Matts4313 Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 17 minutes ago, DaBoys said: Those analytics just scream for us to pay Dak big money. Its a cherry picked stats based unique to this year. Packers, Falcons, Vikings, Saints, Colts*, Ravens, Seahawks, Steelers (to round out the next 3) are all perennial playoff teams. *Colts with luck, which just further emphasizes the QB position Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CAPJ Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 3 hours ago, Matts4313 said: Its a cherry picked stats based unique to this year. Packers, Falcons, Vikings, Saints, Colts*, Ravens, Seahawks, Steelers (to round out the next 3) are all perennial playoff teams. *Colts with luck, which just further emphasizes the QB position But the difference between those teams and ours is I could justify paying Rodgers, Ryan, Luck, Brees, Wilson, Ben. They are all an upgrade over Dak. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nextyearfordaboyz Posted December 14, 2018 Share Posted December 14, 2018 6 hours ago, CAPJ said: But the difference between those teams and ours is I could justify paying Rodgers, Ryan, Luck, Brees, Wilson, Ben. They are all an upgrade over Dak. You would not trade Dak for what we knew of Rodgers and Brees in their third seasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CAPJ Posted December 14, 2018 Share Posted December 14, 2018 10 hours ago, Nextyearfordaboyz said: You would not trade Dak for what we knew of Rodgers and Brees in their third seasons. I would have for Ben, Wilson, Luck and Ryan. And the whole point of that post was based off the Top 10 paid Qbs right now. Brees and Rodgers latest contract wasnt based off their 3rd season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nextyearfordaboyz Posted December 14, 2018 Share Posted December 14, 2018 3 hours ago, CAPJ said: I would have for Ben, Wilson, Luck and Ryan. And the whole point of that post was based off the Top 10 paid Qbs right now. Brees and Rodgers latest contract wasnt based off their 3rd season. My main point is that in some cases, decisions had to be made on these quarterbacks before they proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that they were a franchise guy. QB is an insanely hard job, and players need to develop. Maybe you don’t think Dak can become that guy. Ok. But of the players you think are “worth it” now, several of them were not worth it at the same point in their careers as Dak. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CAPJ Posted December 14, 2018 Share Posted December 14, 2018 3 hours ago, Nextyearfordaboyz said: My main point is that in some cases, decisions had to be made on these quarterbacks before they proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that they were a franchise guy. QB is an insanely hard job, and players need to develop. Maybe you don’t think Dak can become that guy. Ok. But of the players you think are “worth it” now, several of them were not worth it at the same point in their careers as Dak. Agreed. But knowing what I do know now, I'm not giving Dak $25 million a year. We have seen Dak struggle with the line playing average. We have seen Dak play poorly without Zeke. We have seen Dak play poorly without a bonafide WR. You know when I have seen Dak play well? When Dez or Amari are at their best. When Zeke eats. When the oline plays better. The eyeball test shows that Dak is an average QB when the parts around him are subpar and a Top 10 QB when everything is clicking. So what happens when we pay him Top 10 money and he loses those parts? Dont know for sure but I'd bet based on what I have seen is that his performance will decline. This isnt bashing Dak. I do think we can win with him but at the right cost. Paying Dak top 10 money isnt worth losing additional pieces. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nextyearfordaboyz Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 7 minutes ago, CAPJ said: Agreed. But knowing what I do know now, I'm not giving Dak $25 million a year. We have seen Dak struggle with the line playing average. We have seen Dak play poorly without Zeke. We have seen Dak play poorly without a bonafide WR. You know when I have seen Dak play well? When Dez or Amari are at their best. When Zeke eats. When the oline plays better. The eyeball test shows that Dak is an average QB when the parts around him are subpar and a Top 10 QB when everything is clicking. So what happens when we pay him Top 10 money and he loses those parts? Dont know for sure but I'd bet based on what I have seen is that his performance will decline. This isnt bashing Dak. I do think we can win with him but at the right cost. Paying Dak top 10 money isnt worth losing additional pieces. I mean, I kind of think it’s a false premise that you basically have to give up every quality surrounding piece to pay Dak, especially with the salary cap continuing to go up. Also, of course Dak plays better when he’s surrounded by better players. Brady was at his best with Moss and Welker. His stats go down when Edelman and Gronk get hurt, etc. I’m not the strongest Dak supporter here. He has a lot that he has a lot of room to grow, certainly. But he has shown more in his first 2.5 seasons than nearly any QB picked outside of the top 3 rounds in NFL history. It’s hard to find a quarterback, and I’d hate to give up on one when 1) we have a lot of cap space, 2) a good surrounding cast, and 3) we are winning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CAPJ Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 6 minutes ago, Nextyearfordaboyz said: I mean, I kind of think it’s a false premise that you basically have to give up every quality surrounding piece to pay Dak, especially with the salary cap continuing to go up. Also, of course Dak plays better when he’s surrounded by better players. Brady was at his best with Moss and Welker. His stats go down when Edelman and Gronk get hurt, etc. I’m not the strongest Dak supporter here. He has a lot that he has a lot of room to grow, certainly. But he has shown more in his first 2.5 seasons than nearly any QB picked outside of the top 3 rounds in NFL history. It’s hard to find a quarterback, and I’d hate to give up on one when 1) we have a lot of cap space, 2) a good surrounding cast, and 3) we are winning. Part of the reason Dak has shown so much in his first 3 years, he came into a great situation (top oline, good playmakers) that most young QBs dont inherit. Most young QBs that play are top picks and only get those picks because their teams are terrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nextyearfordaboyz Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 4 minutes ago, CAPJ said: Part of the reason Dak has shown so much in his first 3 years, he came into a great situation (top oline, good playmakers) that most young QBs dont inherit. Most young QBs that play are top picks and only get those picks because their teams are terrible. It’s certainly your prerogative to look for reasons to not give Dak any credit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CAPJ Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 14 minutes ago, Nextyearfordaboyz said: It’s certainly your prerogative to look for reasons to not give Dak any credit. That's an extreme way of thinking. No once did I not give Dak any credit. I even stated we can win with him. My biggest concern was overpaying him. But it seems like most people on here that's Pro Dak cannot criticize him or admit his short comings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDsportsfan Posted December 17, 2018 Author Share Posted December 17, 2018 I don't know and don't feel like running all of the scenarios. But I would imagine Seattle can help us with that loss to the niners. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas_OutLaw7 Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 5 minutes ago, HDsportsfan said: I don't know and don't feel like running all of the scenarios. But I would imagine Seattle can help us with that loss to the niners. Even after losing to the Colts we have a 97% chance to make the playoffs. Lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDsportsfan Posted December 17, 2018 Author Share Posted December 17, 2018 3 minutes ago, Texas_OutLaw7 said: Even after losing to the Colts we have a 97% chance to make the playoffs. Lol Ha...oh...ok...I didn't know that. Still rooting for the Saints tomorrow night. Odd dynamic when you think about it....sitting at only 8-6. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quiller Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 well Rams and Goff not doing us any favors Watching the game a bit and Goff has been terrible as has the Rams D as I watch Philly move the ball down field at ease Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
textaz03 Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 Lmao Foles did it again. Put the dirty birds right back into the thick of it. Taking down the Rams will be just enough to trigger some momentum for them same that NOLA did for us.I can see Eagles riding that wave, they have the playoff experience to do it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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