Week 11: VIKINGS (5-3-1) at Bears (6-3)

[swede700]

9 minutes ago, WindyCity said:

Doesn't that work both ways?

It absolutely works both ways, but the Vikings' defense does have more experience vs. Trubisky than the Bears' defense does against Cousins.  They are going to have that advantage...although I do believe Fangio and Zimmer are probably the top 2 defensive minds in all of the NFL.

[Guest]

I am a tad worried about this game.  I hope Diggs is 100% and I hope that O'Neill has the game of his life against Mack!!  I hope that Cousins can hold onto the ball and I hope that he has no batted down passes...especially on 3rd down.  I hope that the defense can get to and rattle Trubisky early and often!  I predict a score of 24-21 Minnesota.

[topwop1]

22 hours ago, TENINCH said:

Vikings are 6-1 vs Bears in last 7 games

And Detroit was also 9-1 in their last 10 games against the Bears before last Sunday occurred.  Not saying the Vikings won't win, the point here is that these aren't the same Bears as in years past under Fox or Trestman so past history means nothing when it comes to this rivalry.

[TENINCH]

MIN leads, 60–52–2

[Guest]

20 hours ago, Superman(DH23) said:

Their rating of Trubisky is an absolute joke.  They have given him negative grades on all 4 games where he had a passer rating over 100, including the 6 TD performance against the bucs, and this past Sunday against the lions.  They clearly have no intention in being accurate or objective with his grade whatsoever 

I agree with you.  I think Trubisky is much better than he grades out and Viking fans shouldn't underestimate him.

[Krauser]

21 hours ago, Superman(DH23) said:

Their rating of Trubisky is an absolute joke.  They have given him negative grades on all 4 games where he had a passer rating over 100, including the 6 TD performance against the bucs, and this past Sunday against the lions.  They clearly have no intention in being accurate or objective with his grade whatsoever 

Not true, they graded Trubisky as elite in the Bucs game and excellent vs the Lions. 

It’s the other games where he graded OK (Jets) to poor (Cards, Bills). 

[WindyCity]

As @Pool said in the Bears forum, I think the pressure is on the Vikings. The Vikings were a trendy Super Bowl pick and the Bears are playing with house money, they were not supposed to be good and are a year ahead of schedule.

I think the Brian O'Niell vs Khalil Mack matchup could be huge. As much as I am worried about Griffen and Hunter, Mack has manhandled every OT he has played while healthy and forced a ton of fumbles, something Cousins has struggled with.

[Superman(DH23)]

29 minutes ago, Krauser said:

Not true, they graded Trubisky as elite in the Bucs game and excellent vs the Lions. 

It’s the other games where he graded OK (Jets) to poor (Cards, Bills). 

Wheres the overall grade but it was showing as negative when I saw, I'd also challenge even the ridiculous nature of some of those.  Anyone who thought Trubisky was poor against the Bill's looked at a box score and didnt watch the game.  He made several key 3rd down throws that kept drives going, then of course the 2 gorgeous passes that easily would have been long TDs if Philip Gaines doesnt commit PI.  Hell the Miami grade is an absolute joke even looking at the stats, let alone watching the game.  

[swede700]

It depends upon what you mean by pressure.  There's pressure every week, and the Vikings have been prepared to deal with it for several years now, which the Bears have not, since they haven't been in the limelight at all...even this year.  They may still feel the need to prove themselves and that can create pressure all on its own.  Mack has only played against the Vikings once in his career (in 2015), and if I recall, was largely quiet, but he did get a sack on Teddy.  Obviously, he's on a better team now, but I'm not going to just take for granted that he's going to be the key, because he was pretty quiet against TJ Clemmings or Matt Kalil (I can't recall which one), of all people.  Not exactly top-shelf players.  

[Krauser]

Just now, Superman(DH23) said:

Wheres the overall grade but it was showing as negative when I saw, I'd also challenge even the ridiculous nature of some of those.  Anyone who thought Trubisky was poor against the Bill's looked at a box score and didnt watch the game.  He made several key 3rd down throws that kept drives going, then of course the 2 gorgeous passes that easily would have been long TDs if Philip Gaines doesnt commit PI.  Hell the Miami grade is an absolute joke even looking at the stats, let alone watching the game.  

The overall grade is at the bottom, 60.6. That’s mediocre. 

PFF grades aren’t positive or negative anymore, they’re scaled out of 100.  

You should admit you were wrong about PFF giving him bad grades for the Bucs and Lions games. They didn’t, they never did.

PFF grades every play on film and not by box score stats. Ironically, it’s Trubisky’s box score stats that you’re citing (passer rating over 100 is a box score stat) to argue he’s good.  

Box score stats are easily inflated by factors outside the QB’s control (dropped INTs, contested catches won on inaccurate throws, blown coverages leading to wide open targets downfield, missed tackles on screen passes leading to long YAC plays, etc) — which is why PFF grades do have some role in evaluating players. 

By PFF’s evaluation, Trubisky is capable of playing like one of the best QBs in the league, though he’s mostly fallen well below that standard this year, even when his box score stats have been good. His two excellent games were against two bad defenses, with the Lions hampered even further by injury (to Slay). 

We’ll see which version of Trubisky shows up on national TV against what’s become again a good Vikings defense. This will be his biggest stage to light things up since the season opener vs the Packers. Hard to say how that will go for him, good or bad. 

The Bears are obviously good enough anyway to win even if Trubisky doesn’t play particularly well, but their chances will go up considerably if Good Mitch shows up. 

 

[Superman(DH23)]

3 minutes ago, Krauser said:

The overall grade is at the bottom, 60.6. That’s mediocre. 

PFF grades aren’t positive or negative anymore, they’re scaled out of 100.  

You should admit you were wrong about PFF giving him bad grades for the Bucs and Lions games. They didn’t, they never did.

PFF grades every play on film and not by box score stats. Ironically, it’s Trubisky’s box score stats that you’re citing (passer rating over 100 is a box score stat) to argue he’s good.  

Box score stats are easily inflated by factors outside the QB’s control (dropped INTs, contested catches won on inaccurate throws, blown coverages leading to wide open targets downfield, missed tackles on screen passes leading to long YAC plays, etc) — which is why PFF grades do have some role in evaluating players. 

By PFF’s evaluation, Trubisky is capable of playing like one of the best QBs in the league, though he’s mostly fallen well below that standard this year, even when his box score stats have been good. His two excellent games were against two bad defenses, with the Lions hampered even further by injury (to Slay). 

We’ll see which version of Trubisky shows up on national TV against what’s become again a good Vikings defense. This will be his biggest stage to light things up since the season opener vs the Packers. Hard to say how that will go for him, good or bad. 

The Bears are obviously good enough anyway to win even if Trubisky doesn’t play particularly well, but their chances will go up considerably if Good Mitch shows up. 

 

No not the season overall, the game overall, bc they do still do +/- by game, and then after they do, its then normalized to a scale of 100

[Krauser]

43 minutes ago, Superman(DH23) said:

No not the season overall, the game overall, bc they do still do +/- by game, and then after they do, its then normalized to a scale of 100

Thanks, I know how PFF grades work. 

Again, you should admit you were mistaken that they gave him a poor grade for the Bucs and Lions games.

It's also not true that their grade was "showing as negative" at any point for those games, as you claimed. 

From PFF's "refocused" articles, published just hours after each game: 

Bucs: https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/pro-refocused-nfl-week-4-tampa-bay-buccaneers-10-chicago-bears-48

Quote

This was a great showing from Mitchell Trubisky after what has been a difficult start to the season. He was helped out by some great scheming that managed to get good matchups and open receivers, but he still had to make throws. There were a few big-time throws on a couple of his touchdowns, most importantly though, he didn’t throw any dangerous passes.

Lions: https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/pro-refocused-nfl-week-10-detroit-lions-22-chicago-bears-34

Quote

Mitchell Trubisky turned in one of his best performances of the season. The second-year quarterback was efficient underneath, finding open receivers with accurate throws, but also had several well-placed throws downfield.

Perhaps most importantly, Trubisky avoided the killer mistakes that have troubled him for much of the year. 

You came in here trying to play the victim: 

Quote

Their rating of Trubisky is an absolute joke.  They have given him negative grades on all 4 games where he had a passer rating over 100, including the 6 TD performance against the bucs, and this past Sunday against the lions.  They clearly have no intention in being accurate or objective with his grade whatsoever 

But that claim simply isn't true, and was never true. 

[vike daddy]

Both of the Vikings’ top receivers are on Wednesday’s injury report, but they fell into different categories.

Stefon Diggs was a full participant for the team, which fits into his vow to play against the Bears on Sunday night. Diggs did not play against the Lions in Week Nine, but the bye week seems to have made his rib injury a non-issue.

Adam Thielen did play in the win over the Lions, but was held under 100 receiving yards for the first time this season. He was limited in Wednesday’s session with low back and calf issues. There’s been no sign of concern that he won’t play this week and the next two days will let us know if that changes.

Linebacker Anthony Barr (hamstring) and safety Andrew Sendejo (groin) were both out of practice, which may be an indication that both will be out of action again this week.

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2018/11/14/stefon-diggs-full-adam-thielen-limited-in-vikings-practice/

[Vikes_Bolts1228]

According to VB1228 Football Slightly Unfocused.....

No team has lost if they score 51 points or more in an NFL game.

So it's pretty simple....all the Vikings need to do is score 51 points against the Bears and they're virtually assured victory.

It's THAT easy! Whoop!

 

[Superman(DH23)]

5 hours ago, Krauser said:

Thanks, I know how PFF grades work. 

Again, you should admit you were mistaken that they gave him a poor grade for the Bucs and Lions games.

It's also not true that their grade was "showing as negative" at any point for those games, as you claimed. 

From PFF's "refocused" articles, published just hours after each game: 

Bucs: https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/pro-refocused-nfl-week-4-tampa-bay-buccaneers-10-chicago-bears-48

Lions: https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/pro-refocused-nfl-week-10-detroit-lions-22-chicago-bears-34

You came in here trying to play the victim: 

But that claim simply isn't true, and was never true. 

So what killer mistakes has he made?  Curious how you read any of that as anything other backhanded compliments