Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Counselor

Von’s Trade Value

Recommended Posts

30 years old with a big contract. What do you perceive to be his trade value?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If they were going to trade him, they should have done it two seasons ago when we still could have received a kings ransom for him. As is, he's worth far more to us as a player then he is in trade value. But since we're on the topic, how about this. Von and Keenum to to Minnesota for Cousins, their first rounder this year, and next year's second and 3rd. Then, Joe Ellis crawls under a rock somewhere and lets Elway bring back Shanahan. Kubiak as OC. IF we were going to trade Von, that would be the only scenario I see that wouldn't piss me off. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, 1234567 said:

If they were going to trade him, they should have done it two seasons ago when we still could have received a kings ransom for him. As is, he's worth far more to us as a player then he is in trade value. But since we're on the topic, how about this. Von and Keenum to to Minnesota for Cousins, their first rounder this year, and next year's second and 3rd. Then, Joe Ellis crawls under a rock somewhere and lets Elway bring back Shanahan. Kubiak as OC. IF we were going to trade Von, that would be the only scenario I see that wouldn't piss me off. 

I agree with the timing and all that but the rumors are out there so just trying to see what people thought. Thanks for the post

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, his backloaded contract probably makes that a lot more realistic in terms of value. I think he still has another 2-3 seasons of elite play mostly because he doesn't rack up a lot of tackles and doesn't take a whole lot of damage. But it's hard to argue that point when other teams can simply say "yeah, but he's 30."  So I guess his value to me would depend on which team traded for him. A team that was loaded with young talent and was in serious win now mode would probably be more inclined to give up some serious draft real estate. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, 1234567 said:

Yeah, his backloaded contract probably makes that a lot more realistic in terms of value. I think he still has another 2-3 seasons of elite play mostly because he doesn't rack up a lot of tackles and doesn't take a whole lot of damage. But it's hard to argue that point when other teams can simply say "yeah, but he's 30."  So I guess his value to me would depend on which team traded for him. A team that was loaded with young talent and was in serious win now mode would probably be more inclined to give up some serious draft real estate. 

Realistically I could see GB’s late first from NO and a 2020 4th. Then move ten down for a an early second this year and a first in 2020 if they can. To have ammo for a QB. Pipe dream I know. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Is there a reason why NFL teams don’t try to weaponize their cap space like other leagues do (besides less guaranteed money)? If you took on some bad money from a contender in a Von deal (which wouldn’t have nearly the negative value to us as it does them), why couldn’t you ask for a pair of 1st’s? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, broncosfan_101 said:

Is there a reason why NFL teams don’t try to weaponize their cap space like other leagues do (besides less guaranteed money)? If you took on some bad money from a contender in a Von deal (which wouldn’t have nearly the negative value to us as it does them), why couldn’t you ask for a pair of 1st’s? 

I thought when Cleveland did it with Brock it was such a good move but it’s literally the only Time I remember it happening

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
42 minutes ago, broncosfan_101 said:

Is there a reason why NFL teams don’t try to weaponize their cap space like other leagues do (besides less guaranteed money)? If you took on some bad money from a contender in a Von deal (which wouldn’t have nearly the negative value to us as it does them), why couldn’t you ask for a pair of 1st’s? 

Pretty interesting idea.

The market for Von wouldn't be large but I can't imagine a contender wouldn't want to have him on the payroll for the Conf Championship or SB. The two of those he's been in he's played the best defensive games of his life and two of the best I've ever seen. Get him to those two games and he can take them over. I think he just needs that stage to really turn it on.

Can you imagine the Saints with Von on the roster? Anyway, if we picked up his bonuses for two years he'd definitely be worth two firsts. He's one of a kind when he turns it on. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'd assume his value is somewhere in the realm of what the Raiders got for Mack.  The argument being that Von is much more the face of a franchise than Mack and Von has a better track record in playing in big games and succeeding in them. 

The trade to Minnesota makes sense, but would you really want Cousins now?  He was supposed to be the X factor that Keenum wasn't to get them to the Super Bowl and yet they missed the playoffs; they should have kept Keenum who had chemistry and success there.  

If the Broncos trade Von, and if it isn't for two or three draft picks, then I'd go Von for Stafford in Detroit, because have large contracts (trade a contract for a contract).  And, I'd ask that they throw their 1st rd pick this year.  And, I'd use that Detroit pick on the best OLB in the draft to replace Von.  I don't think you replace Von with Barrett...Barrett is a great supplemental, backup, guy...and we should resign him.  But, he isn't a starter.  

If you could get Stafford.  The best OLB in the draft with the Detroit pick, plus our #1 pick to use on an offensive lineman or a CB (baker would be my bet)...then I might be on board with this.  

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, jsthomp2007 said:

I'd assume his value is somewhere in the realm of what the Raiders got for Mack.  The argument being that Von is much more the face of a franchise than Mack and Von has a better track record in playing in big games and succeeding in them. 

The trade to Minnesota makes sense, but would you really want Cousins now?  He was supposed to be the X factor that Keenum wasn't to get them to the Super Bowl and yet they missed the playoffs; they should have kept Keenum who had chemistry and success there.  

If the Broncos trade Von, and if it isn't for two or three draft picks, then I'd go Von for Stafford in Detroit, because have large contracts (trade a contract for a contract).  And, I'd ask that they throw their 1st rd pick this year.  And, I'd use that Detroit pick on the best OLB in the draft to replace Von.  I don't think you replace Von with Barrett...Barrett is a great supplemental, backup, guy...and we should resign him.  But, he isn't a starter.  

If you could get Stafford.  The best OLB in the draft with the Detroit pick, plus our #1 pick to use on an offensive lineman or a CB (baker would be my bet)...then I might be on board with this.  

 

My ideal trade with Von would be to a team like the steelers. Idk what the total package would look like but he'd bring leadership to that d.

That's also a team imo who have the highest chance of a contender to bust out in 2020 older qb lots of dysfunction.  

I know the niners always start hunt we could get a nice haul from them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

^^^what would the Steelers have to offer?  They have low draft picks, unless you get AB in return, but who wants that mess?  And, let's say the Broncos turn things around and you face the Steelers in the playoffs and you have to face a Von with an agenda...we'd get our a$$es kicked.  

You need to select teams that have something to offer and won't hurt you in the big scheme of things.  The Niners would be a better idea.  They have higher draft picks and things we might need like a lineman or a CB.  I think for Von you get more than just picks, you gotta get a proven player.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, jsthomp2007 said:

^^^what would the Steelers have to offer?  They have low draft picks, unless you get AB in return, but who wants that mess?  And, let's say the Broncos turn things around and you face the Steelers in the playoffs and you have to face a Von with an agenda...we'd get our a$$es kicked.  

You need to select teams that have something to offer and won't hurt you in the big scheme of things.  The Niners would be a better idea.  They have higher draft picks and things we might need like a lineman or a CB.  I think for Von you get more than just picks, you gotta get a proven player.  

If the Steelers offered 2020s first and other stuff I'd listen same as greenbay. The thought is these are two  teams whos overall talent level is erroding. They get hype every year due to past success rightfully so. But I could see either team collapsing next year into top 5 picks. 

This team isn't doing anything in 2019 even with Von so a couple of nice assets make sense to me in order to land a franchise qb and build the team again.

But san fran does have a nice draft spot and loves to star hunt. 

Edited by thebestever6

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

WTF...Why on earth are we trading Von? I’d rather get rid of Elway. What has Elway done for us lately? Von Miller is the face of the franchise. F Elway

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, The Helicopter said:

WTF...Why on earth are we trading Von? I’d rather get rid of Elway. What has Elway done for us lately? Von Miller is the face of the franchise. F Elway

Well I don't disagree that Von's performance has been better than Elway's the last 2 years lol. I think the reality is that if we are rebuilding, then no one should be considered untradeable.   I mean, let's face it, no one is giving us much for Elway.  ¬¬    Still, if we aren't going to contend until, say, 2021, then getting an absolute haul could in fact help us be better then...albeit make us much worse now.  So it's a matter of whether the future return is worth the hit now, or the chance of decreased production at fairly high cost when we are good enough to contend.

But, dudes, it also isn't the time to sell at a perceived market value - Von's entering his age-30 year with an elite, generational skill set and track record, and no history of injury.  His style of play and skill set age quite well - expecting peak performance at age 30-32 is actually a very reasonable proposition.   

Mack's return should be the absolute floor.  Yes, I know Mack is 25 - but he also was holding out, with only 1 last year left, and taking away all of OAK's leverage, who were desperate to deal him.   And the team trading for him had to sign him to just under 24M a year.   Von costs 17-18M a year for 3 years for any team acquiring him.  That's a huge gain in cap health.    As Von's skill set hasn't exhibited any signs of imminent decline,  an All-Pro, generational talent at below-market prices with 3 years of security is worth far more than a late 1st. 

Given we don't have any pressing timeline, we have cap health again, and Von's not in anywhere close to decline phase - Elway shouldn't even bother returning calls unless 2 1st round picks are in the equation, and if it's a contender, additional Day 2 returns.   And none of this 1st-for-2nd business, either - we can return a 3rd for 1st.    The difference is that we aren't in a must-sell position yet.    Now, if we are in 2019's offseason, and we're still not close to contention, then we've got to start lowering expectations.   But with Von at peak and 3 years left, it has to be an OMG-Elway-can't turn that down type offer.   And frankly, a late 1st isn't even close to cutting that.   I say the above as a guy who's always held we should cut bait / sell on players at risk of declining production 1 year too early rather than 1 year too late.   We're just not at that stage yet with Von IMO.

I think it's far more likely nothing happens this year.  I think next offseason, it's a very real scenario.  But if this year is a thing, Elway is right to aim very high, well beyond what's being discussed here.

Edited by Broncofan

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  



×