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The greatness of Saquon Barkley


Gmen

Did you know Saquon Barkley is the best running back in the league?  

45 members have voted

  1. 1. Did you know Saquon Barkley is the best running back in the league?

    • Yes, that is pretty obvious
      37
    • No, but I know now
      8


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I was annoyed at him being crownd before playing a snap and i haaaaate crowning young players. Like Mahomes, no way im crowning him yet. But Barkley, damn none of that is system based, situational success, supporting cast or coaching. Its just flat out ability. Crazy to say, but best in the league. 

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On 12/14/2018 at 6:09 PM, VanS said:

I said before the draft that he was the best RB I'd ever seen in my life.  FTR I've been watching football regularly since 1999-2000.

And he's done nothing as a rookie to change my mind.  He's not only the best RB in the league but arguably a top 2 player in the league overall (along with Aaron Donald).

Its ridiculous what he's doing behind that o-line and with Eli Manning as his QB.  He's definitely exceeded my expectations for him as a rookie given what he has surrounding him. 

 

 

To be fair you said a lot of things befoe the season started like the Packers were sure to have the best record, we were sleeping on the Raiders, and that Myles Garrett was sure to be DPOY. 

Barkley's really good but he's not even the best back in the league this year. Gurley is miles ahead of him and Zeke is probably a tier ahead of him. Gurley is ahead of him in yards, yards per game, and TD's. He's not close to a top 2 player in the league.  

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On 12/15/2018 at 4:13 AM, candyman93 said:

It’s only a mistake if Darnold, Rosen, Allen, and Jackson turn into franchise QBs. They couldn’t draft Baker and Cleveland sure as hell wasn't going to let them have him.

It's also a mistake if they turn out to be capable and the Giants can't find a QB the next few years. Lets be very clear, the Giants have talent, there QB play has sucked and that has been a major difference. I'd argue if they had anything resembling competent QB play they'd be in the playoff hunt in their division this year

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On 12/15/2018 at 7:36 AM, ET80 said:

For those saying it's a bad pick - was Tomlinson a bad pick for the Chargers when they took him at 5? Remember, they had the #1 pick - and Michael Vick for the taking - but the Chargers opted to move down from the franchise QB and pick up the RB. 

Serious question, let's talk this out. Vick was viewed as arguably the most dangerous weapon to ever come our as QB, very much a "franchise" QB in 2001. Were the Chargers incorrect in not selecting Vick and selecting Tomlinson instead?

Not really because Vick as much of a highlight reel as he was, was not viewed as a traditional QB and there were concerns over whether he'd translate in the NFL. Darnold was viewed as a stud who could easily translate for a few years. He might not have had the upside that Vick had, but he didn't have the floor either. Also they wound up settling for Drew Brees

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On 12/15/2018 at 9:15 AM, Gmen said:

I find this particularly funny coming from a Rams fan because the Rams drafted their franchise running back before they drafted their franchise quarterback.  They took Gurley, then a year later they took Goff.  Say what you want about the value of running backs, but the Rams offense wouldn't be nearly as scary without Gurley.

The Giants didn't pass on Andrew Luck or Peyton Manning prospects to take Barkley.  There will be Darnold, Rosen, Allen types of quarterbacks coming along in 2019 and 2020.  When is the next Saquon Barkley going to be available?  I'd guess in the 2034 draft class.

Not remotely the same situation. 

In 2015 there were two clear frontrunners at QB. Mariota and Winston. They were chosen with pick 1 and pick 2. The Rams had pick 10. The next QB drafted was Garrett Grayson by the Saints with pick 75. They weren't drafting him to be a starter. They didn't have an option at QB in that draft. It would have been absolutely foolish to waste a high pick on somebody that nobody believed in.

In 2016, they had the first pick and took the guy who was viewed as the best QB in the draft . 

------

The Giants in 2018 had the number 2 pick. 4 QB's were deemed worthy to go in the top 10. They could have had any of Darnold, Allen, or Rosen. Then Jackson was picked at the end of the round. All 4 QB's that the Giants passed up on in the first round are starting this year and are being groomed as the franchise face of the franchise. This was the richest QB class since 2004 and the Giants weren't facing the prospects of reaching on a guy. The very next pick was the QB viewed as most NFL ready. A couple picks later was the QB with the best arm, and a few picks after that was the guy considered the smartest QB in the draft. 

You're comparing situations that aren't comparable. And you're overselling the 2019 and 2020 draft class. There might be guys who are viewed as good QB's but you aren't going to see that many QB's that are top 10 worthy. It's very likely it will end up like previous drafts where the only worthy QB's go in the top 3 and then the next guy is a reach before the Giants can get them (basically what happened to the Rams in 2015). The Giants had a pretty obvious shot at a franchise QB. Hell, they could have traded up and got Jackson. You aren't going to see a draft class like this for awhile

It really doesn't matter how good Barkley is. His position isn't valuable, he's been playing great all year and the team was still losing, so he isn't the difference maker, and running backs have an incredibly short shelf life in this league

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59 minutes ago, lancerman said:

Barkley's really good but he's not even the best back in the league this year. Gurley is miles ahead of him and Zeke is probably a tier ahead of him. Gurley is ahead of him in yards, yards per game, and TD's. He's not close to a top 2 player in the league. 

Barkley averages half a yard more per carry, half a yard more per reception, has caught 10 more passes, and has more touchdowns than Zeke.  I don't think there's an argument to be made for surrounding talent either. But Zeke is a tier ahead? How does that work? There is absolutely  no reasonable argument for that. Sorry, that's absurd. 

Gurley is having the better season, but some of that can be attributed to volume (give Barkley the extra 30 carries at his typical 5 yards per carry clip, and he has more rushing yards than Gurley) and surrounding cast / better offense (the Rams having scored nearly 150 more points than the Giants through 14 games). Barkley averages more yards per carry, has quite a few more receptions (though Gurley leads in yards per reception). Yeah, Gurley is having the better season (it'd be hard to match the touchdown total for Barkley without being on a really good offense), but some of that is attributable to the team surrounding him and has nothing to do with Gurley himself, and even though I'd give him the nod still, it's certainly not "miles ahead". 

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1 hour ago, lancerman said:

To be fair you said a lot of things befoe the season started like the Packers were sure to have the best record, we were sleeping on the Raiders, and that Myles Garrett was sure to be DPOY. 

Barkley's really good but he's not even the best back in the league this year. Gurley is miles ahead of him and Zeke is probably a tier ahead of him. Gurley is ahead of him in yards, yards per game, and TD's. He's not close to a top 2 player in the league.  

Pre-season predictions and player evaluations ain't the same.  One is trying to predict the future (which is hit or miss for even the most astute football minds).  Remember Tony Romo had the Packers and Jags as his favorites to make the Super Bowl before the season.  Does he not know football?

Player evaluations are different.  I'm evaluating what has already happened.  I'm not trying to forecast the future.  And based on what I've already seen, Saquon Barkley is EASILY the best RB in the NFL.  You can disagree but this is simply my opinion.  I'm not taking any other RB ahead of him.  PERIOD.

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2 hours ago, lancerman said:

Not really because Vick as much of a highlight reel as he was, was not viewed as a traditional QB and there were concerns over whether he'd translate in the NFL

No. This was not a question in 2001. Vick ran a Pro Style offense at Virginia Tech, there was very little question if his ability would translate. 

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3 hours ago, lancerman said:

Also they wound up settling for Drew Brees

Who failed to the point to where they selected Eli Manning in 2004, then traded his rights to NY for Phillip Rivers. 

The Drew Brees they selected at 32 was a bust up until 2004. So the plan of "settling" for Brees actually blew up on them.

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5 hours ago, lancerman said:

It's also a mistake if they turn out to be capable and the Giants can't find a QB the next few years. Lets be very clear, the Giants have talent, there QB play has sucked and that has been a major difference. I'd argue if they had anything resembling competent QB play they'd be in the playoff hunt in their division this year

Just Capable? Nah. 

If im picking you at 2, you better be great. The very least a solidified top 10 QB. 

If any of the QBs end up great and we end up settling for mediocre or solid then yeah.  Except the Giants made that pick because THEY think that they didn’t believe they were getting a bonafide QB. Bare in mind that the Giants had Mayfield clear and cut above the rest. 

The Giants have some nice players but we still got a tonne of holes. We’re not a good run defending team. We struggle to consistently generate pressure and our secondary is very thin. Every team has talent.

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6 hours ago, lancerman said:

Barkley's really good but he's not even the best back in the league this year. Gurley is miles ahead of him and Zeke is probably a tier ahead of him. Gurley is ahead of him in yards, yards per game, and TD's. He's not close to a top 2 player in the league.  

This is nonsense. Gurley has been better statistically with a higher volume on a better offense. But talent-wise? They're neck and neck. 

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8 hours ago, lancerman said:

All 4 QB's that the Giants passed up on in the first round are starting this year and are being groomed as the franchise face of the franchise.

So was every QB ever selected in the first round. That doesn't mean they're going to find NFL success, and that doesn't make the selection of Barkley a lesser pick.

Bottom line, the Giants obviously weren't as comfortable with the QB prospects as they were with a generational talent like Barkley. Regardless of positional value, being forced to pick a prospect they have reservations about - or view as inferior to another prospect - is not something you want as a franchise. It's how teams make mistakes and get set back 3 years. This isn't a race to turn the franchise around. Gettleman wasn't brought in on a one year deal. It's a process. If there truly was a special QB on the board the Giants were smitten with, they would have pulled the trigger. I don't blame them for not pigeon-holding themselves to one position. Also, were making a lot of assumptions here that all 5 first round prospects are going to be franchise cornerstones for 15 years. When some franchises in hindsight could very much regret their decision in 3-4 years time. 

There are QBs in the 2019 draft class, and their are QBs in the 2020 draft class. Their window is not closed to find a franchise QB, and there are no guarantees from this past class. And this is coming from someone who is a big Darnold fan. 

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