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Jaguars bench QB Bortles, starting Kessler week 13


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6 hours ago, SkippyX said:

I agree on the GM. He should be fired.

Here's another example:

Fournette was such an awful pick. He is even worse this year in every way (health, ypc, attitude)

There are 4 backs clearly better than Fournette drafted in 2017

  • McCaffery
  • Jones
  • Kamara
  • Conner

The jury is out on Hunt (pun intended)but he is clearly a better NFL player than Fournette.

Cohen may be better since the NFL has changed to a pass-happy league.

There were also 2 generational talents at QB in Mahomes and Watson that they passed up.

 

Marrone filled his underpants and ran off the field with 55 seconds and 2 timeouts left in the half of an AFCCG.

He has now coached this 2018 clown fire to 3-8.

He gets fired too.

 

 

As a Jaguars fan...i wouldn't take a single one of those backs over Fournette.

Yes, it's frustrating that he seems to be prone to getting dinged up and either missing time or playing at less than 100%.  But when he's healthy, he's an absolute difference-maker.  He does things that not one of those other guys can do.

People just want to keep looking at Fournette's results and compare them to other guys without any context at all.  Those other guys are all in far more specialized situations with massively better offensive supporting casts around them.  Leonard Fournette, when healthy...literally is the Jaguars offense.  He consistently faces 8 man boxes, heck...sometimes even see 9 man boxes where the other team basically just lines up and waits for us to hand the ball to Fournette.  And he still makes yards, behind a very mediocre at best OLine too.

That you'd even casually question whether a completely specialized niche player like Cohen is a better RB than Fournette just really shows you don't have a clue.

There are so many examples of Dave Caldwell's pathetic drafting to lean on.  Fournette is about the last thing i'd point at, next to Jalen (which was pretty much a no-brainer pick by most accounts).  Caldwell has screwed up pretty much all the rest of his many top draft picks, and hasn't really saved himself with particularly good later round drafting or anything either...but i wouldn't put Fournette in that category.  Other than the health issues, he's been pretty much everything he was drafted to be (and a better jumper and receiver than he was touted as to boot).

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10 hours ago, Tugboat said:

As a Jaguars fan...i wouldn't take a single one of those backs over Fournette.

 

I'd certainly take C-Mac over him. You mention that he can do things no other can, well, I disagree that other powerful backs can't do what he can, but besides that point - no back is doing anything even close to what McCaffery is. Imagine the pressure he'd take off Blake? He gave Cam nearly 300 yards of offense last week. Blake would love him in there.

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11 hours ago, Tugboat said:

As a Jaguars fan...i wouldn't take a single one of those backs over Fournette.

Yes, it's frustrating that he seems to be prone to getting dinged up and either missing time or playing at less than 100%.  But when he's healthy, he's an absolute difference-maker.  He does things that not one of those other guys can do.

People just want to keep looking at Fournette's results and compare them to other guys without any context at all.  Those other guys are all in far more specialized situations with massively better offensive supporting casts around them.  Leonard Fournette, when healthy...literally is the Jaguars offense.  He consistently faces 8 man boxes, heck...sometimes even see 9 man boxes where the other team basically just lines up and waits for us to hand the ball to Fournette.  And he still makes yards, behind a very mediocre at best OLine too.

That you'd even casually question whether a completely specialized niche player like Cohen is a better RB than Fournette just really shows you don't have a clue.

There are so many examples of Dave Caldwell's pathetic drafting to lean on.  Fournette is about the last thing i'd point at, next to Jalen (which was pretty much a no-brainer pick by most accounts).  Caldwell has screwed up pretty much all the rest of his many top draft picks, and hasn't really saved himself with particularly good later round drafting or anything either...but i wouldn't put Fournette in that category.  Other than the health issues, he's been pretty much everything he was drafted to be (and a better jumper and receiver than he was touted as to boot).

You can't possibly say all this without factoring in his health. He's had injuries lingering from his college days, it was a valid concern and he's proven that it continues to be a problem in the NFL.

Doesn't matter if he's the offense if he doesn't play like those other backs do from a reliability standpoint

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7 hours ago, SteelKing728 said:

Would you rather have Cody Kessler, Deshone Kizer or Kevin Hogan?

 

(Sigh!) We-e-ellllll, they're all fine quartrerbacks, BUT, staunch Jaguars fan that I am, I shall always hold out hope, that, one day,

CHRISTIAN HACKENBERRRRRRRGGGG will take the helm in Jacksonville, and lead this forlorn franchise from many years of wandering about the swamps to  holding aloft The Lombardi Trophy, symbol of having won the Super Bowl!!!!!!!!

"Gosh, Folks- it was a toadle team effort on everybody's part!"

Image result for christian hackenberg

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24 minutes ago, Hunter2_1 said:

You mention that he can do things no other can, well, I disagree that other powerful backs can't do what he can

There really aren’t any current power backs that bring the violence Fournette does without sacrificing a ton of speed. 

Gurley and Zeke are probably similar comps strictly in the violence + speed categories, but I think Fournette’s top end beats both and he’s also the more purely physical runner. Even then - they’re elite running backs, not some JAGs.

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10 minutes ago, Yin-Yang said:

There really aren’t any current power backs that bring the violence Fournette does without sacrificing a ton of speed. 

Gurley and Zeke are probably similar comps strictly in the violence + speed categories, but I think Fournette’s top end beats both and he’s also the more purely physical runner. Even then - they’re elite running backs, not some JAGs.

OK. I'd still rather CMC if I'm a Jag fan.

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On ‎12‎/‎2‎/‎2018 at 12:22 PM, Hunter2_1 said:

OK. I'd still rather CMC if I'm a Jag fan.

Yeah, it's not close. Kamara is significantly better too. Healthy, dynamic, and elite receiving skills.

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1 hour ago, Oregon Ducks said:

Kamara >> CMC

 

CMC wasn't a great pick.

I love Kamara and haven't really seen enough of McCaffrey to say which is better but statistically it is McCaffrey this year. More rushing yards, .7 more per carry. McCaffrey has 8 more targets and 15 more catches for 100+ more yards, Kamara averages .2 more per reception. Kamara's only real statistical advantage is 15 TD to 11.

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On 02/12/2018 at 10:49 AM, Hunter2_1 said:

I'd certainly take C-Mac over him. You mention that he can do things no other can, well, I disagree that other powerful backs can't do what he can, but besides that point - no back is doing anything even close to what McCaffery is. Imagine the pressure he'd take off Blake? He gave Cam nearly 300 yards of offense last week. Blake would love him in there.

The thing is, McCaffrey wouldn't do as much to take pressure off a guy like Bortles, because even that part of the passing game is a struggle.  So you'd be neutralizing a big part of his game.  In that situation, it'd also be a lot harder to get that sort of guy a variety of touches, get him the ball outside and in space.  The middle where Fournette is money, far more so than McCaffrey...is consistently loaded up because teams don't respect Bortles like they do Cam (as a passer or a runner).  That's the sort of thing where a back like Fournette can, and was the focal point of an offense that stunk it's way all the way to an AFC Championship game.  With McCaffrey...Cam is the focal point, and it's not even a question.

I wouldn't take McCaffrey over Fournette.  

 

On 02/12/2018 at 11:07 AM, RuskieTitan said:

You can't possibly say all this without factoring in his health. He's had injuries lingering from his college days, it was a valid concern and he's proven that it continues to be a problem in the NFL.

Doesn't matter if he's the offense if he doesn't play like those other backs do from a reliability standpoint

The health is certainly an issue.  Health with RBs can be all over the place though.  It certainly appears as though it's more of a concern with Fournette...but any one of those other guys could have a hamstring issue or something that keeps them out for 6 weeks at any moment really.  I mean, look at Hunt who seemed like a good durable back...but his availability/reliability has turned out to be pretty darn poor too.  He's not doing anyone any good, even without a nagging soft tissue injury.  Stuff happens.  And really...i haven't heard anything at all about Fournette's ankle stuff (that was the issue in college).  It's hard to hang a "bust" tag on a pick that's been pretty phenomenal when on the field, after less than 2 years.

Certainly hard to call a bust of a pick compared to the actual legitimate busts Caldwell has picked.  Guys who aren't on the team anymore, and some of whom didn't even make it to the end of rookie deals with the team.

 

7 hours ago, Bullet Club said:

Yeah, it's not close. Kamara is significantly better too. Healthy, dynamic, and elite receiving skills.

Kamara is the same problem as McCaffrey in the Jaguars situation.  He's not a focal point.  Drew Brees is a HOF QB focal point, and Kamara is a terrific weapon in support of that...when tag-teaming with an actual power back in Engram who also does yeoman's work with a lot of the ugly stuff, to allow Kamara to really thrive.

 

I don't think a lot of people seem to grasp just how extensively it's meant when Jaguars fans suggest that Bortles practically is the Jaguars entire offense when healthy.  It's like when people mention that McCaffrey is always on the field this year.  They both sound like totally exaggerated claims, but they're both equally true.

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