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Countstuku

Should Zimmer be on the hot seat? And is Spielman gone?

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It is easy to be considered a soft football team when you cannot run the ball.  They were 7th in rushing last year and the only major difference was Easton and Berger not being in there this year.  Elflein has disappointed this season I must say but it is odd why they cannot run the ball.  But with the new QB and how much money they gave him I guess they feel they should get their moneys worth there.

 

I would say the O-Coordinator and Special teams Coordinator are guys who should be possibly let go, especially the Special teams coordinator, he clearly does not know how to handle the mental side of being a kicker.  The defense has been the biggest disappointment to me, they are loaded with almost everyone back and more talent added, but injuries have hurt them sure as well as the lack of a pass rush opposite Hunter.  And Kendricks has had a so so year and same could be said for a lot of guys.  Watching the Ravens today, wish we had a D like that, innovative and physical, sure they gave up yards but they at least were creative enough to cause problems and were still in the game despite not having a ton of offense punch with the rookie QB in.   They have talent at all levels and a nice combo of youth and veteran leadership, sadly the Vikings D is getting pretty old quickly without a ton of new playmakers especially at LB.

 

Does Zimmer deserve to be fired, no, and neither does Spielman.  Yeah the season has been a disappointment when everyone assumed it was Super Bowl or bust because of what we had last year.  But like I said earlier in the year that defense is an issue and clearly has been the case, the NFL has figured it out to some degree and if you take away a dominating D from this team they are not good enough on offense to win games.   They just give up too many points, 14th in the NFL in points given up per game with 22.5, last year were 1st with only 15.6 a game.  They need to get back to running the ball, being physical on offense and controlling the clock to some degree, but that will not happen with Cousins as the QB or your current O-Coordinator either.  

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Zimmer picked the OC....

If they don't make the playoffs, how do you keep them? What have they achieved, other than going all in this year, and so far failing?

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So, something doesn’t go as planned 1 year into a 3 year plan and your solution is to scrap the whole thing?

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3 minutes ago, SemperFeist said:

So, something doesn’t go as planned 1 year into a 3 year plan and your solution is to scrap the whole thing?

This isn't their first year together. Were they not trying before? I think they were. What have they achieved? If they miss the playoffs, do you keep them?

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4 minutes ago, PrplChilPill said:

 If they miss the playoffs, do you keep them?

Pretty easy yes for me. 

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41 minutes ago, PrplChilPill said:

Zimmer picked the OC....

If they don't make the playoffs, how do you keep them? What have they achieved, other than going all in this year, and so far failing?

Hindsight is great isn't it

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8 minutes ago, PrplChilPill said:

This isn't their first year together.

This isn’t DeFilippo’s first year in Minnesota? This isn’t Cousins’ first year in Minnesota? This isn’t Cousins and DeFilippo’s first year together? This isn’t Zimmer’s first year with either DeFilippo, or Cousins? 

 

10 minutes ago, PrplChilPill said:

What have they achieved?

Two division titles and an NFCCG appearance in the first 4 years, and so far a winning record and unfinished story in year five. There are a lot of teams and a lot of coaches that would like to have achieved as much. 

 

12 minutes ago, PrplChilPill said:

If they miss the playoffs, do you keep them?

Spielman? Yes. Zimmer? Yes. DeFilippo? No. Which, I’ve already stated is due to my belief that keeping DeFilippo for another year isn’t worth losing a coach like Stefanski. 

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15 hours ago, Countstuku said:

Firstly let’s start with slick rick. He’s constantly ignored the oline over the past 4 or 5 years. Trying to bring in rejects from other teams and then chucking them after a season. The problem is if your dline is bad your secondary can compensate to an extent. If your oline is bad your Rb or receivers may never get a chance to make an impact. He paid so much for a QB but gave him nothing to protect him with. There have been some great D picks, but first rounders in particular have been hit and miss. My opinion is he should be gone, but sadly won’t be.

Then there’s Zimmer. He seems to only want to draft D and the team seems to be soft at some times. The bills loss was shocking and the championship game was awful, as was the second half v the saints. IMO he doesn’t seem to install fight on the team. Even the D seems to erratic at times. Do you think the Vikings could win an SB with him? I think no. But could another coach do a better job? Maybe. I think he’s definitely safe, but the franchise has a ceiling with him as coach. Winning seasons but a soft team when it counts.

Am I right?

I think you are right on most accounts. 

Spielman is an above average GM.  He has assembled one of the more talented rosters in the league the last few years, but has mishandled the offensive line and has not shown to be a good evaluator of offensive draft talent. 

Zimmer is an above average HC and a good, but not great DC   He is the type who can take average talent and make them above average, but underachieves with good/great talent  

in an offensive league, it can be a disadvantage to have a defensive HC  Any good OC will soon be a HC leaving the offense in a perpetual state of turnover  

The question with Zimmer is if he is a good enough coach to win a super bowl?  If not, what is the point of keeping him?  Same for Spielman

I have my doubts, but would give Zimmer a year to show he can consistently get his team up to play with the better teams in the league and do more with the huge investments we have made on D  

 

Edited by Snake Plissken

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Both zimmer and Spielman are above average IMO. Spielman has some draft blunders(so does everyone), but we have a lot of late-mid round success as well. Hunter, Griffen, Harris/Sendejo, Holton Hill, Weatherly, Thielen, Diggs have all played a role this year. Defense is banged up, yet still in the top 5 despite Rhodes, Griffen, Robinson, Waynes, Alexander, Sendejo, and Barr being hurt off and on this year. 

 

We really really need to focus on O-line in the off-season. 2 new guards. Possibly another tight end.

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I love threads like these that are created after losses, since all they do is stoke negativity.  The discussion about whether either should be on the hot seat is rather ridiculous, as I believe I've made evident in other threads.  Zimmer has a near .600 winning percentage.  If he is even considered to be fired, then this franchise doesn't even deserve to ever win a Super Bowl.  Spielman clearly isn't infallible, but he is, arguably, the best GM/organization head they've had since Finks...Denny included (if you so wish to include him in that list).  If Zimmer fails, then you fire both of them at the same time.  But, until that thread has run out, you keep them both.  

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14 hours ago, PrplChilPill said:

Zimmer picked the OC....

If they don't make the playoffs, how do you keep them? What have they achieved, other than going all in this year, and so far failing?

Zimmer took a 5 win and turned it into an NFC championship caliber team within 4 years.  I'm not sure why that would be overlooked.  Rick Spielman has been here longer and has a more debatable track record, I think he could go.

Edited by Worm Guts

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While Spielman has been here longer, I think looking at his resume before Zimmer got here is a bit foolish. 

We know that Spielman and Zimmer work very well together, and we know that Spielman and Zimmer seem to be on the same page in terms of what types of players to add to the roster. You don’t just cut the cord on that.

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Cousins is tied in with Spielman who is tied in with Zimmer.

If the desired result (Super Bowl) doesn't happen within the time frame of Kirk's contract, I think Spielman is out which may lead to a new GM wanting his coaching staff brought in. 

Zimmer needs to find consistency within this team. 2014....missed playoffs. 2015.....win the division. 2016....missed the playoffs (after a 5-0 start). 2017....playoffs. 2018.....it's not unrealistic that we miss the playoffs. We have waaaayyyyyy too much talent to only be in the playoffs every other year.

So unless the team dives hard in 2019, I think Spielman & Zimmer are here as long as Kirk is (2020).

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I'm thinking this would be better:

Chilly as GM
McCarthy as Head Coach

Championship.

Well we're at it, let's bring back Red as Owner.

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24 minutes ago, The Gnat said:

I'm thinking this would be better:

Chilly as GM
McCarthy as Head Coach

Championship.

Well we're at it, let's bring back Red as Owner.

Dungy as HC, Bevell as OC, and Frazier as DC.  Super Bowl, here we come!

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