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Dwayne Haskins

Where will Haskins be drafted if he comes out?  

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  1. 1. Where will he be drafted?

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On 1/8/2019 at 11:24 AM, minutemancl said:

His press conference this year, especially regarding the QB situation, was so much different than the one last year. I'm willing to bet Eli gets a serious challenge this year, and it would make sense if it was from someone like Haskins. He fits the mold to a T of what Shurmur wants in his quarterbacks. The problem right now with moving up for him is there is a "who blinks first" situation between NYG, JAX, and potentially TB, depending on what Arians wants to do there. If you trade up first, it better be to that first pick. For instance, the Giants moving to 2 for Haskins only to watch the Jags move to 1 would be devastating. Cardinals should be looking to move out- they've got a lot of holes and they took their QB last year.

I like Haskins, but I’m not sure I agree with this.  Haskins has a great arm but he seems like a prototypical pocket passer.  Shurmur had success with Keenum by rolling and moving him out of the pocket. He even did it with Eli despite his limited athletic ability.  In an ideal world, Haskins is a bit more mobile. 

I think Daniel Jones is more Shurmurs style of quarterback 

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23 minutes ago, Forge said:

Problem is, that's pricy and while they can clear a lot of room with cuts, they are also losing a ton of snaps by making those cuts. So they are not in a good position cap wise, and in order to get that cap room, they have to cut several meaningful contributors from a win now constructed team

I had no idea about their cap situation. Honestly though, I think Arians gives Winston another shot. That seems to be the rumor/news from all the talking heads. I really think the duel for Haskins is between NYG and JAX. I think Arians gives it a go with Winston, at least for this year, and Kubiak tries to work with Keenum in Denver. The Raiders are a wild card with all the picks they have. They could do anything they want, and I don't know that it would surprise me. 

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1 minute ago, Gmen said:

I like Haskins, but I’m not sure I agree with this.  Haskins has a great arm but he seems like a prototypical pocket passer.  Shurmur had success with Keenum by rolling and moving him out of the pocket. He even did it with Eli despite his limited athletic ability.  In an ideal world, Haskins is a bit more mobile. 

I think Daniel Jones is more Shurmurs style of quarterback 

Haskins doesn't have Lamar Jackson/Josh Allen type athleticism, nor does he have Carson Wentz style toughness and mobility, but that isn't what Shurmur looks for. Haskins can definitely move around behind the line of scrimmage. He's definitely more mobile than Eli has ever been. Maybe not by much, but enough. Shurmur does utilize bootlegs and rollouts a decent amount, but I do feel they were used moreso this year because of our shaky OL. Same thing last year with Keenum and that OL in Minnesota.

What I mean by Haskins being Shurmur's type of QB are that he checks the 2 main boxes Shurmur looks for: accuracy and decisiveness. Lauletta is lacking in a lot of other areas, but we still took him because he checks those 2 boxes. 

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On 1/8/2019 at 10:24 AM, minutemancl said:

His press conference this year, especially regarding the QB situation, was so much different than the one last year. I'm willing to bet Eli gets a serious challenge this year, and it would make sense if it was from someone like Haskins. He fits the mold to a T of what Shurmur wants in his quarterbacks. The problem right now with moving up for him is there is a "who blinks first" situation between NYG, JAX, and potentially TB, depending on what Arians wants to do there. If you trade up first, it better be to that first pick. For instance, the Giants moving to 2 for Haskins only to watch the Jags move to 1 would be devastating. Cardinals should be looking to move out- they've got a lot of holes and they took their QB last year.

Tampa Bay's GM has already came out and said that Jameis Winston is going to be their QB in 2019, and that the new HC would have to be able to work with it.  That doesn't sound like a team whose interested in grabbing a QB in the first round.

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On 1/8/2019 at 10:34 AM, Broncofan said:

Really, to me, it comes down to NYG/JAX blinking first.   They have leverage over the other teams behind them, the gap between 5-6 and 10 & 13 & 15 (DEN, MIA, WAS) is just so great value-wise, they only have to match the rest of what that next tier offers to beat them.   Gettleman's shown if he wants Haskins, he will be unafraid to do what it takes to get him.  Normally, that would be 1.1, but in this case, with 3-4 teams all needing EDGE at the 2-5 spot and not looking for QB (only wildcard is OAK), 1.1 looks to be the Bosa bidding war, it's just a matter of how high after that you need to get Haskins - 2,3,4 or 5 (I don't see 1.6 getting it done, not with NYG, JAX & WAS all desperate for QB, and JAX/WAS with cap realities pushing them to address via draft, and yes, even us, but Keenum's situation complicates things for Elway to try and beat NYG/JAX, don't see it happening).

Agreed.  Giants and Jaguars clearly both need a QB, and both seem ready to take one.  Giants have to move over the Jagaurs to do so if they want Haskins, so they probably feel more pressure to make that move.  With the rumblings that the Jaguars are going to release Blake Bortles, are they really going to go into 2019 without a FRP at QB?  I suppose they could go out and sign someone like Teddy Bridgewater in FA on a 2-year deal and then pair him with someone like Daniel Jones if they miss out on Haskins.  But I think the Giants are the team most poised to move up.

I think the better question is who is going to be the team to move down?  I think at the very least, the Cardinals would need an Eli Manning-like package to even consider passing on Nick Bosa.  Don't think they'll get the same package the Rams gave up for Jared Goff given that the Rams picked at 15, and the Giants and Jaguars pick at 6 and 7 respectively.  I suppose a Wentz packgae (2019 1st, 2019 3rd, 2019 4th, 2020 1st, 2021 2nd) might be what they're angling for.  IF Bosa is off the board at 2, I could see San Francisco entertain a trade down, but to me the Jets at 3 are the most obvious trade down candidate.  They could trade down and select an offensive player to help support Sam Darnold, whether it be Jonah Williams or a WR.

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Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, CWood21 said:

Agreed.  Giants and Jaguars clearly both need a QB, and both seem ready to take one.  Giants have to move over the Jagaurs to do so if they want Haskins, so they probably feel more pressure to make that move.  With the rumblings that the Jaguars are going to release Blake Bortles, are they really going to go into 2019 without a FRP at QB?  I suppose they could go out and sign someone like Teddy Bridgewater in FA on a 2-year deal and then pair him with someone like Daniel Jones if they miss out on Haskins.  But I think the Giants are the team most poised to move up.

I think the better question is who is going to be the team to move down?  I think at the very least, the Cardinals would need an Eli Manning-like package to even consider passing on Nick Bosa.  Don't think they'll get the same package the Rams gave up for Jared Goff given that the Rams picked at 15, and the Giants and Jaguars pick at 6 and 7 respectively.  I suppose a Wentz packgae (2019 1st, 2019 3rd, 2019 4th, 2020 1st, 2021 2nd) might be what they're angling for.  IF Bosa is off the board at 2, I could see San Francisco entertain a trade down, but to me the Jets at 3 are the most obvious trade down candidate.  They could trade down and select an offensive player to help support Sam Darnold, whether it be Jonah Williams or a WR.

A really creative GM would entertain moving down 2x from 1.1 - with SF or NYJ for a really nice return on Bosa as both want EDGE so badly and Bosa is generational.  And then with the team willing to pay for Haskins.  The combined return could rival or surpass the Goff package.   Not alone but with 2 it’s do-able.  

BTW NYG is ahead of JAX at 6-7 but no way they can assume Haskins falling that far.   I don’t see him at 1.1 at all with so many teams in top 5 who desperately want EDGE and don’t need QB.  But after Bosa I think we’ll see someone move up to get past NYG at 1.6 and even OAK at 1.4 to get him.  You can’t feel safe unless you have 1.2 or 1.3 IMO.  Gettleman moving up would be to play defense and blocking a move up by JAX or another team.   Which I think is a given.  It’s more a matter of who that team is.   The Gmen just have pole position. And a GM unafraid to move up to secure “his guy”.

Edited by Broncofan

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3 minutes ago, Broncofan said:

A really creative GM would entertain moving down 2x from 1.1 - with SF or NYJ for a really nice return on Bosa as both want EDGE so badly and Bosa is generational.  And then with the team willing to pay for Haskins.  The combined return could rival or surpass the Goff package.   Not alone but with 2 it’s do-able.  

BTW NYG is ahead of JAX at 6-7 but no way they can assume Haskins falling that far.   I don’t see him at 1.1 at all with so many teams in top 5 who desperately want EDGE and don’t need QB.  But after Bosa I think we’ll see someone move up to get past NYG at 1.6 and even OAK at 1.4 to get him.  You can’t feel safe unless you have 1.2 or 1.3 IMO.  

In theory, that sounds like a great idea.  But the reality is that it's probably not feasible and certainly not realistic.  Going back from 2005, the only times we've seen a top 3 pick be traded down for a minimal trade down was RG3 in 2012, Trent Richardson in 2012 (4th, 5th, and 7th to move up from #4 to #3), and Mitch Trubisky in 2017 ('17 3rd, '17 4th, and '18 3rd to move from #3 to #2).  Best case scenario, that's the kind of deal that the Cardinals would get from San Francisco or Arizona, and even then I think that's unlikely given that we're not talking about a QB.  I suppose one of them could like Bosa that much, but that seems like a stretch.  But then the next question, is what does Arizona need to move down from 2/3 to 6/7?  And what are the Giants/Jaguars willing to give up?  At what point does it goes from quantity to quality in terms of picks?  IF I'm not getting at least a SRP out of Jacksonville/New York, it's not even a discussion.  I'm not moving down from Bosa for late Day 2 picks or all future picks.  The price to move from 6/7 to 3 should be exponentially cheaper than moving to 1.  I wouldn't even entertain a future FRP if I was New York or Jacksonville tbh.

Yeah, I goofed on that.  For some reason I was thinking the Jaguars picked ahead of the Giants.  Noticed that when I made my next post.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, CWood21 said:

In theory, that sounds like a great idea.  But the reality is that it's probably not feasible and certainly not realistic.  Going back from 2005, the only times we've seen a top 3 pick be traded down for a minimal trade down was RG3 in 2012, Trent Richardson in 2012 (4th, 5th, and 7th to move up from #4 to #3), and Mitch Trubisky in 2017 ('17 3rd, '17 4th, and '18 3rd to move from #3 to #2).  Best case scenario, that's the kind of deal that the Cardinals would get from San Francisco or Arizona, and even then I think that's unlikely given that we're not talking about a QB.  I suppose one of them could like Bosa that much, but that seems like a stretch.  But then the next question, is what does Arizona need to move down from 2/3 to 6/7?  And what are the Giants/Jaguars willing to give up?  At what point does it goes from quantity to quality in terms of picks?  IF I'm not getting at least a SRP out of Jacksonville/New York, it's not even a discussion.  I'm not moving down from Bosa for late Day 2 picks or all future picks.  The price to move from 6/7 to 3 should be exponentially cheaper than moving to 1.  I wouldn't even entertain a future FRP if I was New York or Jacksonville tbh.

Yeah, I goofed on that.  For some reason I was thinking the Jaguars picked ahead of the Giants.  Noticed that when I made my next post.

Yeah plus I’m not helping SF if I’m Keim unless I get a future 1st (even if it’s a 1st-for-2nd).  So it’s a case of how much SF wants Bosa since that and a Day 2 2019 pick is well above book value.   And then ARI still needs to swing deal 2.   So it takes a lot of really good advance planning and communication ahead of time.  

I forgot to say a really creative GM looks to that 2-deal scenario but most likely GM’s are too daunted by the risk a key step falls apart to explore it.  The 1st deal realistically has to happen before Draft night to make that scenario workable in real life ... so unlikely. 

Edited by Broncofan

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3 hours ago, Forge said:

Problem is, that's pricy and while they can clear a lot of room with cuts, they are also losing a ton of snaps by making those cuts. So they are not in a good position cap wise, and in order to get that cap room, they have to cut several meaningful contributors from a win now constructed team

Yeah.  That definitely plays potentially in favour of the Jaguars going after a guy like Haskins.  Or at least, someone in the draft.

The Jags cap situation isn't as dire as it may seem on the surface right now, but it's not good either.  There are going to be a couple cuts for sure, and there are a few more reasonably easy cuts and restructure options that should clear their room to sign a rookie class and a bit of wiggle room after that.  But the more they have to spend on a QB (in addition to Bortles dead money), the more pieces they're going to have to part with to make it fit...and thus, the more attractive a draftee looks.

Not to mention, how much more exciting a draftee looks to the fanbase, etc.  If that plays into things at all.

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