Geezy Posted January 8, 2021 Share Posted January 8, 2021 20 hours ago, big_palooka said: And if those high picks don't improve? which is feeling more likely given the fact they were over drafted to begin with. And the Raiders history of developing defensive talent. What then? Optimism with this organization will trick you every time. Every offseason, this fan base will convince themselves the team turned the corner and they get humbled when the games are played. They are closer than the 4-5 win days. But the feel far away from being a legit competitor. Legit as in can compete for the division and a championship. Wild card spots really don't move the needle for me if the team can't compete when they get there. I'm realistic.... Gruden is not a good coach. He's an even worse GM. He will likely hire Bradley or worse, Barry as his DC staying in his network. Either would represent a business as usual hire and again, not move the needle. I'm not trying to be a downer, but as long as Davis owns the organization and Gruden has the keys to the franchise , I don't see anything positive coming down the track right now. I just don't. The coaching, the talent, the draft picks.... it simply isn't coming together i get your pessimism, but what bothers me is that your so quick to crown the Chargers and even the Broncos(without Pat Bowlen) as if they deserve the benefit of doubt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCOUGHMAN Posted January 8, 2021 Share Posted January 8, 2021 33 minutes ago, big_palooka said: They are a LOSING franchise for 2 decades and counting. Players chasing money, might sign. Players chasing championship and winning cultures won't. Simple as that. And when you sign guys who are looking for the biggest payday, you get your Trent Browns of free agency signings. This frfr thank you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry Posted January 8, 2021 Share Posted January 8, 2021 1 minute ago, big_palooka said: They are a LOSING franchise for 2 decades and counting. Players chasing money, might sign. Players chasing championship and winning cultures won't. Simple as that. And when you sign guys who are looking for the biggest payday, you get your Trent Browns of free agency signings. It happens with every team. Players chase money and get fat and lazy. Doesn't mean you should completely avoid FA. Look at D. Booker and N. Agholor. I believe our backup OL were FAs. Kwit has potential for sure. Just have to keep plugging in the pieces and trimming the fat (T. Brown, T. Williams, etc.). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCOUGHMAN Posted January 8, 2021 Share Posted January 8, 2021 4 minutes ago, BackinBlack said: which is why a few weeks back I responded to you that yes I still wanted to make the playoffs. which you laughed at lol. the players you want to sign in FA, go to playoff contenders. Imo in fa good to great players go to whatever situation fits them the best. I can’t see why any great fa would want to come here. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geezy Posted January 8, 2021 Share Posted January 8, 2021 lets just skip FA until we start winning lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BackinBlack Posted January 8, 2021 Share Posted January 8, 2021 1 minute ago, NCOUGHMAN said: Imo in fa good to great players go to whatever situation fits them the best. I can’t see why any great fa would want to come here. haha I agree, because we are still in the fighting for playoffs bracket , whereas top FA talent typically will go to fighting for superbowl. however, Big Cat, I could actually see if (and its a big if) he hits the market. Grew up a Raider fan, and was vocal before draft he wanted to be a raider. probably doesnt impact his decision much, but, a man can dream ha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geezy Posted January 8, 2021 Share Posted January 8, 2021 1 minute ago, NCOUGHMAN said: Imo in fa good to great players go to whatever situation fits them the best. I can’t see why any great fa would want to come here. Byron Jones went to Miami even though they run a different scheme that he was successful in. Lets be real FA for the most part is about cashing in, the real good to great players are retained by the teams that drafted them. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oakdb36 Posted January 8, 2021 Share Posted January 8, 2021 1 minute ago, Geezy said: Byron Jones went to Miami even though they run a different scheme that he was successful in. Lets be real FA for the most part is about cashing in, the real good to great players are retained by the teams that drafted them. Yep. CREAM! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted January 8, 2021 Share Posted January 8, 2021 6 minutes ago, Geezy said: i get your pessimism, but what bothers me is that your so quick to crown the Chargers and even the Broncos(without Pat Bowlen) as if they deserve the benefit of doubt. I'm in no way "crowing" the Broncos or Chargers. Simply acknowlding the fact that they have better overall talent that the Raiders. It's a QB league, I like Herbert going forward more than Carr. Carr more than Lock. But Denver has 5 times the defensive talent the Raiders do currently. My whole point was, the Broncos and Chargers will likely improve as well. The division is only getting tougher and more competitive with a lot of big time talents on all teams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted January 8, 2021 Share Posted January 8, 2021 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Jerry said: It happens with every team. Players chase money and get fat and lazy. Doesn't mean you should completely avoid FA. Look at D. Booker and N. Agholor. I believe our backup OL were FAs. Kwit has potential for sure. Just have to keep plugging in the pieces and trimming the fat (T. Brown, T. Williams, etc.). Look at what? A WR who nobody wanted, who took a 1 year deal to prove his worth. That is a great signing. Low risk, high reward. Signing guys like Nassib an average joe the Browns cut and Bucs made no attempt to bring back to a bloated contract is just bad business. And Kwit has potential for what? He's been in the league 5 years. He's a finished product. Great role player and steady yet unspectacular LB. Don't avoid FA. But make prudent value moves. Stop throwing money in desperation at players who CLEARLY are not going to have a big impact. Edited January 8, 2021 by big_palooka Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted January 8, 2021 Share Posted January 8, 2021 9 minutes ago, Geezy said: Byron Jones went to Miami even though they run a different scheme that he was successful in. Lets be real FA for the most part is about cashing in, the real good to great players are retained by the teams that drafted them. Exactly... which means what? You build through the draft. That is how the best teams are constructed. Then you add the missing parts. The Raiders approach on defense.... constantly missing on draft picks. Forcing them on the field anyway. Signing average players in free agency to large contract. Expecting them to be better than they've actually are in key spots on that defense. The results speak for themselves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oakdb36 Posted January 8, 2021 Share Posted January 8, 2021 1 minute ago, big_palooka said: Signing guys like Nassib an average joe the Browns cut and Bucs made no attempt to bring back to a bloated contract is just bad business. It was the 47th highest contract for an edge. He's PFF 55th graded edge. No need to tell me PFF is trash, this is just for perspective. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humble_Beast Posted January 8, 2021 Share Posted January 8, 2021 30 minutes ago, big_palooka said: Look at what? A WR who nobody wanted, who took a 1 year deal to prove his worth. That is a great signing. Low risk, high reward. Signing guys like Nassib an average joe the Browns cut and Bucs made no attempt to bring back to a bloated contract is just bad business. And Kwit has potential for what? He's been in the league 5 years. He's a finished product. Great role player and steady yet unspectacular LB. Don't avoid FA. But make prudent value moves. Stop throwing money in desperation at players who CLEARLY are not going to have a big impact. LBs play better when the DL is good. Kwit shown he is a solid starter behind a bad DL. We might have had the worst DL in the NFL, Atleast bottom 5. Area we have to target hard, surprised we didn’t last year.. last years off season was horrible Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCOUGHMAN Posted January 8, 2021 Share Posted January 8, 2021 42 minutes ago, Geezy said: Byron Jones went to Miami even though they run a different scheme that he was successful in. Lets be real FA for the most part is about cashing in, the real good to great players are retained by the teams that drafted them. The coach tho imo he liked that situation same with van noy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCOUGHMAN Posted January 8, 2021 Share Posted January 8, 2021 4 minutes ago, Humble_Beast said: LBs play better when the DL is good. Kwit shown he is a solid starter behind a bad DL. We might have had the worst DL in the NFL, Atleast bottom 5. Area we have to target hard, surprised we didn’t last year.. last years off season was horrible Kwit has always been kinda slow imo and that bear defense hid his lack of speed. He’s not a sideline to sideline guy. He seems to be a second behind esp in coverage Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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