Packers fire Head Coach Mike McCarthy; Joe Philbin named interim HC

[SBLIII]

11 hours ago, SwoleXmad said:

https://www.ign.com/boards/threads/aaron-rodgers-is-a-punk.196747940/

Aaron Rodgers has been a punk for a decade, who cares?

Dude with a 21 TD to 1 INT ratio is declining. Okay, I guess Brady should retire then.

regardless. GB should score a ton more than they do. 21/1 looks awesome because he throws the ball away. Rodgers is flat out missing throws though, just seen yesterday. His contract is massive and he has to play better regardless of his ratio. Rodgers is 35 not 40, he should do better.

[Spartacus]

I'm hoping a reset of the offense and next year will get Rodgers at least back to a very good level. Lets be real, how much evidence do we have of him throwing accurate balls? Its obvious that his mechanics have gone down hill and i'm sure he recognizes it but a week between games just isn't enough time to fix a mechanics issue. He has slumped but I don't see much physical decline as of yet. 

The hyperbole in this thread is cringe worthy. I'm not saying he will get better either. This may be the new Aaron Rodgers but till I see at least a couple seasons of this i'm not convinced it can't be turned around. 

[Broncofan]

A lot of this was brought up in the first thread, so as a reference (not that it can't be brought up again, but in case ppl really want to see the whole discussion)...

 

Either way, 4 common themes came up:

1.  Few if anyone would dispute that McCarthy is a great QB developer, and he seems to scheme and prepare well pre-game.  

2.  DVOA-wise, Green Bay's O is consistently one of the best O's around, even now.

3.  Green Bay also has underperformed DVOA in actual results - the Q is why.  Is it coaching?  Is it something less tangible?  That's where the debate really splits up.

4.  Regardless of how ppl feel about #3, if the relationship between ARod and McCarthy is an issue, well then that's the final nail in the coffin.

I would repeat a point @incognito_man brought up in that thread - no matter what happens now, in 2019 the Packers O should improve no matter what - simply because their WR corps, with 2 rookies playing significant snaps (and Kumerow joining that group), should automatically have been better chemistry.  Now, things like injuries or worse OL play can happen, but we shouldn't attribute all the 2019 improvement to MM's departure.   That's a very fair point to keep in mind for the future.

Having said that, I can't shake the feeling that they will improve with a change beyond just 2nd year player bumps, barring serious injuries.   They will feel it most when it's time to develop ARod's successor, though.   That's where McCarthy really will be missed.  

(Side note - was there a good reason why Aaron Jones split snaps this past week?  I heard it was suspension / getting the playbook down early in season, and I can see at least the reasoning, but those reasons don't fly for yesterday, where it was literally a 50-50 split).

[Spartacus]

1 minute ago, Broncofan said:

Side note - was there a good reason why Aaron Jones split snaps this past week? 

This has been an issue with McCarthy since Jones and Williams entered the league. He loves playing two guys and when Montgomery was here it was three. Jones is clearly the most talented RB and could have special potential if he got 20 carries a game. 

[Broncofan]

10 minutes ago, Spartacus said:

This has been an issue with McCarthy since Jones and Williams entered the league. He loves playing two guys and when Montgomery was here it was three. Jones is clearly the most talented RB and could have special potential if he got 20 carries a game. 

Yeah, I could see the reasoning in September for the first 2 games back..and then maybe October.  But after the SEA game, it should have been Aaron Jones all day, except when he needed a rest.  Frankly,  Williams isn't even that good as a pass catcher, not a whole lot better than Jones, and frankly, the pass protection was a lot better last year, but this year, Williams missed several assignments that I saw, so it's not like he was this lock-down pass catching/blocking talent.   After the SEA game, Jones actually showed well in all facets of that game.  To see him timeshare yesterday was baffling to say the least...

[St Vince]

13 hours ago, Uncle Buck said:

Did you see the game today against the Cardinals?

I'f Rodgers mysteriously returns to All-Pro form and throws for 400 yards and four touchdowns next week I will lose all respect for him.

[Pugger]

9 hours ago, PapaShogun said:

No one is criticizing Ted Thompson in all of this. But why?

There are a few of us.   The present state of the team should be laid at the feet of Thompson.  His last few drafts left a lot to be desired and he was allergic to FA.

[incognito_man]

52 minutes ago, Broncofan said:

Side note - was there a good reason why Aaron Jones split snaps this past week?  I heard it was suspension / getting the playbook down early in season, and I can see at least the reasoning, but those reasons don't fly for yesterday, where it was literally a 50-50 split

I think his slight frame and injury history made MM cautious about overusing him. He's had an ankle dislocated, 2 MCLs and a hammy the last 3 years. Plus he's like 5' 9" and like 195 right now too.

He's not built to be a feature back.

[minutemancl]

2 minutes ago, incognito_man said:

I think his slight frame and injury history made MM cautious about overusing him. He's had an ankle dislocated, 2 MCLs and a hammy the last 3 years. Plus he's like 5' 9" and like 195 right now too.

He's not built to be a feature back.

I never noticed this until yesterday, but his calves/ankles are incredibly skinny.

[Pugger]

7 hours ago, Uncle Buck said:

I am of the opinion that the higher percentage play would have been to keep McCarthy and hope he and Rodgers can get things turned around as the new GM continues to rebuild a depleted roster.  At the same time, I can also see why they may have thought it was just time to make a change.

As far as Rodgers being part of the problem, I was thinking back to how he looked at his peak, which I believe was in 2011.  The thing that I remember the most about the way he played back then was how easy he made everything look.  Now, seven years later, he is a player who is capable of making a throw here and there that is absolute magic.  A throw that practically no other QB could make.  The difference is that it seems like he has to work a lot harder to do that.  He seems to be trying so hard to create something magical that he has forgotten what really made him great when he was at his best. 

It's kind of like a kid on a playground playing basketball.  When the kid tries to make the same moves Michael Jordan made, it's impossible for him and he just messes up.  If the kid would just stay within himself and do what he can do, he would be a more productive player.  Instead of driving the lane and jumping up through three defenders for the "double pump, 360-degree slam dunk, maybe he would score more points if he would just take the 10-foot bank shot off the board.  Aaron Rodgers is the highest paid player in the history of the game.  He is constantly hearing from people in the media that he is the "most talented player ever to play the position".  Could it be that Aaron Rodgers is putting so much pressure on himself to be "the GOAT" that he is no longer playing within himself?  Is he instead trying to live up to an image he has in his mind that no one could ever live up to?

To be fair, the weapons he has now are nowhere near what he had in 2011.  Back then they had Donald Driver, Greg Jennings, and Jordy Nelson were considerably better than the promising, but still young and inexperienced receiver corps he is working with today.  It seems like Rodgers knows his weapons are not up to par and this is making him feel like he needs to take it all on his shoulders for the team to succeed.  I think if he could be more like he was back in 2011, and go back to basics with everything from his throwing mechanics, to his identifying the easier plays when they are available, he would more success.  Maybe if he takes a little pressure off of himself he could be like the kid on the playground who could do better with a consistent stream of 10-foot jump shots.

The Vikings played the Packers last week and this week we went into Foxboro to play the Patriots.  It was interesting to watch the game against the Patriots because Tom Brady didn't do anything spectacular in the game.  What he did do was consistently take what a very good defense would give him.  He didn't have any all-world throws.  He just worked his gameplan and looked like a player who was under far less pressure than Aaron Rodgers did the week before.  He was consistently good.  Aaron was inconsistently great.  Brady beat us.  We beat Rodgers.  

Coming out of the game with the Packers, I felt like the Vikings were a better team.  After this week's game, I didn't really get a feeling that the Patriots were all that much better than the Vikings.  What I did notice was that the Patriots were just more consistent.  They just kept doing what they came into the game to do, which was not to create fireworks, but merely to follow their game plan, play after play until the end of the game without making a lot of mistakes.  They did that, and consequently, they won the game. 

I'm not trying to take any shots at the Packers here.  Just giving my observations of the two teams which we played in consecutive weeks.

Yes, there isn't a lot separating most of the teams in this league.  The team that makes the most plays and the fewest mistakes is the one that wins.  Perhaps the schemes McCarthy was using was making it harder than it had to be for the offense to work?  It seemed like every inch we got was like pulling teeth.  It has been maddening to watch as a fan.  I feel bad for McCarthy.  Nobody likes to see a guy get canned but things were getting worse every week so keeping him for the last 4 games wasn't going to do any one any favors.

[Pugger]

1 hour ago, Spartacus said:

I'm hoping a reset of the offense and next year will get Rodgers at least back to a very good level. Lets be real, how much evidence do we have of him throwing accurate balls? Its obvious that his mechanics have gone down hill and i'm sure he recognizes it but a week between games just isn't enough time to fix a mechanics issue. He has slumped but I don't see much physical decline as of yet. 

The hyperbole in this thread is cringe worthy. I'm not saying he will get better either. This may be the new Aaron Rodgers but till I see at least a couple seasons of this i'm not convinced it can't be turned around. 

Yes, we still see glimpses of his old elite play here and there.  His accuracy is off on a lot of his throws this year.  Perhaps he'll have reinvent himself because his throwing motion may be different now after those plates and screws were inserted in this collarbone?  

[Pugger]

50 minutes ago, Broncofan said:

Yeah, I could see the reasoning in September for the first 2 games back..and then maybe October.  But after the SEA game, it should have been Aaron Jones all day, except when he needed a rest.  Frankly,  Williams isn't even that good as a pass catcher, not a whole lot better than Jones, and frankly, the pass protection was a lot better last year, but this year, Williams missed several assignments that I saw, so it's not like he was this lock-down pass catching/blocking talent.   After the SEA game, Jones actually showed well in all facets of that game.  To see him timeshare yesterday was baffling to say the least...

This has been a real issue for a lot of us.  Jones is clearly the best RB on the roster but for some reason McCarthy would sit him for long stretches while Williams would struggle to get more than 3 yards a carry.  For a while during yesterday's game I wondered if Jones got hurt.  Yes, give Jones a rest here and there but don't let him sit out entire series while his understudy can't get going.

[incognito_man]

13 minutes ago, minutemancl said:

I never noticed this until yesterday, but his calves/ankles are incredibly skinny.

Yes they are. He's a slender guy in the lower legs. Explosive af, but thin.

[Fl0nkerton]

lol the usual suspects are in the running for haters of the year in this thread.

[KFP7]

8 hours ago, Uncle Buck said:

I am of the opinion that the higher percentage play would have been to keep McCarthy and hope he and Rodgers can get things turned around as the new GM continues to rebuild a depleted roster.  At the same time, I can also see why they may have thought it was just time to make a change.

As far as Rodgers being part of the problem, I was thinking back to how he looked at his peak, which I believe was in 2011.  The thing that I remember the most about the way he played back then was how easy he made everything look.  Now, seven years later, he is a player who is capable of making a throw here and there that is absolute magic.  A throw that practically no other QB could make.  The difference is that it seems like he has to work a lot harder to do that.  He seems to be trying so hard to create something magical that he has forgotten what really made him great when he was at his best. 

It's kind of like a kid on a playground playing basketball.  When the kid tries to make the same moves Michael Jordan made, it's impossible for him and he just messes up.  If the kid would just stay within himself and do what he can do, he would be a more productive player.  Instead of driving the lane and jumping up through three defenders for the "double pump, 360-degree slam dunk, maybe he would score more points if he would just take the 10-foot bank shot off the board.  Aaron Rodgers is the highest paid player in the history of the game.  He is constantly hearing from people in the media that he is the "most talented player ever to play the position".  Could it be that Aaron Rodgers is putting so much pressure on himself to be "the GOAT" that he is no longer playing within himself?  Is he instead trying to live up to an image he has in his mind that no one could ever live up to?

To be fair, the weapons he has now are nowhere near what he had in 2011.  Back then they had Donald Driver, Greg Jennings, and Jordy Nelson were considerably better than the promising, but still young and inexperienced receiver corps he is working with today.  It seems like Rodgers knows his weapons are not up to par and this is making him feel like he needs to take it all on his shoulders for the team to succeed.  I think if he could be more like he was back in 2011, and go back to basics with everything from his throwing mechanics, to his identifying the easier plays when they are available, he would more success.  Maybe if he takes a little pressure off of himself he could be like the kid on the playground who could do better with a consistent stream of 10-foot jump shots.

The Vikings played the Packers last week and this week we went into Foxboro to play the Patriots.  It was interesting to watch the game against the Patriots because Tom Brady didn't do anything spectacular in the game.  What he did do was consistently take what a very good defense would give him.  He didn't have any all-world throws.  He just worked his gameplan and looked like a player who was under far less pressure than Aaron Rodgers did the week before.  He was consistently good.  Aaron was inconsistently great.  Brady beat us.  We beat Rodgers.  

Coming out of the game with the Packers, I felt like the Vikings were a better team.  After this week's game, I didn't really get a feeling that the Patriots were all that much better than the Vikings.  What I did notice was that the Patriots were just more consistent.  They just kept doing what they came into the game to do, which was not to create fireworks, but merely to follow their game plan, play after play until the end of the game without making a lot of mistakes.  They did that, and consequently, they won the game. 

I'm not trying to take any shots at the Packers here.  Just giving my observations of the two teams which we played in consecutive weeks.

You got Driver, Jennings, and Jordy but forgot Finley (the last TE to really be utilized by the Pack) James Jones, and a rookie Cobb as the 5th WR.  Then you had Starks and Kuhn in the backfield with a good OL.  That offense wasn't so good just cause of Rodgers....We had Jones as our 5th receiving option. I think he put up 14 TD's a few years later.  Rodgers has looked great with far worse though so time will tell.