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Are we at the end of the Rhodes...?

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7 hours ago, Viking Penguin said:

I think we need to try and trade Rhodes for a first in 2021.  Start the tank on offense, aquire 3+ 1st rounders in 2021 and draft Lawrence.  Lets do this right.  Trade Rhodes, play next season out with Hughes and Waynes, if we succeed then bonus, if its a failure or step back, we need drastic change.

I understand the idea but trading Rhodes isn't going to cause us to tank, nor should we. We have talent on both sides of the ball, just need a few balls to bounce our way next year.

IMO Rhodes should be on this team while.

A) Hughes has enough time to recover from his injury

B) Holton Hill has another year to learn

If Rhodes play doesn't improve much I'd look to move him via trade, cut, restructure etc. Rhodes, I believe, came out and said that this past season was his most frustrating as a pro. I'm thinking he'll have a bounce back year next year.

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3 minutes ago, VikeManDan said:

Not a fan of Lawrence?! :D

Not a fan of tanking the offense.  They need improvement, not necessarily "drastic change."  Plus, we have no idea what Lawrence will be in 3 years.  He could tear up his knees and never play again.  

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2 minutes ago, swede700 said:

Not a fan of tanking the offense.  They need improvement, not necessarily "drastic change."  Plus, we have no idea what Lawrence will be in 3 years.  He could tear up his knees and never play again.  

Cousins could tear up his knee and never play again too. There are very few coaches who have the job security to tank a team. Zimmer doesn't have a ten year contract, he's got one year left.

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13 hours ago, Cearbhall said:

The Vikings would still need that amount available on their cap. Franchise players cannot be traded until after they are signed.

Understandable, but many have already pointed out that it is doable 

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16 hours ago, VikeManDan said:

I understand the idea but trading Rhodes isn't going to cause us to tank, nor should we. We have talent on both sides of the ball, just need a few balls to bounce our way next year.

IMO Rhodes should be on this team while.

A) Hughes has enough time to recover from his injury

B) Holton Hill has another year to learn

If Rhodes play doesn't improve much I'd look to move him via trade, cut, restructure etc. Rhodes, I believe, came out and said that this past season was his most frustrating as a pro. I'm thinking he'll have a bounce back year next year.

Yeah sorry tanking was a bit of a strong word.  I just think if we could move Rhodes now for a first in 2021 we should as opposed to holding on to him and his value dropping a bit.  And I agree with you we will be competitive without Rhodes and who knows how good Hughes really is.

But the timeline suits is perfectly because cousins is locked in through 2019 and 2020.  Who knows he may get us that first overall pick on his own! Kidding...... 

I'm hoping for a big rebound next year. But I'm concerned it'll take too long to get the offensive line into shape.  Which is why I'm saying we should start drafting offensive lineman for the future but make sure we have strong draft capital in 2021, that should be the vision.

What if our offense shows no improvements next season? We would really have to look at the possibility of shooting for a once-in-a-lifetime QB.  Build a line now, so when we get a young prospect he will be well protected.  I would let Griffen walk if he doesnt restructure.  I would resign Theilen for sure.  As I said, I agree we need to ride this squad at the least one more year.  I have faith.  But to miss Lawrence and gift him to the Packers (please god no) or Lions or even Giants would suck.  We might in a golden position.  Us and the Denver Broncos, most other annually bad teams (aka Browns, Jets) have their guy.  

My prediction and write this down.  Belichick will tell Kraft he's tanking for Lawrence, New England will go 0-16 in 2020. That will also be Brady's retirement year. Book it!!😊

Edited by Viking Penguin

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5 hours ago, Viking Penguin said:

What if our offense shows no improvements next season? We would really have to look at the possibility of shooting for a once-in-a-lifetime QB. 

 

There's thing called trading.  If there is a "once-in-a-lifetime" QB (which is a silly notion anyway), they have the option to trade up for the guy they want...without tanking.  The Chiefs did it.  Washington thought they did it when they traded up for RGIII.  The Eagles did it.  You don't have to sacrifice an entire season to "Suck for Luck" or whatever nonsense they come up with for Lawrence.    

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14 minutes ago, swede700 said:

There's thing called trading.  If there is a "once-in-a-lifetime" QB (which is a silly notion anyway), they have the option to trade up for the guy they want...without tanking.  The Chiefs did it.  Washington thought they did it when they traded up for RGIII.  The Eagles did it.  You don't have to sacrifice an entire season to "Suck for Luck" or whatever nonsense they come up with for Lawrence.    

The problem though is it's very difficult to trade into the top spot, which is where you're going to have to be for the top QB in the draft, assuming whoever that player is actually worthy of the pick.

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2 minutes ago, vikingsrule said:

The problem though is it's very difficult to trade into the top spot, which is where you're going to have to be for the top QB in the draft, assuming whoever that player is actually worthy of the pick.

True...but in all the instances I mentioned, none of them were the top pick in the draft, but arguably 2 of them were the better QB (but, of course, the jury is still out on Wentz due to his early injury history) than the one selected ahead of them.

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4 minutes ago, swede700 said:

True...but in all the instances I mentioned, none of them were the top pick in the draft, but arguably 2 of them were the better QB (but, of course, the jury is still out on Wentz due to his early injury history) than the one selected ahead of them.

Agreed and I'd be looking to make a move like the Chiefs did next year if there is a deep QB class. Cousing and the defense are good enough to not have fewer than 7-8 wins, so a costly trade up is likely necessary if the Vikes have a desire to find a long term upgrade over Cousins. I don't think Spielman can afford to make moves for the 2020 draft, I think he may be more pressured to trade future assets to improve the team for 2019.

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14 minutes ago, vikingsrule said:

The problem though is it's very difficult to trade into the top spot, which is where you're going to have to be for the top QB in the draft, assuming whoever that player is actually worthy of the pick.

It's also pretty hard to suck enough to get the top pick

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4 minutes ago, vikesfan89 said:

It's also pretty hard to suck enough to get the top pick

Which is why the Vikings have only had it twice in their entire history...and the last time was 51 years ago.

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6 hours ago, Viking Penguin said:

I just think if we could move Rhodes now for a first in 2021

IF I'm moving Rhodes there would have to be a pick or more likely picks in 2020 in the addition to the 2021 1st.

For the record I'm not in favor of moving Rhodes this year. The offer would have to be Godfather-esque.

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18 minutes ago, swede700 said:

Which is why the Vikings have only had it twice in their entire history...and the last time was 51 years ago.

We're cursed in a way, being regularly too good to have a top 5 pick, or even top 10 pick. Looking at the most recent top 10 picks, Matt Kalil (top 5) in 2012 and Anthony Barr in 2014 (top 10), we really blew those two picks by not taking true difference makers. 

Kalil was a bust after a promising rookie year. Injuries and what seems to be a lack of interest killed his career.

Barr was just an underwhelming pick and i think many saw that when he was penciled in as a 4-3 off ball OLB. You just don't draft that position early. The pick in hindsight should have been Aaron Donald or Zach Martin.

Neither draft was great for QBs in that top 10. Colts lucked out with Luck and weren't going to budge. Washington went all in for RGIII but ended up with a better QB in round four (who's now our problem). Tannehill was an okay pick, just seems injuries have really derailed his career.

Edited by vikingsrule

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24 minutes ago, vikingsrule said:

Barr was just an underwhelming pick and i think many saw that when he was penciled in as a 4-3 off ball OLB. You just don't draft that position early. The pick in hindsight should have been Aaron Donald or Zach Martin.

Agree with this. Off ball OLB shouldn't be a top ten pick. I think it was a need pick given the sorry state of the defense and what Zimmer wanted to do when he came. Need based picks have a tendency to be less than ideal in the long game. This is why the Vikings need to get legitimate starters at guard on the team before the draft. If not, they have backed themselves into a corner that would almost force a need based pick. Trading Rhodes would kind of stink, but if the team can get a solid guard out of the deal along with a nice pick or an elite guard out of the deal I don't see how they can justify turning it down. It would make the team better and position them better for the draft.

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3 minutes ago, Cearbhall said:

Agree with this. Off ball OLB shouldn't be a top ten pick. I think it was a need pick given the sorry state of the defense and what Zimmer wanted to do when he came. Need based picks have a tendency to be less than ideal in the long game. This is why the Vikings need to get legitimate starters at guard on the team before the draft. If not, they have backed themselves into a corner that would almost force a need based pick. Trading Rhodes would kind of stink, but if the team can get a solid guard out of the deal along with a nice pick or an elite guard out of the deal I don't see how they can justify turning it down. It would make the team better and position them better for the draft.

If there is a way to make a trade for Brandon Scherff work, I'd be all for it. The Redskins need a CB too. I'd still prefer to trade Waynes over Rhodes if we had to choose. 

Trading Waynes would save the Vikes $9 million but you'd have to come up with another $5 million to afford Scherff (easy just cut Remmers).

i don't know what other pick woukd need to be included, maybe a 2nd, or if Washington wants to make a deal. A high end Guard probably costs the same as a top 15ish CB.

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