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Outpost31

Stick with #1 Overall or Trade Down?

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I feel like the Cardinals need a lot more than just the first overall pick and that you'd be better off trading down and picking up a Browns for Wentz style haul to really put a team around Rosen and see if he can be the one. 

What do all 7 of you Cardinals fans think? 

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Only trading with Oakland makes sense.  The Giants/Jags are too far down to still get an elite talent.  Tampa is on the edge.  

If Gruden offers their FRP in 2020 plus one of their late FRP’s this year I think we’d be dumb not to strongly consider taking it.  Bosa is the #1 guy but there’s not a significant gap between #1 and #2 at this point.  In February we’ll know more.

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I could not tell you. The idea of Bosa and Jones coming off the edge is really appealing to me. But we have a lot more pressing needs so it would make sense to trade down. I'm not sure how far, or who for. Your guess is as good as mine though. I feel like it should be kind of hard to mess up, but we might find a way. 

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On 12/28/2018 at 12:05 PM, Outpost31 said:

I feel like the Cardinals need a lot more than just the first overall pick and that you'd be better off trading down and picking up a Browns for Wentz style haul to really put a team around Rosen and see if he can be the one. 

What do all 7 of you Cardinals fans think? 

Wentz is a QB, though.  What QB in this draft is going to go #1 or #2 overall?  Are there even any blue chip QB prospects?  Trading two first round picks is a pretty hefty price for a non-QB.

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What I would want to do in a trade back situation is grab the Raider's first and last 1st rounders this year 

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On 12/28/2018 at 12:05 PM, Outpost31 said:

I feel like the Cardinals need a lot more than just the first overall pick and that you'd be better off trading down and picking up a Browns for Wentz style haul to really put a team around Rosen and see if he can be the one. 

What do all 7 of you Cardinals fans think? 

Whose going to give you that kind of haul?  Especially in a weak QB class.  Right now, you have the Giants, Jaguars, and Broncos as the only teams in the top 10 who are in the market for QB, and the cost to move up would probably be exponentially cheaper to move up to say 3 than 1.  And for Arizona, you're not dropping to a tier or two lower.  In an ideal world, you'd get Oakland to make the jump up to 1, but that'd essentially cancel out the Khalil Mack deal.

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10 hours ago, CWood21 said:

Whose going to give you that kind of haul?  Especially in a weak QB class.  Right now, you have the Giants, Jaguars, and Broncos as the only teams in the top 10 who are in the market for QB, and the cost to move up would probably be exponentially cheaper to move up to say 3 than 1.  And for Arizona, you're not dropping to a tier or two lower.  In an ideal world, you'd get Oakland to make the jump up to 1, but that'd essentially cancel out the Khalil Mack deal.

Wouldn't cancel out the Mack deal as they still have another first next year, then I think two more picks. I see what you mean though. We're not going to get someone to pony up a Wentz package, that's naive to think. But I think Raiders+Bears first rounder is feasible and makes a lot of sense for both sides. They need a pass rusher in the worst way, and Bosa fits the bill perfectly. We fall back just a few steps and land a player who probably fills our needs a little more. IE Oliver, Williams whoever and add a late first. It's not a mega deal we should be looking for, it's the right one.  

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8 hours ago, LuckyNumber11 said:

Wouldn't cancel out the Mack deal as they still have another first next year, then I think two more picks. I see what you mean though. We're not going to get someone to pony up a Wentz package, that's naive to think. But I think Raiders+Bears first rounder is feasible and makes a lot of sense for both sides. They need a pass rusher in the worst way, and Bosa fits the bill perfectly. We fall back just a few steps and land a player who probably fills our needs a little more. IE Oliver, Williams whoever and add a late first. It's not a mega deal we should be looking for, it's the right one.  

Well, the picks next year are only a swap of 1st and 2nd - given where the bears and raiders are at, it's reasonable to assume that this will only mean they are getting about a 10 pick jump in the drafting order. The other pick was also a flip (Bears third for the Raiders fifth), which will probably be a 40-50 pick jump in the middle rounds. They aren't getting an extra pick or anything - just jumping up the order a little for 2020. So if they move the Bears first round pick, the Mack trade essentially is: Mack for Bosa / swap of 1st & 2nd in 2020 / swap of 3rd and 5th in 2020 / 2019 6th rounder. Optically, I think that's a crap look for the Raiders, but if they are that sold on Bosa, I think that they should be willing to make the move. The trade for Mack is already done and over, they can't take it back now. And from the Cards standpoint, I agree that is the ideal solution if they could get that to happen. 

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Not moving down with Oakland unless they’re taking Haskins.  Otherwise you’re not guaranteed one of the three elite DL’s at 4.  Not taking a OT that high.

Personally i’d be thrilled with Bosa at #1 so anything less than: #4, 20’ FRP and the higher of DAL/CHI and they can keep walking.

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48 minutes ago, DirtyDez said:

Not moving down with Oakland unless they’re taking Haskins.  Otherwise you’re not guaranteed one of the three elite DL’s at 4.  Not taking a OT that high.

Personally i’d be thrilled with Bosa at #1 so anything less than: #4, 20’ FRP and the higher of DAL/CHI and they can keep walking.

But what if the pick is Williams? Would you rather him than a lighter trade than the one you are proposing? 

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I'd love Bosa too, I'm just not sure if we take him at 1. Which is frustrating as I think he's head and shoulders above everyone else. 

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This will be an incredibly important draft for the Cardinals. They need to maximize having the number 1 overall pick and upgrade talent in several areas. Now that I’ve stated the obvious, I think it is in the best interest of the team to trade out of the pick and net the best deal possible. Nick Bosa is going to follow right behind his brother and be a beast edge rusher. Unfortunately that is luxury pick that is not going to help fix the major issues on this team. We need a dominant defensive tackle or corner to strengthen the defense and a lot of help on offense. I’d like a Scenario where we get Oliver and Metcalf in the first 2 rounds. I believe the team should draft a QB in the early rounds to groom if Rosen fails to develop. 

So I believe trading down is the best option and will give us greater return than drafting Bosa. 

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I'd love to see Bosa in Arizona but doesn't Rosen need some help too? I figured you guys would be open to moving down for maybe even slightly less than market value if it means you can plug some holes in the OL and get some more weapons faster

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At least the option for moving down just improved with Haskins declaring. 

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Of course you want to improve the offense, but the top 5 is defense heavy. Could we give up a little bit of a bargain for the first? Yeah we could, but to have Bosa and Jones coming off the edge is so much more appealing than that. 

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