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Being born and raised in Sonoma County I heard LOTS of stories with the partying that happened in and around Santa Rosa back in those days. 

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4 hours ago, drfrey13 said:

There is something about this team that does not make sense.  I am leaning towards Gruden being the issue but it is not that clear cut.  I believe overall it is the combination of everyone in control and that is why certain players want to get out of here.  We have what it takes to be a playoff team but I do not know if the pieces come together and that includes the decision makers to stop ignoring glaring problems.

KARMA...When one of your first moves is to trade your defensive MVP you better know what you're doing and it fell apart worse than they thought it would. Trading Carr would be dumb because the picks will be wasted as history suggests. If you're 3 way trading and getting Aaron then it's the only hope and last call before it's over. 

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On 7/20/2021 at 2:19 PM, drfrey13 said:

There is something about this team that does not make sense.  I am leaning towards Gruden being the issue but it is not that clear cut.  I believe overall it is the combination of everyone in control and that is why certain players want to get out of here.  We have what it takes to be a playoff team but I do not know if the pieces come together and that includes the decision makers to stop ignoring glaring problems.

Should've kept JDR and put an emphasis on finding really good coordinators. 

He was just a rah-rah guy, but damn good at it. 

Gruden is a rah-rah guy who thinks and is treated like he's much more. 

We weren't perfect under the last group, but there was a clear pattern in how we were building and who we were building around. Nowadays, it feels like we're just spitballing while hoping to catch lightning in a bottle over and over again. 

 

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12 minutes ago, ronjon1990 said:

Should've kept JDR and put an emphasis on finding really good coordinators. 

He was just a rah-rah guy, but damn good at it. 

Gruden is a rah-rah guy who thinks and is treated like he's much more. 

We weren't perfect under the last group, but there was a clear pattern in how we were building and who we were building around. Nowadays, it feels like we're just spitballing while hoping to catch lightning in a bottle over and over again. 

 

I’m ready to blow the whole thing up but we already did that by getting all those firsts to rebuild with the draft guru himself mike 🤦🏽‍♂️. Playoffs or fire/ trade everyone 

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40 minutes ago, ronjon1990 said:

Should've kept JDR and put an emphasis on finding really good coordinators. 

He was just a rah-rah guy, but damn good at it. 

Gruden is a rah-rah guy who thinks and is treated like he's much more. 

We weren't perfect under the last group, but there was a clear pattern in how we were building and who we were building around. Nowadays, it feels like we're just spitballing while hoping to catch lightning in a bottle over and over again. 

 

I do not disagree about this but the problem was more about the locker room with JDR.  After the WFT game in 2017 his fate was sealed.  Even Davis referenced the issue in an interview.

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13 hours ago, drfrey13 said:

I do not disagree about this but the problem was more about the locker room with JDR.  After the WFT game in 2017 his fate was sealed.  Even Davis referenced the issue in an interview.

Playing the what if game imagined if we kept Mack over carr. My son said that’s where we failed. Traded away a future hof and kept a top 13 qb. 

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15 minutes ago, NCOUGHMAN said:

Playing the what if game imagined if we kept Mack over carr. My son said that’s where we failed. Traded away a future hof and kept a top 13 qb. 

agreed here, MAck should have been the priority. 
It is frustrating hearing Carr saying he set his contract up in a way to make sure Mack could stay with the team

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30 minutes ago, BackinBlack said:

agreed here, MAck should have been the priority. 
It is frustrating hearing Carr saying he set his contract up in a way to make sure Mack could stay with the team

Yea what does carr exactly mean by that cause we traded coop too. 

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On 7/20/2021 at 4:54 PM, G said:

KARMA...When one of your first moves is to trade your defensive MVP you better know what you're doing and it fell apart worse than they thought it would. Trading Carr would be dumb because the picks will be wasted as history suggests. If you're 3 way trading and getting Aaron then it's the only hope and last call before it's over. 

Karma also was getting rid of wiz for Hudson imo 

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I think the real issue was signing Gruden who brought Cable with him.  We could have traded Mack and still came out on top.  It was the choices Gruden made with those assets that lead to this team losing the trade.  This team is really bad at getting good value and when they do they just throw it away.  Having a HC with as much say as Gruden does almost never works out.  I can not remember where I heard it but somebody with strong NFL ties was saying Gruden changes his mind all the time and that could very easily lead to problems.  I did not want to trade Mack but we got enough value and cap space to win the trade.  Instead we blew it and the cap space.

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55 minutes ago, NCOUGHMAN said:

Karma also was getting rid of wiz for Hudson imo 

I'd take Hudson every time but Wiz I felt is a fine interior back up.

Carr's contract wasn't the problem, I'd say it was Jackson's and waiting too long. Carr and Mack could have been locked up together or pretty close to the same time frame. Never thought Mack would get that kind of money. Thought a hair above Von's would have done it when we signed Jackson. Cooper I thought would be great in Vegas because no drama and had we not be a hot pile of feces after trading Mack I think Cooper would have worked out but after the season from HELL where player's were obviously giving up under the 100 million dollar man getting his but the Defensive leader being shipped off to get paid elsewhere. I'd trade Coop for a first every time in that situation. 

We will never know what 'could' have happened because it didn't but we've seen the mess it's lead to and I agree with you. If we don't make the playoffs then blow the whole thing up and give Gruden new toys to mold or ruin. Were stuck with the coach formerly known as 'Chucky' but dude needs to get the hunger back as he looks like life has been too easy for him to be what he once was. 

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38 minutes ago, G said:

I'd take Hudson every time but Wiz I felt is a fine interior back up.

Carr's contract wasn't the problem, I'd say it was Jackson's and waiting too long. Carr and Mack could have been locked up together or pretty close to the same time frame. Never thought Mack would get that kind of money. Thought a hair above Von's would have done it when we signed Jackson. Cooper I thought would be great in Vegas because no drama and had we not be a hot pile of feces after trading Mack I think Cooper would have worked out but after the season from HELL where player's were obviously giving up under the 100 million dollar man getting his but the Defensive leader being shipped off to get paid elsewhere. I'd trade Coop for a first every time in that situation. 

We will never know what 'could' have happened because it didn't but we've seen the mess it's lead to and I agree with you. If we don't make the playoffs then blow the whole thing up and give Gruden new toys to mold or ruin. Were stuck with the coach formerly known as 'Chucky' but dude needs to get the hunger back as he looks like life has been too easy for him to be what he once was. 

Blow up means fire gruden too lol and mike they’ve had enough time and resources to get us right. 
 

for the amount we gave Hudson I’d rather stuck with wiz. 

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4 minutes ago, NCOUGHMAN said:

Blow up means fire gruden too lol and mike they’ve had enough time and resources to get us right.

This. 

We've used up the excess resource boon we got and we're almost 1/2 way through Gruden''s deal and still talking about "maybe we can sneak in as the expanded consolation 7th seed" and hoping we can hang as the 2nd best team in the division while hoping Denver doesn't find a QB and relegate us to 4th. 

Many HCs have been let go for less. 

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3 hours ago, NCOUGHMAN said:

Playing the what if game imagined if we kept Mack over carr. My son said that’s where we failed. Traded away a future hof and kept a top 13 qb. 

How's Mack doing in Chicago without a QB?

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