PPG: 22.6 with Flacco, 20.4 without.

Turnovers: 1.7 with Flacco, 2.2 without.

1st downs: 20.6 with Flacco, 23.4 without

There's not much change there, despite what you could classify as a "significant downgrade" in the QB's we were trotting out there every game. It led to 1 less win in half the games, more passing yards/game, slightly less PPG, slightly more turnovers, and slightly more first downs per game. 

Given it is a very small sample size of 5 games with 3 different starting QB's, but the overall offensive production and output over those games didn't differ very much when Flacco went down. 

 

 

[berlin calling]

 

who's left after Wilson and now Zrebiec leaving? any reliable team source / beat writer i should know? please don't give me Preston 

[AFlaccoSeagulls]

7 minutes ago, berlin calling said:

 

who's left after Wilson and now Zrebiec leaving? any reliable team source / beat writer i should know? please don't give me Preston 

I hope hope hoep hope Zrebiec will still cover the Ravens, just for another publication.

If he doesn't, we have nobody left who is good. Mike Preston is the equivalent of me writing for the Baltimore Sun, and the staff at BR.com (Ellison, etc.) are just propagandists basically that only write positive garbage intended to hype up the team.

Honestly, this team needs young beat writers with a social media presence, but Baltimore is just not an exciting market/team right now to write for. Maybe once LJ takes over we'll get something.

Edited June 1, 2018 by Darth Pees