AlexGreen#20 Posted December 27, 2018 Share Posted December 27, 2018 On 12/24/2018 at 9:33 PM, pacman5252 said: Anyone with 2 eyes knows Grahm is an overpaid shell of his former self. The point is it doesn’t matter that he’s top whatever in yards for a TE. He is being paid to be a wide out (he’s even argued he’s one in the past). He was brought in to make an impact in the passing game. He’s been inconsistent, and 58th in yards, making 10m doing so. You could argue that the passing game would have gotten to a similar net spot rehashing Jordy and Richard Rodgers another year. You are what the defense says you are. So long as Graham and 3 WRs is seeing Nickel defenses, he's a TE. If that switches to Dime defenses, he's a WR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexGreen#20 Posted December 27, 2018 Share Posted December 27, 2018 16 hours ago, Acrid Josher said: If you're the kinda person that bangs the table for free agency and you also think the Jimmy Graham signing was a bust you have a wildly unrealistic idea of free agency. This post probably has my vote for post of the year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vegas492 Posted December 27, 2018 Share Posted December 27, 2018 I wasn't for the Graham signing at the time. Too much money. But as stated, that's life in free agency. I don't believe, for a second, than anyone thought GB was getting the Saints version of Graham. He isn't that anymore. I was hoping for better red zone production too. Those fade/jump balls should be easy wins for him. And they aren't. Feet get tangled, no real lift, no real box out. That has been disappointing this year. That being said, he's surpassed what I thought he would bring in regards to drawing defensive attention. That is what a lot of fans don't see. Guys getting open because Graham draws coverage. I like that about him. I also like that he isn't a quitter. Despite that compensation....he needs to come back. And I believe that he will build his numbers in year 2. That is a much better option than letting him go at this point. And...I'm as big a Tonyan guy as there is out there...and even I know that he doesn't being a Graham dynamic to the offense. Not yet. The best thing to do is to actually develop Tonyan as a compliment to Graham next year. Then after next year, you decide if Graham is worth it any longer. I think Tonyan adds a lot of athletic ability to the TE position, but he is transitioning into a tight end (from WR...and QB). Kid has a lot of learning to do. Graham is a great veteran to show him the ropes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skibrett15 Posted December 27, 2018 Share Posted December 27, 2018 the issue isn't graham the productive TE, it's graham as the #2 passing game option. The #2 passing game option cannot be this level of production. He was overtaken by the rookie WRs and Allison. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mox Posted December 27, 2018 Share Posted December 27, 2018 My issue with Graham is he looks slow as hell. His athleticism has completely diminished. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victor1124 Posted December 27, 2018 Share Posted December 27, 2018 On 12/26/2018 at 5:35 PM, Acrid Josher said: If you're the kinda person that bangs the table for free agency and you also think the Jimmy Graham signing was a bust you have a wildly unrealistic idea of free agency. It is "wildly unrealistic" to expect your front office to sign quality free agents to good deals? I understand free agency can be unpredictable and paying market value but the Jimmy Graham deal looked like a desperate bad deal from the beginning.There was hope that with his size and length, as well as playing with Rodgers he would be a great redzone threat and the missing piece to the offense. In reality, he was an aging, inconsistent tight end, that isn't very physical, doesn't have great hands, and who also struggles getting separation. These things were known before making him the highest paid TE in the league. Higher priced contracts naturally get more scrutiny as well. I am not someone who bangs the table for big time free agent signings but I am not sure I am understanding why it is "wildly unrealistic" for someone to want to the Packers to sign free agents while at the same time acknowledging when a signing ends up being a bust or in Jimmy Grahams case, was likely to be a bust from the beginning, especially for the contract he received. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannondale Posted December 27, 2018 Share Posted December 27, 2018 I guess I was expecting more than a rich man's Richard Rodgers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kepler Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 Worse **** talkers than my grandma's sewing circle. I don't care what you guys think of Graham, he has a broken thumb and had to "gain AR's trust", because that's an extra hoop to jump through at GB. How bout AR and his contract? We all hypocritically good there though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacReady Posted December 28, 2018 Author Share Posted December 28, 2018 7 minutes ago, Kepler said: How bout AR and his contract? We all hypocritically good there though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pacman5252 Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 10 hours ago, AlexGreen#20 said: You are what the defense says you are. So long as Graham and 3 WRs is seeing Nickel defenses, he's a TE. If that switches to Dime defenses, he's a WR. It should be concerning that teams don't need to treat him as one. Jimmy's WR-like ability earlier in his career is why he got paid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannondale Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 What does Rodgers contract have to do with Graham's ? Weak. I guess that's what you do when you got nothing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexGreen#20 Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 1 hour ago, pacman5252 said: It should be concerning that teams don't need to treat him as one. Jimmy's WR-like ability earlier in his career is why he got paid. That's the beauty of Jimmy Graham, in theory. He's a good enough blocker that he can beat up on 200lb CBs and most safeties. He's a good enough receiving target that he can get open on 240lb LBs and most safeties. You have to pick your poison if you're a defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incognito_man Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 12 hours ago, AlexGreen#20 said: On 12/26/2018 at 5:35 PM, Acrid Josher said: If you're the kinda person that bangs the table for free agency and you also think the Jimmy Graham signing was a bust you have a wildly unrealistic idea of free agency. This post probably has my vote for post of the year. yup winner's dilemma Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pugger Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 1 hour ago, cannondale said: What does Rodgers contract have to do with Graham's ? Weak. I guess that's what you do when you got nothing I was wondering the same thing... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikemike778 Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 On 26/12/2018 at 11:35 PM, Acrid Josher said: If you're the kinda person that bangs the table for free agency and you also think the Jimmy Graham signing was a bust you have a wildly unrealistic idea of free agency. Yep with free agency you normally have to go with Top talent players on their second contract - who will cost crazy amount Older players who realistically will be more injury prone and are likely to regress Fill in players Personally if you paying decent money, I would always want to go with the first category. Ultimately its the problem with the draft strategy. If you use all your picks on defence then you have to make up for it somehow so our hands were tied. We had to try and get some sort of top end TE. Graham is OK - he is a bad contract but you pretty much have to put up with it. You can't just keep plugging in new FA Tight Ends every year and expect cohesion. We really need to draft a TE early this year (and early doesn't mean 5th round after picking multiple defensive backs as per usual). If you go with something like Graham, Hendricks, Draft Pick, Tonyan then you are hopefully well positioned to bin Graham this time next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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