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Should Zimmer be on the hot seat? And is Spielman gone?

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13 minutes ago, swede700 said:

Both of the coaches you referenced spent 13+ years with the franchise.  Sometimes, coaches just run out their course and it was clear at the time that they needed to move on.  Zimmer is nowhere near that at this point.

Right, but that is not what you have been saying.  You keep saying again and again "an organization that would consider firing a HC with a near .600 winning percentage does not deserve to win a super bowl".

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5 minutes ago, Snake Plissken said:

Right, but that is not what you have been saying.  You keep saying again and again "an organization that would consider firing a HC with a near .600 winning percentage does not deserve to win a super bowl".

I understand that I might not have been clear, but there certainly is an exception made in those cases where someone has been in one place for a very long time.  Zimmer is almost a young pup compared to them in being in one place.  I may be in a different place 3-4 years from now, but any talk of him being on the hot seat right now is and should be rather ridiculous.  

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I almost feel like this discussion has been egged on by guys like Florio, who have suggested that he should be on the hot seat.  It's almost like the Pied Piper trying to lead us into some trance to go somewhere where we really shouldn't be going.

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28 minutes ago, swede700 said:

I understand that I might not have been clear, but there certainly is an exception made in those cases where someone has been in one place for a very long time.  Zimmer is almost a young pup compared to them in being in one place.  I may be in a different place 3-4 years from now, but any talk of him being on the hot seat right now is and should be rather ridiculous.  

Thanks for clarifying.  I guess I disagree with your time frame.  Zimmer is on his 6th or 7th year (?).  He is certainly shown he can take a poor team and make it better, but hasn't yet shown imo that he is a super bowl caliber coach.  The performance this year raises some questions that are worthy of consideration.  I wouldn't say he is on the hot seat either, but next season he has something to prove.

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This is only his 5th year.  Denny got away with a lot more mediocrity in his first 5 years than we've seen from Zimmer..and with less drama (the drama from him came later) and less obstacles.

Edited by swede700

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1 hour ago, milanb said:

I would agree with you, except for the fact that there are just too many things about Zimmer and this team that don't inspire a lot of confidence.

Twice in 3 years he has had to replace the OC during the regular season. This time there are only three games left and the team still has a chance at the playoffs. And this time he had publicly shamed and blamed DeFilippo at least twice prior to the firing. Which should never happen.

Beyond all that there are too many games where the team just doesn't show up to play. When it's just one or two players it is on them, but when it's the entire team (like in the NFC Championship game last year) it falls on the coach.

While I won't dispute the particular issues, I wouldn't use them as reasons to replace the coach at this point.  I think his overall contribution to the defense is worth a lot and I'm willing to look for ways we can stabilize the offense at least for another season.

Really I look for Spielman accountability first because: 1. He's been here twice as long and 2. QB issues are on him.

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42 minutes ago, swede700 said:

This is only his 5th year.  Denny got away with a lot more mediocrity in his first 5 years than we've seen from Zimmer..and with less drama (the drama from him came later) and less obstacles.

I think Denny made the playoffs his first 5 seasons.

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5 minutes ago, Worm Guts said:

I think Denny made the playoffs his first 5 seasons.

First three. However, I would still consider 8-8/9-7 mediocre, and 4/6 of Green’s first six years held those records. 

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1 hour ago, Snake Plissken said:

How many of Denny Green's assistant coaches went on to become Super Bowl winning head coaches?

The answer is two!  Brian Billick and Tony Dungy.  To be fair, Brad Childress has one assistant that became a Super Bowl winning head coach (Mike Tomlin), plus another that won a ring as an offensive coordinator for the Seahawks.

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5 minutes ago, Virginia Viking said:

The answer is two!  Brian Billick and Tony Dungy.  To be fair, Brad Childress has one assistant that became a Super Bowl winning head coach (Mike Tomlin), plus another that won a ring as an offensive coordinator for the Seahawks.

And really, that's not relevant anyway.  How many of Bill Belichick's assistant coaches won rings as HCs elsewhere?

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29 minutes ago, swede700 said:

And really, that's not relevant anyway.  How many of Bill Belichick's assistant coaches won rings as HCs elsewhere?

And the answer is....none, nada, zip, zero!

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I'll preface this by saying, I've read none of the post proceeding this one, but no neither should be let go.

Zimmer is one of the best in the league, that shouldn't be debated and yet it is for some silly reason.

There is more credence to moving on from Spielman, but imo this team has a three year window right now with Cousins and the roster Rick has built and i would see that window through before making wholesale moves.  I could be convinced otherwise but.....

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Zimmer needs to become a better “head” coach. His defensive acumen is as impressive as it gets, but he’s week to week head coaching duties and management on game day can leave a lot to be desired. Clock management, use of challenges, aggressiveness (or lackthereof) at the end of a half...

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17 hours ago, swede700 said:

And really, that's not relevant anyway.  How many of Bill Belichick's assistant coaches won rings as HCs elsewhere?

It is relevant. But perhaps you don't want to consider anything that doesn't fit your narrow narrative.  We are in a topic talking about the long-term future of the Vikings Head Coach.  YOU were the one who compared Zimmer to Denny Green.  Green was a long tenured Viking coach who failed to win a Super Bowl with the most talented team in the league.  It was about the same period in Green's coaching career that Tony Dungy left Minnesota to go to Tampa Bay where he eventually won a Super Bowl.  it was not long after that Brian Billick also left Minnesota to go to Baltimore where he also won a Super Bowl.  I personally remember one of my college teammates was adamant that we should have kept Dungy over Green.  It is easy to look back with hindsight, but there are certainly some similarities that are interesting with regards to replacing a coach who is successful.

And since you are comparing Green to Belicheck:  Super Bowls as HC -  Green=0,  Belichick =5.   

 

 

 

 

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